Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Gifts and supplies for the musician

SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
(ad) Yamaha CP4 Rebate
Yamaha CP4 Rebate
(ad) Pianoteq
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
Who's Online
97 registered (augustm, Almaviva, Amosdoll, Anita Potter, 26 invisible), 1127 Guests and 11 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
Topic Options
#1037638 - 11/28/08 09:55 PM Chord progressions that don't start on the root.
simpleshinji Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 7
This always confused me, say you're playing II-V-I in C, what's to say you're really not just playing I-IV-bVII in D.

How does the root note stick out when it's not the main tone is what I guess I'm asking.

Top
(ad) Piano & Music Accessories
piano accessories music gifts tuning and moving equipment
#1037639 - 11/28/08 10:52 PM Re: Chord progressions that don't start on the root.
quiescen Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/24/04
Posts: 215
Loc: San Diego
Hi Simpleshinji,

I'm sure there are other's here that can explain this better, but in the 2-5-1 progression, the root is implied. Usually by the melody played.

------------------------------
Play New Age Piano
http://www.quiescencemusic.com
_________________________
Edward Weiss
Quiescence Music
http://www.quiescencemusic.com

Top
#1037640 - 11/29/08 03:14 AM Re: Chord progressions that don't start on the root.
Studio Joe Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/28/07
Posts: 1803
Loc: Decatur, Texas
You can't tell out of context. But by listening to what comes before and after the 2-5-1, its function is obvious. And by "root note" I think you mean the tonic.
_________________________
Joe Whitehead ------ Texas Trax

Top
#1037641 - 11/29/08 04:54 AM Re: Chord progressions that don't start on the root.
bluemarine Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/04/06
Posts: 121
Loc: Croatia
 Quote:
Originally posted by simpleshinji:
This always confused me, say you're playing II-V-I in C, what's to say you're really not just playing I-IV-bVII in D.

How does the root note stick out when it's not the main tone is what I guess I'm asking. [/b]
e.g.:
because II in C is a minor chord, while I in D is a major (different modes)
got it?
_________________________
Living well is the best revenge.

Top
#1037642 - 11/29/08 05:31 AM Re: Chord progressions that don't start on the root.
Studio Joe Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/28/07
Posts: 1803
Loc: Decatur, Texas
 Quote:
Originally posted by bluemarine:

because II in C is a minor chord, while I in D is a major (different modes)
got it?
Not always true. Many songs use II (major) as a secondary dominant. (dominant of the dominant of the tonic)
_________________________
Joe Whitehead ------ Texas Trax

Top
#1037643 - 11/29/08 02:31 PM Re: Chord progressions that don't start on the root.
bluemarine Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/04/06
Posts: 121
Loc: Croatia
don't you mark it then as "V of V", and not "II"?
_________________________
Living well is the best revenge.

Top
#1037644 - 11/29/08 03:31 PM Re: Chord progressions that don't start on the root.
Studio Joe Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/28/07
Posts: 1803
Loc: Decatur, Texas
Some academic purists do when they are trying to analyze the chord function instead of just identifying the chord. But chord charts written for session musicians mark it as what it is (II).

Imagine charting a song like "Five Foot Two" that has a cycle of fourths I, III, VI, II, V, I. The III would be V of V of V of V. That would be a little difficult for a musician to interpret when he is playing the song. All he needs to know is the root of the chord based on the scale degree of the tonic. And whether it's major or minor, diminished, augmented, and extensions like 7th, 9th, etc.

BTW if it were minor it would be marked ii instead of II. Lower case roman numerals for minor and caps for major.
_________________________
Joe Whitehead ------ Texas Trax

Top
#1037645 - 11/30/08 06:12 PM Re: Chord progressions that don't start on the root.
simpleshinji Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 7
You know, I got so wrapped up in the progression itself, I forgot there were other parts of the song, like the intro and chorus and what not.

Top

Moderator:  BB Player, casinitaly 
Shop our Store for Music Lovers!
PianoSupplies.com is Piano World's Online Store
Please visit our store today.
circle of 5ths coaster
(ad 125) Sweetwater - Digital Keyboards & Other Gear
Digital Pianos at Sweetwater
(ad) Hal Leonard Teacher VIP
Hal Leonard Teacher VIP Your Source for Piano Music
Ad (Seiler/Knabe)
Knabe Pianos
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Adding a soundcard for VST playing on my setup?
by idfpiano
03/31/15 01:04 AM
Piano Tastings Ep. 8: Grotrian at NAMM
by Rich Galassini
03/30/15 11:42 PM
Help with installing VSTs
by EddieK
03/30/15 11:26 PM
Buying advice
by noisy123
03/30/15 10:45 PM
Piano Recitals by UNKNOWN pianists.
by GeePee
03/30/15 09:52 PM
What's Hot!!
Trade Regrets: Gary Trafton - Piano Rep
--------------------
Historic Piano Documents
--------------------
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums Rules & Help
-------------------
ADVERTISE
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
-------------------
PIANO BOOKS
Forum Stats
78,715 Registered Members
43 Forums
162,862 Topics
2,390,518 Posts

Most users ever online: 15,252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
Sheet Music Plus (125)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
|
Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2015 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission