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#1028853 - 10/21/07 09:54 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
Piano Again Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/12/04
Posts: 1162
Loc: Washington metro
I'd like to try 25/7.
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#1028854 - 10/21/07 10:21 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
gerg Offline
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Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1651
Loc: Houston, TX
PA, I was hoping you'd make an appearance here, and what an appropriate piece for you! ;\)

It is assigned.
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#1028855 - 10/21/07 10:29 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
playadom Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/21/06
Posts: 1366
Loc: New Jersey
 Quote:
Originally posted by gerg:
PA, I was hoping you'd make an appearance here, and what an appropriate piece for you! ;\)

It is assigned. [/b]
Yes! It's very appropriate for you.
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Practice makes permanent - Perfect practice makes perfect.

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#1028856 - 10/21/07 10:30 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
LiszThalberg Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/13/06
Posts: 3288
No one's picked Op. 10 No. 5 yet?!?!
This might help: The correct way of playing the black key etude....


By the way are we doing the 3 etudes that arn't part of the Op. 10 and 25?

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#1028857 - 10/21/07 11:17 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
-Frycek Online   confused
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5921
Loc: SC Mountains
 Quote:
Originally posted by Debussy20:


By the way are we doing the 3 etudes that arn't part of the Op. 10 and 25? [/b]
I suppose if anyone picks them we are.
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#1028858 - 10/22/07 12:01 AM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
YD Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 590
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
 Quote:
Originally posted by Debussy20:
YD: I have always hated scales and loved arps! I started this a little while ago and I've about got the first 1/5 up to speed and memorized. The rest needs some work... \:D Getting everything even and up to speed may be a challenge!

Matt [/b]
I'm OK with arpeggios; the problem with 10/1 for me is that they are extremely wide and the right hand gets stretched a lot. With my hand problems, this start to hurt pretty quickly. Hopefully, this is not a problem for you. Regardless, 10/1 is, IMHO, the hardest of them all; I believe Horowitz actually said that he cannot play it properly. He played with flat fingers though, which would certainly clash with wide arpeggios, so you may do better that he :-)

BTW; what's that talk about Winter Wind difficulty? I mean, yeah, it is difficult as many of them are, but except high speed (equivalent to quarter = 207, considering 6-tuplets), I don't see is as much different from 10/12 (right hand instead of left, of course); besides, I have heard numerous concert pianists play it slower than that, some as slow as ~180 (to my ear), and it sounds just fine at that speed. I mean, yeah, it's a lot of work, but other than that, what do you all perceive as the greatest difficulty there?
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Yuri
FWIW; YMMV

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#1028859 - 10/22/07 12:16 AM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
YD Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 590
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
 Quote:
Originally posted by Debussy20:
No one's picked Op. 10 No. 5 yet?!?!
This might help: The correct way of playing the black key etude....
[/b]
Well well, nothing surprising here. Lang Lang just doesn't get Chopin. This is too subtle for him; he just needs to show that he can play chromatic scale at quarter=250, and hit some fffff Cmaj chords at the end. I've heard him play Grieg's piano concert in Am once (with SF Symphony), and he was great (the first movement's cadenza was stunning!). Chopin? Nope, not for him...
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Yuri
FWIW; YMMV

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#1028860 - 10/22/07 01:32 AM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
gerg Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1651
Loc: Houston, TX
Re: Winter Wind difficulty. 25/11 would be extremely tough to perform all the way though at the proper tempo and volume. In my recording Ashkenazy, while doing a good job, practically comes to a stop in places. Now, I can't prove it's an energy-conservation tactic since the rubato is well-placed and it is a high-quality performance, but I can suspect it...

Read Friedheim's intro to it if you don't believe me. WW is very tough, physically. I imagine the hand cramping up from fatigue.

EDIT: Not saying don't attempt it!!! Just be prepared for some serious calisthenics if you want it close to what it should sound like, unless you're a pro. But then everyone is expecting this anyways, so why should I pick on 25/11? I guess because Freidheim does...
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#1028861 - 10/22/07 08:12 AM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
Mr. Widmore Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/06
Posts: 531
Loc: Lost
May I have two? Op.10 No.5 and Op.10 No.9, please.

If it's only allowed one, then Op.10 No.5.

Okey... I just read that two pieces are not allowed, so I go for the Black Key Etude.

Thank you.
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#1028862 - 10/22/07 01:25 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
YD Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 590
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
 Quote:
Originally posted by AQP87:
May I have two? Op.10 No.5 and Op.10 No.9, please.

If it's only allowed one, then Op.10 No.5.

Okey... I just read that two pieces are not allowed, so I go for the Black Key Etude.

Thank you. [/b]
Isn't it "One performer per piece" and not "One piece per performer"? I'd say we should allow multiple pieces per performer IF nobody else wants them.

How about this for a policy:

Just say what you #1 preference is, then somebody else can take your second choice is they want to participate.
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Yuri
FWIW; YMMV

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#1028863 - 10/22/07 02:00 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
-Frycek Online   confused
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5921
Loc: SC Mountains
It's one performer per piece. (In other words no duplication of pieces). I like your policy suggestion.
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Slow down and do it right.

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#1028864 - 10/22/07 02:14 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
YD Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 590
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Here is a little guide I found online:

http://www.chopinmusic.net/en/works/etudes/

(not that I agree with him that my choice of 25/12 is the most difficult of all - but I didn't get to bars 20-46 yet. I have first 16 bars to quarter=120, and still 360 days to go... My hands are quite tired already; what about that glucosamine... does it really help, gerg?)
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Yuri
FWIW; YMMV

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#1028865 - 10/22/07 02:29 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
chopin952 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/20/06
Posts: 492
Loc: North Carolina
Hey guys. I'd like to take Op.25. No.9.
Op.10. No.5 was my pick, but AQP beat me to it. \:\)

I'd like to be backup on Op.25. No.8 if that slot ends up empty.
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#1028866 - 10/22/07 03:22 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
gerg Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1651
Loc: Houston, TX
AQP87, given the rate of assignment (2 a day), let's wait a week or so, just like we are doing for playadom while he decides between 25/10 and 25/11.

I have assigned your first choice, and you can have the second as well if no one else claims it after a week. Sound okay?

chopin952, you have 25/9!
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Wikicital: A collaborative effort to build a knowledgebase of classical music history combined with examples. Your chance to both perform and write...

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#1028867 - 10/22/07 03:33 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
gerg Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1651
Loc: Houston, TX
Anyone started practicing yet? Or already know the etude?

I put 8 hours into 25/6 this weekend.

These etudes are great for technique acquisition - and brilliant music to boot! \:\)

YD, thanks so much for that link! That's bookmark material - really enjoy comparative analyses like that.
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#1028868 - 10/22/07 03:38 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
gerg Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1651
Loc: Houston, TX
 Quote:
Originally posted by YD:
Here is a little guide I found online:

http://www.chopinmusic.net/en/works/etudes/

(not that I agree with him that my choice of 25/12 is the most difficult of all - but I didn't get to bars 20-46 yet. I have first 16 bars to quarter=120, and still 360 days to go... My hands are quite tired already; what about that glucosamine... does it really help, gerg?) [/b]
Glucosamine is not that expensive and many folks swear by it. I take it as a kind of "lubricant" for the joints, not because of any arthritis type problems. (BTW 10/9 reminds me of arthritic pain! \:D ) Even if it does not work, it is a small enough gamble that not much is lost in trying.

What kind of pain are you experiencing? Normal "sore" exercise-type pain, or is it something sharp and abnormal? If the former, that means your muscles are getting worked and will come back stronger!
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Wikicital: A collaborative effort to build a knowledgebase of classical music history combined with examples. Your chance to both perform and write...

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#1028869 - 10/22/07 03:51 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
pianist.ame Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/18/07
Posts: 1166
Loc: Singapore
greg, could I take 25/5 as well? if no one picks it?

haha..haven't started on 10/4, a year is plenty of time for me and I will be done with 10/8 in a month's time and have completed 10/5 halfway.
_________________________
Mastering:Chopin Etudes op.10 nos.8&12 and op.25 no.1, Chopin Scherzo no.4 in E major op.54, Mozart Sonata in B flat major K.333& Khachaturian Toccata

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#1028870 - 10/22/07 03:54 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
playadom Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/21/06
Posts: 1366
Loc: New Jersey
 Quote:
Originally posted by AQP87:
May I have two? Op.10 No.5 and Op.10 No.9, please.

If it's only allowed one, then Op.10 No.5.

Okey... I just read that two pieces are not allowed, so I go for the Black Key Etude.

Thank you. [/b]
Do the Godowsky! Two in one!
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Practice makes permanent - Perfect practice makes perfect.

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#1028871 - 10/22/07 03:58 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
gerg Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1651
Loc: Houston, TX
Amelialw you are amazing! Wish I could be like you.

If you want 25/5: let us give it one week and then assign you and ACQ87 the two studies requested after everyone else has had a chance.

I am surprised by the level of interest here.
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Wikicital: A collaborative effort to build a knowledgebase of classical music history combined with examples. Your chance to both perform and write...

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#1028872 - 10/22/07 03:59 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
playadom Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/21/06
Posts: 1366
Loc: New Jersey
Well... Looks like I can't fall back on my favourite, 25.5 anymore. I'm not doing 25.10 so it looks like I'm stuck with 25.11.

OUCH!
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#1028873 - 10/22/07 04:01 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
Colin Dunn Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/11/05
Posts: 482
Loc: Arvada, CO
Too bad someone already snagged Op. 10 No. 3 - I've been working on that one all year and am getting close to finishing the piece.
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#1028874 - 10/22/07 04:07 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
gerg Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1651
Loc: Houston, TX
Okay, playadom... will assign you 25/11.

I'd like to play 25/10 myself - always have liked its stormy, tornado-like rage. BUT that may be chewing off more than I can bite. Hopefully someone else will pick it.
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Wikicital: A collaborative effort to build a knowledgebase of classical music history combined with examples. Your chance to both perform and write...

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#1028875 - 10/22/07 04:14 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
playadom Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/21/06
Posts: 1366
Loc: New Jersey
I have no idea what I'm getting myself into... I do have a year, but still.
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Practice makes permanent - Perfect practice makes perfect.

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#1028876 - 10/22/07 04:17 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
gerg Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1651
Loc: Houston, TX
Approach it humbly and don't be afraid to spend hours on just three or four notes, if necessary.

BTW do you have the Freidheim Edition of the etudes? Do you have the means to get the music?

I'll order you a book if you need it.
_________________________
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Wikicital: A collaborative effort to build a knowledgebase of classical music history combined with examples. Your chance to both perform and write...

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#1028877 - 10/22/07 04:19 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
playadom Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/21/06
Posts: 1366
Loc: New Jersey
 Quote:
Originally posted by gerg:
Approach it humbly and don't be afraid to spend hours on just three or four notes, if necessary.

BTW do you have the Freidheim Edition of the etudes? Do you have the means to get the music?

I'll order you a book if you need it. [/b]
I don't have the Freidheim Edition. I'm using my laptop actually. Which only has 30 min of battery. I suppose it prevents injury by not letting me play too long.
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#1028878 - 10/22/07 04:26 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
-Frycek Online   confused
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5921
Loc: SC Mountains
 Quote:
Originally posted by gerg:
Anyone started practicing yet? Or already know the etude?
[/b]
I've been working on 10/12 since December 2005. I'd been back at the piano less than a year after a thirty year hiatus when I started it on a dare from my husband. I had to grown into the piece.
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#1028879 - 10/22/07 04:50 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
YD Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 590
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
 Quote:
Originally posted by gerg:

What kind of pain are you experiencing? Normal "sore" exercise-type pain, or is it something sharp and abnormal? If the former, that means your muscles are getting worked and will come back stronger! [/b]
Oh, unfortunately, it is not just sore muscles; my hand surgeon warned me that with my injury osteoarthrytis is virtually guaranteed; but he also said that if I want to get the range of motion back (which I did through years of therapy and working out), the osteoarthritis will be the least of my worries. Anyway, I will try glucosamine; the worst that could happen here is that it does not work. Note, I am not complaining here :-) ; I learned to live with constant low-level pain, and don't notice it most of the time. Some of the etudes, however (10/1 in particular) still go beyond my tolerable pain threshold - though it is getting better all the time. Thanx for the tip.
_________________________
Yuri
FWIW; YMMV

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#1028880 - 10/22/07 05:05 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
gerg Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1651
Loc: Houston, TX
\:\(

Many athletes and performers have overcome supposedly career-ending injuries. We've heard your past recital entries and have a pretty good idea of your capabilities! Believe in yourself, and have patience with your hands as they heal. Also don't be afraid to vent here, we're here for you.
_________________________
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Wikicital: A collaborative effort to build a knowledgebase of classical music history combined with examples. Your chance to both perform and write...

Don't click here!

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#1028881 - 10/22/07 06:10 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
gerg Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1651
Loc: Houston, TX
 Quote:
Originally posted by Colin Dunn:
Too bad someone already snagged Op. 10 No. 3 - I've been working on that one all year and am getting close to finishing the piece. [/b]
Colin, sorry about that! However, the recital is a year off. Perhaps you'd like to add one of the yet-unclaimed etudes to your repertoire...

Let us know!
_________________________
http://www.ecital.net
Wikicital: A collaborative effort to build a knowledgebase of classical music history combined with examples. Your chance to both perform and write...

Don't click here!

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#1028882 - 10/22/07 06:11 PM Re: Chopin Etudes Discussion
Mr. Widmore Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/06
Posts: 531
Loc: Lost
Perfect, I'll go for 10/5 and if nobody else goes for it, for 10/9 too. Answering a previous question; yes, I have finished my etude, not yet at "Vivace" tempo though.
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