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Does anyone have any experience with the Sudnow method? It appears to address popular piano technique, as opposed to classical. I'm wondering if it would be a useful complement to my more traditional piano lessons.

www.sudnow.com

Hi. I took Dr. Sudnow's seminar in Dallas the last weekend in September 2004. I had never played before and I'm 42 and very willing to learn. I can recommend his course very highly. It approaches learning in a very practical way. I'm already working on my second song and feel very satisfied. I'm really learning.

You can also do a search for more comments in this forum. Just search Sudnow.

Enjoy,

from what i can tell on the web site it looks like it is simular to scott houstons way of teaching but is a lot more detailed and takes it to another level . its something that i think that i will like

I just looked at it.. hey.. $44 is just a couple weekly lessons. What the heck.

I asked my teacher about this guy and he said of all of the methods he has seen this is by far the worst! Don't waist your money!

Well.. ya gotta remember you are asking a teacher whether or not he likes a guy who stands to put him out of business.

I did say that very thing to him and his response was simple. I have a waiting list for new students and the people that are interested in that type of method are not likely to be my students anyway. He did say that there are several self teaching methods that he has seen that are far superior to Sudnow. He wasn't being negative as to self teaching in general he just had a good amount of knowledge of this method and felt it was a poor use of time and energy for someone that was interested in learning piano. Also that they would probably not last very long before they either quit altogether or hopefully found a better source.

Sorry my previous post was kind of short and may have seamed too negative. Just trying to pass on some info. that I would like to know if I was considering the same.

Good luck and keep a song in your heart.

"He did say that there are several self teaching methods that he has seen that are far superior to Sudnow."

Frank, what *would* your teacher recommend for those interested in Sudnow's methods?

I'll ask for a referral and pass it along.

Just got this back from my teacher. I'm sure not everyone will agree with his view on self teaching. I am sure there are some people that can do it but I agree with his assessment in general. Here is his response:

"So-called "self-teaching" methods all ultimately fail unless the person
doing them already has a strong musical background with another musical
instrument. With this background, you will never know how to fix what's
broken without a point of reference. Even with previous music
experience it can be very tricky!

The Ann Collins books seem to be the best so far. All the others I've
seen are so illogically laid out as to be somewhat useless overall. Try
here for a description:

http://www.alfred.com/span_webcat/item_detail.cfm?pub=0&item=199

http://www.alfred.com/span_webcat/item_detail.cfm?pub=0&item=18785

These books are more or less the same as what I base all of my pop/jazz
teaching on."

Hope this helps.

Just a different perspective.

Some prior preparation with the basics probably would have been helpful too.

i am using a simular method and all i can say is that i had never sat down at a piano and in 3 days i was playing "i can't stop loving you" though far from being good the few people that heard me knew what i was playing . this whole forum seems to be stuck on conventional teaching why spend untold hours going plunky plunk when in a fairly short time you could be playing real music . this thing does take pratice and lots of it but if you are wanting to play popular music and have the determination i think this method will work

markb,

The type of music you want to play should dictate the methos of teaching. If your goal is to play classical music from full notation, then classical training is the only approach. It is a long, difficult but extremely rewarding venture.

If your goal is to play pop (everything else besides classical) then the classical approach will work but it is NOT the only way and is definately not the shortest path. Some would say that this is the difference between playing piano and playing keyboard.

The method you are looking at is geared towards arranger keyboards where accompinaments are played given cues by the left hand chords while the right hand is playing the melody. This style of music uses lead sheets (fake books) where the melody (right hand) is given in music notation, while the left hand is shown using chord symbols.

By learning to read just the treble cleff and a few chords, the average person can be playing a huge volume of pop music quite well in a very short period of time (as compared to years it takes to learn to play classical)

Once you learn the chord symbols and their fingering, then you can start to experiment with color chords, alternative fingerings, and bass patterns and arpeggios to give your pop pieces more depth but this is just icing on the cake and comes with time.

First evaluate your goals and then decide on the correct approach. I personally do both as I want to be able to play all kinds of music.

Rodney

Luis,

I went away and came back to read your post again. This is an adult forum, and your post is both ill-informed and insulting. You denigrate the aspirations and the efforts of those of us who have chosen the traditional path as well as those who teach us.

The fast methods are fine if you want to play popular music and are unconcerned about sight reading. Nothing wrong with that at all. But bear in mind you're not going to be able to play the multi-voice complexities of the world's most beautiful and enduring music.

If you want to play classical you need to put in the hours, and it is a wonderful journey. At 3 years in I'm pretty typical on here and I'm playing Chopin, Satie, Mozart, Rimsky-Korsakov, Debussy, etc. At 3 months I was playing The Entertainer, not middle C.

We're doing a little better than Hi in Chinese, Luis. Maybe you're just a slow learner.

Luis,

I think your comments about piano teachers is VERY misleading and quite frankly insulting. No teacher would deliberately follow a method that would hold a student back or take longer than required.

As I said in my prior post, the style of teaching is directly related to the style of playing. This is the very first aspect of selecting a piano teacher. If you understand your goals, then you are half-way there. I suspect that most piano teachers assume that a student wants to learn to play classical music (after all you are going for piano lessons and not keyboard lessons). That said, there are many teachers that can instruct on playing POP keyboard from lead sheets, or Jazz comping or improvisation or any other style of playing that you can think of.

It sounds like you had a bad experience with a piano teacher which was likely caused by YOU not being clear with him/her on your goals / style of playing. That's not to say that all piano teachers are good because they're not, but they're not all bad either.

Rodney

Rodney,

Thanks for your objective and informative response. My problem is I'd love to be able to play classical and pop, but I realistically don't have time to adequately devote to both. In fact, I don't have as much time as I'd like to devote to just one style. Still, I was hoping to get some insight on the possiblity of "majoring" in one style while "minoring" in another.

I plan to continue my piano lessons for now, as I can gain skill and knowledge presumably applicable to both styles. However, I wouldn't mind having a method for pop music that I could work on my own, at my own pace. I just don't want to waste time and money on an ineffective method or something that doesn't go beyond what I already know, which is playing left hand chords/right hand melody for fairly simple tunes. This is fine for either playing by myself (I can't sing well, so I let the piano sing the melody) or at a very basic form for other people. But, this doesn't really address accompanying other musicians or singers in the popular style.

I bought a book from Berklee College of Music which addresses playing keyboards in a band, but it assumes a level of skill that I don't yet have. I'd like a more step-by-step method.

You mentioned that there are shorter ways, other than traditional, classical lessons, to reach this goal. I was hoping you could provide more information.

Thanks!

My comments were not intended to degrade any teachers. I've been an instructor for years in other fields and highly respect educators. I used a little exaggeration to point out that there is more than one set way of learning. Not everything works for everybody.
I didn't appreciate the comment about a specific method (SUDNOW) been the worst there is when that is not correct.
Just enjoy learning however you do it and be open minded enough to see that SUDNOW works for many.
Some people can't spend money on weekly lessons and can still learn.
Piano is fun and gratifying. ENJOY IT.

i agree that there are many ways of learning, and both of the following statements are true:

- "some people don't need a teacher to learn to play piano."
- "many people need a teacher to learn to play piano."

Luis,

Your own words:

"Thousands of people have started learning using his method that goes directly into playing and not a mini step by step learn how to play C in three months approach. That's how teachers make their living so they need to extend as long as feasible."

If your statement that teachers make their money by shortchanging the students on an ongoing basis does not seem degrading to you, you have no command of the English language.

Rather than trying to weasel out by calling it 'a little exaggeration' and feigning indignation at someone's comment on Sudnow, you would be better off to simply apologize.