Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Gifts and supplies for the musician
SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
(ad 125) Sweetwater - Digital Keyboards & Other Gear
Digital Pianos at Sweetwater
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) Pianoteq
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
Ad (Piano Sing)
How to Make Your Piano Sing
Who's Online
62 registered (Anne H, AZNpiano, Anticlock, 20 invisible), 1004 Guests and 14 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Pianos
Topic Options
#1032315 - 12/04/07 09:00 AM "Knowing the Music"
gmm1 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/03/06
Posts: 1674
Loc: Spokane WA
OK. Something happened last night that I am still trying to get my brain around.

I was watching a show on TV (don't remember what or anything, was not really paying attention). In the background was someone playing a piano. Nothing I could name, just background music. As he/she played, in a billionth of a second, I knew what was being played and how it was played. I cannot give you the names of the chords/notes, but I KNEW. I know I knew.

As I became aware that I knew, I lost it. Poof, gone. As I tried to do it again, nothing.

It was the most wonderful feeling. And, of course, I have no idea how or why. I cannot repeat it.

Those of us who can "hear" and/or play by ear may not see this as anything special, but to me, it made me feel like a musician for a brief moment, for the first time.

Just had to share.
_________________________
"There is nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself." Johann Sebastian Bach/Gyro

Top
(ads P/S)

Sauter Pianos

#1032316 - 12/04/07 09:21 AM Re: "Knowing the Music"
cruiser Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/19/07
Posts: 1172
Loc: Cornwall, England
 Quote:
Originally posted by gmm1:
As he/she played, in a billionth of a second, I knew what was being played and how it was played. I cannot give you the names of the chords/notes, but I KNEW. I know I knew.
[/b]
gmm1, can you explain exactly what you mean when you say that you 'knew' what was being played? Were you able to actually play the piece for this fleeting moment? ...I'm intrigued! \:\)

Top
#1032317 - 12/04/07 09:29 AM Re: "Knowing the Music"
Donna R. Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/26/07
Posts: 794
[/qb][/QUOTE]gmm1, can you explain exactly what you mean when you say that you 'knew' what was being played? ...I'm intrigued! \:\) [/QB][/QUOTE]

Me too. I'm getting better at knowing what it is people are doing to achieve a certain effect, for instance I'll find myself identifying things like grace notes, trills, rolled chords, etc. But I don't get the impression that's what gmm1 meant.

Top
#1032318 - 12/04/07 10:08 AM Re: "Knowing the Music"
gmm1 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/03/06
Posts: 1674
Loc: Spokane WA
Boy, I wish I could explain it, but no, I did not think I could play it (but now that I am thinking that way, maybe I could at that instant - that does kinda fit the feeling). It happened so fast and unexpected. I did not "see" music or written chords/notes. More like a keyboard playing. Now, I'm sounding weird.

I guess it was more a feeling. Something inside me just knew, but the instant I realized it and tried to identify it, it was gone.

I keep thinking it was something I learned to play at some point and forgot, but it's not "that" feeling. I know that feeling very well. If you play something I know, I "listen" against how it's playing in my head. This was different.

Oh, well. I'm glad it happened. I have not practiced with this much "spirit" in months. I am having fun this AM. It's like my brain has given me permission to think I can play.
_________________________
"There is nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself." Johann Sebastian Bach/Gyro

Top
#1032319 - 12/04/07 10:16 AM Re: "Knowing the Music"
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8483
Loc: Ohio, USA
even just for a moment, it meant something. it reminds me of what my teacher told me that he didn't listen to music often, because he'd get too involved and everything become too 'technical', notes, playing techniques, interpretation details, and etc. for a musician, it might become a 2nd nature...

Top
#1032320 - 12/04/07 11:39 AM Re: "Knowing the Music"
Triryche Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/11/06
Posts: 1451
Loc: Milwaukee, Wisconsin
gmm1

I know exactly where you’re coming from!! This also happens to me an occasion.
My own personal theory is it is your subconscious that knew or figured it out, and for a brief moment you’re subconscious allowed it to seep into your conscious. The fact that it was playing in the background and that you weren’t really paying much attention to it helps support this theory, as well as the fact that as soon as you became aware of it, it was gone.
It’s just a theory though. But the part I would like to know is why we can not hold on to the info. Sometimes it almost seems to me that my subconscious is playing tricks on myself.
A similar thing happened to me to a greater extent a long time ago.
When I was 17yrs old and I had played guitar for only a couple of months, I dreamt I was playing a song that I really wanted to learn, which I have never seen the score for (or in my case, tablature). When I woke up, I could still remember the dream, and how I played the song, so I quickly picked up my guitar, and BINGO!! I was able to play ~80% of the song (not including the solo). Needless to say I was one happy camper. Over the years I have actually come up with a few ideas for original songs from my dreams (none of which are complete, yet).

Thanks for sharing!! It’s cool when you know someone else understands something weird you experienced that is hard to explain.

Top
#1032321 - 12/04/07 11:42 AM Re: "Knowing the Music"
Betty Patnude Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/11/07
Posts: 4896
Loc: Puyallup, Washington
gmm1,

I think you might have been experiencing "entrainment". You were captivated by the music into a state of knowing and doing, you were the rhythm, the sound, and the musician all at once.

If you read the topic "Kenny Werner - Playing for the Right Reasons", this may be also part of your experience.

It is joyous and breathtaking is it not?

I posted to the KW thread just before seeing your experience here, and I think they are related. I felt enlightenment come over me in a very passive, clear way as I was reading his essay. I think this is a very important thing to be open to, and to pursue.

Don't we usually see angels with instruments - harps, trumpets, lyres - and the voices of angels?

The hymn-carol for those familiar with it: "Angel's we have heard on high, sweetly singing o'er the plain, and the mountains in reply echoing their joyous strains. Gloria,(melisma) In Excelsis Deo.

I think this is a spiritual happening!

Betty

Top
#1032322 - 12/04/07 01:23 PM Re: "Knowing the Music"
uncle mark Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/29/07
Posts: 29
Loc: Lexington, Ky
I have been perusing the forum for the last 3 weeks and this is my first post. I find the forum a great source of information and inspiration. I am returning to lessons after a 7 year break. My first lessons only lasted about three months so I am bascially starting over again. I will be taking my second lesson tommorrow. I am excited and nervous at the same time; what a great feeling.

Anyway, on to the reason for my post today. Your expercience made me think of an article I read at musicalfossils.com. I think it may apply to your expercience.
 Quote:
As I became aware that I knew, I lost it. Poof, gone. As I tried to do it again, nothing.
and this is what I read at musicalfossils.com (sorry, it is a bit long)

 Quote:
"When people try to concentrate they usually end up thinking about trying to concentrate which isn't the same thing as actually doing it. Real concentration doesn't know it's concentrating because it's unaware of itself. A quote from Kate Kimball is a wonderful example of this experience:
Mindfulness, or awareness, does not mean that you should think and be conscious 'I am doing this' or 'I am doing that.' No. Just the contrary. The moment you think, 'I am doing this,' you become self-conscious, and then you do not live in the action, but you live in the idea 'I am,' and consequently your work too is spoiled.
"You should forget yourself completely, and lose yourself in what you do. The moment a speaker becomes self-conscious and thinks 'I am addressing an audience,' his speech is disturbed and his trend of thought broken. But when he forgets himself in his speech, in his subject, then he is at his best, he speaks well and explains things clearly.
All great work -- artistic, poetic, intellectual or spiritual -- is produced at those moments when its creators are lost completely in their actions, when they forget themselves altogether, and are free from self-consciousness. ("Everyday Mind, 366 Reflections on the Buddhist Path," edited by Jean Smith, a Tricycle book; "What the Buddha Taught," Walpola Rahula)"
It sounds to me like you found the moment when you were 'in the music'. It all made sense at that one time and when you realized what was happening you lost it. If only we could be in the music all the time.

Thanks for sharing you expercience and I look forward to spending more time in the forum.

Top
#1032323 - 12/04/07 03:11 PM Re: "Knowing the Music"
Rosanna Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/08/07
Posts: 1360
Loc: San Francisco Bay area
gmm1,
that sounds like a very exciting taste of something. I tend to see it the same way the uncle mark's quote describes it. But I think the fact that you had the experience means that all the practice you've been putting in must have gotten the technical aspects deep into your being, sort of becoming "second nature". If it can happen once, it can happen again.
_________________________

Top
#1032324 - 12/04/07 06:52 PM Re: "Knowing the Music"
gaffster Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/18/06
Posts: 244
Loc: east central florida
Triryche,
:p That is a very interesting idea. I sometimes "compose" while dreaming as well. If I can get to a piano fast enough after awakening I can capture it right away.. or I have to make sure I keep it in my head for a few hours to secure it. By then I am bored of it. Sometimes I am not even sure if it is original. It's almost like all music exists already, you just have to "capture" it first. That is why so many can relate to it..almost like you heard it before. As of now I am still unable to mechanically reproduce what I feel.
_________________________
-cheers!!!

Top
#1032325 - 12/04/07 07:30 PM Re: "Knowing the Music"
johnnymb Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/23/07
Posts: 39
Loc: Southeast Pa.
I read one time a really neat story about a dream while sleeping that one of my favorite pianists, David Lanz had. As I understand it in his dream he saw Bartolomeo Cristofiri in a candle lit shop working on building a piano.
Then Cristofiri was watching Lanz play a song on a modern grand piano, the song he was playing in his dream is now called Cristofiri's Dream. Beautiful tune. Neat stuff how the mind works.
_________________________
Stop buying things you can't afford....unless of course it's a piano.

Top
#1032326 - 12/05/07 10:07 AM Re: "Knowing the Music"
Triryche Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/11/06
Posts: 1451
Loc: Milwaukee, Wisconsin
 Quote:
Originally posted by gaffster:
As of now I am still unable to mechanically reproduce what I feel. [/b]
Same here.
It is very frustrating when you have something in your head that may never come to full blossom.

Top
#1032327 - 12/05/07 10:18 AM Re: "Knowing the Music"
Triryche Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/11/06
Posts: 1451
Loc: Milwaukee, Wisconsin
 Quote:
Originally posted by gaffster:
It's almost like all music exists already, you just have to "capture" it first. That is why so many can relate to it..almost like you heard it before.[/b]
I have given this much though over the years.
I’m sure much of it has to do with the fact you are conveying an emotion many can relate to. Just the whole concept of different chords and melodies conveying different emotions has always intrigued me.
And I think it also has to do with dominant motion, and I often wonder if dominant motion is related to some mathematical phenomenon like prime numbers and/or the Fibonacci Sequence.
OK, I think I am derailing this thread so I’ll stop! \:o

Top
#1032328 - 12/05/07 10:19 AM Re: "Knowing the Music"
Betty Patnude Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/11/07
Posts: 4896
Loc: Puyallup, Washington
gaffster and Trirche,

But you will! Try something different. Get some new ideas. Work with your imagination. Don't doubt it puts doubt into place and gives it a voice. Have gratitude for what you can do, and be very hopeful that everything is going to be in place for you at the piano, because if you are at your piano, putting in time and effort, you are building the pathways to accomplishment. Wishing alone does not make it so, it needs following with thought and action.

Quiet your mind, be aware, and don't always be looking for results. It's the doing and being that makes it possible. No demands on your outcome removes you as the obstacle you unknowingly are. How you talk to yourself is incredibly important - keep it simple, and only as needed for coaching yourself through your impulses to what you see and interpret from the music page. Drop all expectations, and let it come to you. You will notice progress and improvements.

Trust me!

Betty

Top
#1032329 - 12/08/07 12:50 PM Re: "Knowing the Music"
Granny6 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/09/07
Posts: 85
Loc: England
Gmm
It sounds to me as if You have an ear for the music, or are at least developing an ear
In view of all the other replies this sounds rather simplistic. But never mind it must have been a great moment and I hope you have many more !
Mary

Top
#1032330 - 12/08/07 01:36 PM Re: "Knowing the Music"
gmm1 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/03/06
Posts: 1674
Loc: Spokane WA
Hi Mary....

Yea, I think so, too. It's a little funny, but you and I are just opposites with music. Up to now, I cannot hear when it's right, but I am much better at hearing when it's wrong, if that makes sense.

I don't think your statement is simplistic at all. I think it's dead on the money. For me, it's a huge step. No repeats of it (yet), but I feel like it's just out of reach, still there.
_________________________
"There is nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself." Johann Sebastian Bach/Gyro

Top

Moderator:  BB Player, casinitaly 
What's Hot!!
Christmas Header
Christmas Lights at Piano World Headquarters in Maine 2014
-------------------
The December Free Piano Newsletter
-------------------
Forums Rules & Help
-------------------
ADVERTISE
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
-------------------
PIANO BOOKS
Interesting books about the piano, pianists, piano history, biographies, memoirs and more!
(ad) Yamaha CP Music Rest Promo
Yamaha CP Music Rest Promo
(ad) HAILUN Pianos
Hailun Pianos - Click for More
Ad (Seiler/Knabe)
Knabe Pianos
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
Sheet Music Plus (125)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Is Yelp reliable for evaluating piano stores?
by Le Chiffre
12/21/14 02:08 AM
Guide to Teaching
by Arghhh
12/21/14 12:39 AM
Making a New York Steinway sound like a Hamburg Steinway
by nphase
12/20/14 10:24 PM
Merry Christmas from Brazil! Feliz Natal!!
by Piano_Brazil
12/20/14 09:19 PM
Rzewski: De Profundis
by pianoloverus
12/20/14 09:17 PM
Forum Stats
77375 Members
42 Forums
160031 Topics
2350038 Posts

Max Online: 15252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
Gift Ideas for Music Lovers!
Find the Perfect Gift for the Music Lovers on your List!
Visit our online store today.

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
|
Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2014 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission