Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
(ad 125) Sweetwater - Digital Keyboards & Other Gear
Digital Pianos at Sweetwater
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) Pianoteq
Latest Pianoteq add-on instrument: U4 upright piano
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
PianoSupplies.com (150)
Piano Accessories Music Related Gifts Piano Tuning Equipment Piano Moving Equipment
We now offer Gift Certificates in our online store!
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Piano
Quick Links to Useful Stuff
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano Accessories
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
#1060982 - 11/21/08 07:47 PM Goodbye
-Frycek Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5921
Loc: SC Mountains
I just had confirmation of something I've suspected for a long time, that I am lacking some fundamental musicality, and that as I'm unlikely to develop it at 55, there doesn't seem to be much point in continuing with piano. I will continue it myself however, in decent privacy, as my solace and release. I have finally recognized my mediocrity and will no longer be taking advantage of the kindness of you all by participation in the ecitals or the discussions. It's just too painful to be on the sidelines without any prospect of participation.
I have come to love many of you and I'll still be out there, maybe, from time to time.
_________________________
Slow down and do it right.

Top
(ads P/S)

Sauter Pianos

#1060983 - 11/21/08 07:55 PM Re: Goodbye
gooddog Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/08/08
Posts: 4791
Loc: Seattle area, WA
Wrong! Wrong! WRONG! You are NOT too old to learn. Sounds like you're discouraged and maybe depressed but you CAN teach an old dog new tricks.

I restarted lessons when I was 53. In 4 years I have made a huge amount of progress. I look back on pieces I played 4 years ago and they are now a breeze to read. I keep learning and getting better. The trick is a good teacher.

Don't give up -Frycek. Maybe you need a new teacher? a vacation? a big piece of chocolate? a hug? Please don't give up.
_________________________
Best regards,

Deborah

Top
#1060984 - 11/21/08 07:58 PM Re: Goodbye
Chardonnay Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/12/07
Posts: 505
Loc: Boston, MA.
Frycek,
Please see the PM I just sent you.
Don't do this!

C.

Top
#1060985 - 11/21/08 08:22 PM Re: Goodbye
BB Player Offline


Registered: 11/17/06
Posts: 2571
Loc: Not in Texas
Frycek,

It's time for some goal realignment!

I think a lot of us in our quest to "be the best we can be" set our sights on a level that may ultimately be unattainable given either our innate ability or the time we're able to devote to it. I know from your previous writing that you work hard and practice a lot so therefore it's reasonable that you'd have very lofty goals for where you'd like to get to with your playing.

But[/b]. Ultimately, it's about the satisfaction and enjoyment that comes with playing. At our age (I'm a year younger than you), it's unlikely we'll ever make the concert stage. It's likely there are pieces we'd like to play that we'll never be able to play to our satisfaction.

That doesn't mean we can't enjoy it. It doesn't mean we can't share the camaraderie of the forum or the recitals. In fact, it should mean the opposite - that we play for our own and others pleasure without the self imposed pressure of being the "best" (whatever that means).

Enjoy the summit you've reached, share your experience and playing with us and don't let your inability to reach some arbitrary milestone diminish the pleasure you get from playing.
_________________________
Greg

Top
#1060986 - 11/21/08 08:38 PM Re: Goodbye
Reaper978 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/08/05
Posts: 1326
Check my two posts in the "revolutionary etude in 2 years" thread. Seriously, your amount of focus when you play changes everything. No amount of practice or great teaching can make you excel if you aren't hearing and seeing everything clearly when you play (you subconsciously filter out a lot if you aren't focused).

I feel your pain, being a real musician is a strange and painful experience.

Top
#1060987 - 11/21/08 08:48 PM Re: Goodbye
Mark... Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/27/06
Posts: 4373
Loc: Jersey Shore
-Frycek I feel your pain. I like you, practice like a dog and not happy with my results. I play everything poorly at best. I see new people do 100% better than myself in a short amount of time.

But no matter what I'm still better than I was a year ago, so I trudge onward...

So stay and keep me/us company...

Damn, after typing this I want to quit...

Top
#1060988 - 11/21/08 08:53 PM Re: Goodbye
Horowitzian Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/18/08
Posts: 8453
If you're not here, who's going to do the nocturne ecital?

Don't give up. Everyone has bad days. As Gooddog pointed out, maybe you need a new teacher?
_________________________
Close only counts in horseshoes, hand grenades, and nuclear weapons.

Top
#1060989 - 11/21/08 09:01 PM Re: Goodbye
TTigg Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/30/07
Posts: 873
Loc: Southern California
Conformation from who?

Don't give up would be my first suggestion but you've got to be in it (heart wise) to want to do this. I see from your sig that you mastered your domain in 2007, congratulations on that.

As Mark & many others have pointed out, look at where you've come and how well you've done. For me it's pretty simple...

- there is ALWAYS going to be people better than me
- there is ALWAYS going to be people who learn faster than me
- there is ALWAYS going to be things I can't play
- I will never be a concert pianist

BUT I am ME and I'm loving this journey. The support & help from places like this only make that much easier..

Keep with it, and get another teacher if that's the route of the main issue..
_________________________
"...I'm out there Jerry and I'm LOVING it!..."

My You Tube | My Box.net

Top
#1060990 - 11/21/08 09:05 PM Re: Goodbye
Debbie57 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/27/07
Posts: 258
Loc: Kansas
Frycek,

I'm 51. I'm unlikely to ever participate in a recital here or any where else. Unless I tell my teacher I want to learn out of Alfred's, I don't even have anybody to talk with here to try and get help with the pieces that are stumping me.

I think you are having a moment. I've had tons of them. I really feel badly for you. I hope you will continue to stay and to participate. I'm a turtle in the learner world. You may envy others their skills, but keep in mind there are others who envy you, yours.
_________________________
A Hero is one who hangs on one minute longer. Author: Unknown

Top
#1060991 - 11/21/08 09:35 PM Re: Goodbye
bluekeys Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/07
Posts: 1337
Frycek,
Do what you need to for your own gratification. But at least be aware that many of us older beginners will have to work for a few more years to reach your skill level, and we have appreciated your comments and advice on the forum.

I can't agree with those who say age doesn't matter. Either their bodies are better preserved than mine or they suffer from wishful thinking. I started 2 years ago at 50, and I'm very aware of how limiting that is (I'd kill just to achieve mediocrity!).

It sounds like you've done some soul searching, and I know you'll make a decision that works best for you. I'm glad to hear you're continuing to play, and I hope you decide to continue forum participation as well. \:\)

Top
#1060992 - 11/21/08 09:40 PM Re: Goodbye
だまれ Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/02/08
Posts: 207
Dear Frycek,

I stumped upon this by accident and felt intensely saddened by your disappointment. I do not even know who you are or where you stand musically, but no matter where you are on the learning curve, this is what I tell myself – music is not only for your fingers and ears, it is for your soul. What you truly need to do music is this: you need to love music.

From what you had written, I’m certain you like music … or else why learn the piano at all? Do we all learn music to play in concerts and recitals? Some, perhaps, but not all. I’m glad I can even produce any music at all! I have friends who love music but have never ever taken the effort to learn anything; they don’t even have the courage to TRY.

Although you seem not to be glad with the results you have thus far, let me say this: there are zillions of pianists out there who aren’t pleased with their results either. I have learned not to compare others with myself, but to be content with what I can do musically, and to take my learning a step at a time. I have stopped doing serious playing for some time, and it is a chore getting back the momentum and finding the time to do my practice amidst my hectic work schedule.

If you have the blessing of time, and if you do love music, let the piano accompany you on your life journey. One might never be a concert pianist, but whatever music you do is an expression of your soul. Don’t let this opportunity pass you by.

Life is indeed too short for us to give up or to forsake what we love.
_________________________
Haha! You bet!

Top
#1060993 - 11/21/08 09:41 PM Re: Goodbye
TinyHands Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/10/08
Posts: 92
Loc: Reston, Virginia
Frycek,


Three thousands posts and MOYD 2007 must mean something.

Are you feeling that you're wasting time, money or effort ? Why ? Only because somebody said something bad to you ? Or because certain pieces you couldn't play ?

I hope your love of music will bring you back to the piano and the forum soon.

Don't let anything take this away from you.


TinyHands
_________________________
“Brick walls are there for a reason, they let us prove how badly we want something.“ - Randy Pausch


Top
#1060994 - 11/21/08 10:07 PM Re: Goodbye
Key Notes Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/08
Posts: 744
Loc: CA
Hi -Frycek,

Although I don't know you very well being that I'm so new on this forum, I still feel sadened by your thoughts and decisions.

Being such a beginner, I look forward to learning from everyone, especially those who have walked many miles before me such as yourself on this never ending journey. Although I've not read all of your posts, I'm sure that you've more than contributed your share of not just technical advice, but hope and inspirations to many of us as well. It's definitely our lost if you should decide to go.

Best wishes and good luck to you.

Key Notes \:\)
_________________________
Music speaks where words fails.

Top
#1060995 - 11/21/08 10:31 PM Re: Goodbye
saerra Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/28/07
Posts: 842
Loc: Atlanta, GA
Hi Frycek,

I'm sorry for whoever, or whatever, made you doubt your musicality - and that you're feeling so low right now \:\(

For the record, I simply can not believe that it's true - that you are lacking a "fundamental musicality"? Sorry, I just don't buy it.

I do think there are some people who are perhaps not motivated towards creating (or understanding) music - but I'm pretty sure these people don't voluntarily take up piano as an adult, and make thousands of posts on piano forums!

To me, just that fact that you're here - you're playing, your talking about it - indicates there MUST by definition have something "musical" inside you. I can't fathom how that could not be true.

At any rate, if you feel like you need a break - so be it. But you're very welcome here anytime - please please please don't feel like you have to "sit on the sidelines"...

Top
#1060996 - 11/21/08 10:34 PM Re: Goodbye
BDB Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 21395
Loc: Oakland
This is my favorite article on what should be the goal of the adult beginner. If this is how you see yourself, be happy!

I go through bouts of discouragement when I see how poorly I am playing. It is multiplied by the fact that I know so many of the world's greatest pianists, and I know how great they are from listening to them at sound checks and talking to them backstage. As effortless as it may seem from the audience, I often learn what lies behind the performance.

But I have learned to love all sorts of music. I go to student recitals, because they can be even more exciting than a concert by the world's finest artists. Can anything be more gut-wrenching as when someone trying their hardest just cannot remember how the music goes? Can there be anything better than a student nailing a performance out of the blue?

So sometimes I will play a little piano with others listening. It is never perfect; in fact, most of the time it is not very good at all. But it usually is a good experience for whoever is listening. It is part of the little we can do to make the world a slightly better place.

All of this helps me understand my place in the world. That I tune for the great artists makes me understand that all my work and study and practice has made me as great at what I do on the piano as they are at what they do. And nothing makes me happier than to put those skills to work for pianists like you, just doing it because you love music.
_________________________
Semipro Tech

Top
#1060997 - 11/21/08 10:42 PM Re: Goodbye
cscl Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/13/07
Posts: 255
Loc: Suburban Boston
I've really appreciated hearing your pieces and reading your comments over the last year. I would agree with the "don't let a bad day get you down" tone of the comments here. I hope we'll continue to see your comments and hear your playing in the future!
_________________________
cscl
Estonia 190 Satin Ebony
ABF Recitals: x9 — Studio Recitals: x17
*

Top
#1060998 - 11/21/08 10:47 PM Re: Goodbye
Mr Super-Hunky Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 4234
Loc: Arizona.
Frycek, what you are really telling us is more like your dream of becoming a concert pianist is going bankrupt and a personal restructuring is in order. THATS GREAT!.

You are doing something more compatible with your ambitions and your abilities.

You never said that you were "quitting", but rather I will continue it myself however, in decent privacy, as my solace and release[/b].

Putting unrealistic stress on yourself will only make things worse in the long run so I say put in what you want out of it. It's either worth it to you or not. Certain things may come more naturally to some as opposed to others but thats just life!.

Recognizing your abilities or at least the amount of effort you want to put into something needs to be established up front. If not, you will only be chasing a never ending dream.

Best luck at whatever you choose to do.

Top
#1060999 - 11/21/08 10:54 PM Re: Goodbye
mom3gram Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/26/08
Posts: 1132
Loc: New Jersey
"The woods would be a very quiet place if the only birds that sang were the ones that sang best".

I'm not sure who said this, but I found it in one of my art books and copied it into my journal. I usually apply it to my art when I totally screw up a painting, but it applies very well to piano too.

Don't quit - take a little break if you have to, and remember to enjoy playing where you are right now, and not to stress about where you (or someone else) think you should be. Hang in there.
_________________________
mom3gram

ALFRED'S ADULT BOOK 1 GRADUATE


Top
#1061000 - 11/21/08 10:55 PM Re: Goodbye
Piano World Offline



Registered: 05/24/01
Posts: 5573
Loc: Parsonsfield, ME (orig. Nahant...
-Frycek,

Knock it off \:D

I own this place and I have bad days (and weeks, and months).

I'm coming up on 57 in a few days (ouch) and I have many times when I'm frustrated about my playing.

I know I will never be a Jeffrey Biegel or Keith Emerson (my hero) and that's ok.

I always go back to playing because I love the piano and I love to play, and so do you.

There is no magic "level" you have to attain, there is no repetoire you must "master" to have reached the "end".

Play for your self first, the rest is secondary.

Enjoy playing the piano because you love playing the piano, not because you are trying to impress anyone else. Believe me, plenty of people are impressed with your playing, but in the end, who cares?

I play for myself first, and then hope I can entertain a few others as well.
_________________________
- Frank B.
Founder / Host
www.PianoWorld.com
www.PianoSupplies.com
Find Us On:
Facebook.com/PianoWorldDotCom
Twitter.com/PianoWorld
www.youtube.com/PianoWorldDotCom
Skype: PianoWorldDotCom
Estonia L-190, Yamaha P-80, Hammond XK-3, Hammond A-100, Estey 1895 Pump Organ
-------------------------
It's Fun To Play the Piano ... PLEASE Pass It On!
And please invite everyone you know to join our piano forums!
Coming to Maine? We're in Parsonsfield (southwest) let's get together!


Top
#1061001 - 11/21/08 11:01 PM Re: Goodbye
Mr Super-Hunky Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/17/05
Posts: 4234
Loc: Arizona.
I feel I want to elaborate on something....."quitting".

Anyone can quit. It's probably the easiest thing you can do. You can just say "I quit" and everything is done and over.

There does come a time however in which you may realize that the activity that you are doing just does not come easy even after a tremendous amount of dedicated time and effort. Should that be the case, it then becomes a decision to make whether you are willing to put the time and effort it takes for YOU to get to the next level or even just remain where you are at.

If you are not willing to continue to feed your piano playing requirements, continuing to do so would most likely be for the wrong reasons like guilt.

You need to do what you really want to irregardless of any outside influences. Then again, you may just be having a bad hair day in which you can deleate the thread tomorrow! ;\) .

Top
#1061002 - 11/21/08 11:04 PM Re: Goodbye
quiescen Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/24/04
Posts: 215
Loc: San Diego
 Quote:
Originally posted by mom3gram:
"The woods would be a very quiet place if the only birds that sang were the ones that sang best". [/b]
Brilliant quote. And so true!

--------------------------
Play New Age Piano
http://www.quiescencemusic.com
_________________________
Edward Weiss
Quiescence Music
http://www.quiescencemusic.com

Top
#1061003 - 11/21/08 11:11 PM Re: Goodbye
Rickster Online   content


Registered: 03/25/06
Posts: 8468
Loc: Georgia, USA
Hi Frycek,

It sounds like you’ve got a lot of support here, including the owner of the forum. Are you sure you want to leave such fine friends and co-learners?

Heck, I’m 52 and have never been satisfied with my playing. However, just touching and feeling the piano keys is a form of stress relief and therapy all in itself.

Hang in there, it’ll get better. \:\)

Take care,

Rickster
_________________________
Piano enthusiast and amateur musician: "Treat others the way you would like to be treated". Yamaha C7. YouTube Channel

Top
#1061004 - 11/21/08 11:14 PM Re: Goodbye
Lisztener Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/12/06
Posts: 921
-Frycek,

You are being harsh on yourself and on us who enjoy your knowledge and your play.

Please reconsider.

Selfishly and sincerely,

Lisztener
_________________________


Top
#1061005 - 11/21/08 11:21 PM Re: Goodbye
Dave123 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/24/08
Posts: 203
Loc: Canada
I have read many of your posts here on PWF and as with many others have found them interesting and informative.
It is encouraging that you wish to continuing playing for your own enjoyment, that I believe is why most of us are learning for our own enjoyment.
I too feel your pain I do experience the same frustrations and in my case self doubts.
I really do hope you continue participating in the forum, I have been learning piano for less than a year and look up to the members such as yourself as a form of inspiration to where I want to be.

Top
#1061006 - 11/22/08 12:03 AM Re: Goodbye
Babs_ Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/12/07
Posts: 321
Loc: Gulf Coast
Frycek

It looks to me that you have alot of friends here who admire you. I have read many of your posts and you are always full of useful and interesting information. There's no doubt in my mind that you have a deep love for music. If I recall you played a Fields Nocturne at one of the recitals. I remember it being quite beautiful. \:\)

I just finished practicing tonight and I didn't like how I sounded on any of the pieces. Often when stuff like this happens. The next day I will take out the same pieces and practice and I will notice some improvement in my playing.

You know what I think? It sounds to me like you are having a bad day. We all have bad days musically. I betcha even Chopin had his share of bad days musically. ;\)

Chances are tomorrow will be a better day. I will keep my fingers crossed for you ok?

Top
#1061007 - 11/22/08 12:12 AM Re: Goodbye
Triryche Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/11/06
Posts: 1451
Loc: Milwaukee, Wisconsin
NONSENSE!!! Utter and absolute NONSENSE!!

Frycek,

I don't know you personally, but I feel like I have come to know you (as well as many others) from your participation and contributions to the forum.

I just turned 40 and in my own own eyes I many times feel like I am the epitome of mediocrity (especially concerning guitar and chess). But yet I keep pushing forward. It's like there is something there taunting me, like a dangling carrot, always and infinitely just beyond my grasp. I know I will never obtain it, but it is like the chase is what has me leaning dangerously over the edge, reaching, reaching, with reckless abandon, for the unachievable award.

So for selfish reasons I ask you, please (PLEASE PLEASE [PRETTY PRETTY] PLEASE) continue to grace us with you presence. You are (at least in my eyes) a valuable asset to this online community that has become a very special part of my musical journey and keeps me plunging forward. Not to mention, what type of role model would you be for persons possibly approaching a midlife crisis??

I know this an online forum which provides anonymity and screen names for some to hide behind. But, and not to sound cliche, as many of us wear our hearts on our sleeves in this forum, it really truly brings a sense of a real community.

I have seen this happen on other forums, and never really felt compelled to intervene, but in this case I feel obliged.

So if you must go on hiatus, know you will be missed.

Sincerely,

Rich

Top
#1061008 - 11/22/08 12:21 AM Re: Goodbye
Dave Ferris Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/12/07
Posts: 1731
Loc: Glendale, Ca.
.
_________________________
http://soundcloud.com/dave-ferris

Top
#1061009 - 11/22/08 12:21 AM Re: Goodbye
Monica K. Offline

Platinum Supporter until Dec 31 2012


Registered: 08/10/05
Posts: 17770
Loc: Lexington, Kentucky
 Quote:
Originally posted by Piano World:
Play for your self first, the rest is secondary.

Enjoy playing the piano because you love playing the piano, not because you are trying to impress anyone else. Believe me, plenty of people are impressed with your playing, but in the end, who cares?

I play for myself first, and then hope I can entertain a few others as well. [/b]
Frycek,

I was trying to pick a few good quotes from the many others here who have already responded to you, but it was hard to narrow them down. Everybody else has already made whatever points I could make. But I think Frank here represents most closely my reaction to your post.

I just got back from seeing Einaudi play his music with a skill that brought tears to my eyes, and I realized that I will probably never sound anything as close to as good as he sounds.

But I also realized that it didn't matter, that I *still* liked how I sounded when I played his music, imperfect as it was, and that I got immense satisfaction from just trying to come close to his genius and beauty.

There will always be somebody better than us. That doesn't mean that what we're doing right now is worthless.

Hang in there. \:\)
_________________________
Mason & Hamlin A -- 91997
My YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/pianomonica

Top
#1061010 - 11/22/08 12:30 AM Re: Goodbye
Jolly Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/20/01
Posts: 14051
Loc: Louisiana
 Quote:
Originally posted by -Frycek:
I just had confirmation of something I've suspected for a long time, that I am lacking some fundamental musicality, and that as I'm unlikely to develop it at 55, there doesn't seem to be much point in continuing with piano. I will continue it myself however, in decent privacy, as my solace and release. I have finally recognized my mediocrity and will no longer be taking advantage of the kindness of you all by participation in the ecitals or the discussions. It's just too painful to be on the sidelines without any prospect of participation.
I have come to love many of you and I'll still be out there, maybe, from time to time. [/b]
A story (you may not know this, but folks from the South tend to speak in stories, meandering to a point ;\) )

Not too long ago, I knew a brother and sister, each with a gift of music. The boy played piano a bit, strummed a decent guitar and was session quality on percussion, mostly drumsets.

The girl? Could sing pretty well, could play piano pretty well, could play a flute very well. But she had something her brother lacked...she had ears like a bat, and the ability to immediately know what was wrong with a piece of music...I heard remark as she walked through a room one day where a symphony was playing on tv, "Y'all hear that second clarinet, he's a bit flat."

And she was right. She has the gift to immediately hear a problem in a mixed orchestra and fix it. She has the gift to push and pull musicians as she will, and achieve what she wants.

But she doesn't enjoy music as she should. A good bit of talent, good enough to play at a local symphony level, but hypercritical enough that she's never good enough, she never achieves the perfection she seeks. It frustrates her.

The brother? Different child, different planet. Everybody makes mistakes, music should be fun. One mistake is a screw-up, two are jazz. He lives for the give and take of a band, and the applause of the crowd. It doesn't have to be perfect, it just has to be enjoyable.

One rarely plays much...not anymore. The other will always enjoy his music.

The point of the story? Play for yourself, play for enjoyment. Play not for perfection, but play for all the right reasons. Play for life.

The brother and sister? Yeah, I know them fairly well.

I fathered them both....
_________________________
www.coffee-room.com

Over 1,000,000 posts where pianists discuss everything. And nothing.

Top
#1061011 - 11/22/08 12:39 AM Re: Goodbye
TX-Dennis Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/09/05
Posts: 4126
Loc: Texas
I have accepted the fact that I will be a life long intermediate pianist, and that is okay with me. I, too, think you should give this decision a bit more thought. You are a better player than I. If you should chuck it in, then I probably should, too. I won't, though. I enjoy it too much (most of the time, anyway).

Stick around awhile, and see if you feel differently in a few days. We all get frustrated sometimes, and begin to wonder why we keep trying. Usually, the mood passes, and we carry on. All I am asking is that you take the time to be certain you are making the correct decision. Of course, if you do quit, you may later decide to come back to it like so many others. I came back to the piano. Twice, so far. \:D You have my respect and best wishes whatever you decide.
_________________________
Dennis

flickr


Top
#1061012 - 11/22/08 12:42 AM Re: Goodbye
sotto voce Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/15/06
Posts: 6163
Loc: Briarcliff Manor, NY, USA
 Quote:
Originally posted by -Frycek:
[...] there doesn't seem to be much point in continuing with piano. I will continue it myself however, in decent privacy, as my solace and release.[/b]
Of course you will continue—it's inevitable, so don't keep it private!

Each of us has a personal relationship with our practice of music, but none of us has to be alone in that. Everything you need is right here, where we teach, learn and share our joy.

I don't know [what else to say] that wouldn't seem trite, or patronizing, or inconsequential. Just know that I'm your friend to be called upon as needed. It's my honor and privilege to repeat those words back to you now.

Steven
_________________________

"There are two means of refuge from the miseries of life: music and cats."
—Albert Schweitzer

Chopin: Allegro de Concert Op. 46
Schumann: Toccata Op. 7
Fauré: Ballade Op. 19

Top
#1061013 - 11/22/08 12:53 AM Re: Goodbye
Dave Ferris Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/12/07
Posts: 1731
Loc: Glendale, Ca.
.
_________________________
http://soundcloud.com/dave-ferris

Top
#1061014 - 11/22/08 01:09 AM Re: Goodbye
sophial Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/05
Posts: 3455
Loc: US
Frycek,

I haven't been able to be around here much recently for a variety of reasons, but I saw your post and have to reply. You've had lots of great advice here but the other thing I want to say is please take care of yourself. You sound very down and I hope you can be kind to yourself and get some support. (Just read through this thread a few times!). I get frustrated as well knowing I'll never play at a really high level but that's not the point of music, is it? When you feel ready to share it again I think you've seen we'll all be here . Take care.
Sophia

Top
#1061015 - 11/22/08 01:12 AM Re: Goodbye
Bryan P. Carney Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/23/06
Posts: 148
Loc: Cleveland, Ohio, US
Dude, remember when I posted ~this~ last night?

I respect the feelings you are having because they seem to make me a better person.

I came to the conclusion I wasn't... ...how did I put it? Yes! That,
 Quote:
In the end I foundered on those rocks. I swore off the piano. I felt like a sham, a fake, and a delusional dilettante. I thought I was embarrassing myself with this silly musical affectation.
I don't know you at all so I must now be speaking to that part of me in you and you in me: I said, regarding musicianship,
 Quote:
The battles we face may not only be the difficulties of mechanics, the vagaries of the intellect's focus, nor prioritization; the foe which slays everyman equally is ardor. We can aim so high, even with the best intentions, that we climb the next biggest hill, to our peril, while Parnassus may be this pleasant plateau.

Ardor, the purely emotional will to be, the desire which burns brightest, is what is common, actually. It keeps mankind locked in the prison that is the paradise of intentions.
As they say to the drunk, the junky, and (as they should) to the artist: I hope you fall. I hope you fall hard. I hope it hurts. I hope it means something this time. Truly, there's not much more time left.

peace
_________________________
=====================
nil volentibus arduum
Do it for Fux' sake.
=====================

Top
#1061016 - 11/22/08 03:46 AM Re: Goodbye
Euan Morrison Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/01/05
Posts: 1588
Loc: Edinburgh
Frycek, you have contributed so much to this forum! Your knowledge and passion for Chopin seeps through in every post you write. You have taught us all so much, pleeese don't go!

How about taking a break for a few days, or even a month? Re-evaluate things, but remember the wise words from everyone who has posted here so far.

Top
#1061017 - 11/22/08 04:12 AM Re: Goodbye
charleslang Online   content
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/13/08
Posts: 2079
I started playing two months before I turned 18, so I count myself as an adult beginner. No other music before that except a year of bell choir, which, I think, doesn't count for much.

I'm dedicating my recent improvisation to adult learners including Frycek. For me some of what adult learners feel is expressed in this piece. Some anger some frustration (but some beauty hopefully):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h37sLTCAgOk
_________________________
Charles Lang
Working on: A Night in Tunisia; Memories of Tomorrow (Keith Jarrett).
Just started: Brazilian Like (Michel Petrucciani)

Baldwin Model R (1974), Hardman 5'9" grand (1915), Rieger-Kloss 42.5" vertical

Top
#1061018 - 11/22/08 04:16 AM Re: Goodbye
Benny Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/06/08
Posts: 44
Loc: Germany
Frycek,

I usually think: as long as *I* can hear all the weaknesses of my own play (oh, and I do...), then my musicality in my head is larger than I can express. So, there is some potential in the future. If I considered my play as perfect, it would be quite suspicious...

Please keep posting. I like your posts!

Top
#1061019 - 11/22/08 06:19 AM Re: Goodbye
PBruce Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/17/08
Posts: 5
Loc: Malaysia
Frycek, if you don't mind, could you tell us what is bothering you that causes you to feel this way?
_________________________
Baby Grand Piano

Top
#1061020 - 11/22/08 07:05 AM Re: Goodbye
cruiser Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/19/07
Posts: 1171
Loc: Cornwall, England
Dear Frycek, since returning to the piano last year at the age of 56 I have often felt the way you've expressed. I don't know what - or who - exactly has prompted you to feel as low as you do right now, but please be assured that you're in good company here in the ABF with your frustration!

'Lacking in musicality'.... ah, yes that would be me me too! Except that I know the 'musicality' is in me just as I know - and I feel I know you quite well - it's in you too. Together, we will bring our musicality to the surface - just wait and see if we don't! Our love for the piano and it's repertoire is too great for any other alternative. Let's leave the virtuoso performances to the virtuosos. Our efforts are just as worthy.

and... forget the age thing. It's an advantage! \:\)

Top
#1061021 - 11/22/08 09:15 AM Re: Goodbye
Mike White Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/22/05
Posts: 518
Loc: 90 miles West of New Orleans
Hey, I'm pushing 60. No concertos for me, but it is a thrill to make music from a bunch of dots on a page.
_________________________
My Recordings. Please feel free to comment or to ask a question.

Yamaha G3 & P-80 Digital

Top
#1061022 - 11/22/08 09:50 AM Re: Goodbye
DragonPianoPlayer Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/12/06
Posts: 2368
Loc: Denver, CO
Frycek,

As Frank said: Play for yourself first, the rest is secondary.

Just remember that when you are ready to come back, you will be welcome back with open arms by many on the forum. We will miss you.

Rich
_________________________

Top
#1061023 - 11/22/08 10:02 AM Re: Goodbye
TrapperJohn Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 3571
Loc: Chocolatetown, USA
Frycek - sure, take a "break" for awhile - we all probably need that from time to time - relax and regroup your physical & emotional forces - reset your priorities and your goals - even if you decide you only or primarily want to play for your own satisfaction and pleasure (like many of us here) that's still a pretty lofty standard - in fact, the only one that really counts!

Besides, where else will you find so many people who are at once helpful and encouraging and yet have such warped senses of humor?

Regards (and expecting you to say the same to me when I make an impulsive "threat" to quit some day!), JF

P.S. "tough love" now demands you get busy on your next piece :p \:\)
_________________________
Every difficulty slurred over will be a ghost to disturb your repose later on. Frederic Chopin

Current favorite bumper sticker: Wag more, bark less.

Top
#1061024 - 11/22/08 10:12 AM Re: Goodbye
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8483
Loc: Ohio, USA
if everyone here would expect to become a pianist of concert pianist level in techniques and musicality, then everyone here should just quit all together because it's just unattainable for many of us. but, hey, who cares, we just play and enjoy learning all the way!

Top
#1061025 - 11/22/08 10:17 AM Re: Goodbye
LisztAddict Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/12/05
Posts: 2896
Loc: Florida
Frycek - we all have ups and downs on our musical journey. If we fall down into the deep valley, what we need is a break to recover. Then we can slowly climb our way back up. You have been pushing yourself way too hard on the piano. You need to cut down to just 10-20 minutes/day. Play only when you feel like playing. Play for your own enjoyment. Don't play to keep up with Ecital or whatever. And there are many nice simple pieces by Bach, Beethoven, Mozart that you can enjoy playing too. You don't need to put yourself through technical demanding pieces all the time.

Top
#1061026 - 11/22/08 10:23 AM Re: Goodbye
Piano*Dad Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/12/05
Posts: 10354
Loc: Williamsburg, VA
Great story, Jolly. Nice attribute of the south, that storytelling!

Listen to him, Frycek.
_________________________
Grotrian 192 #156455

https://www.youtube.com/user/dhfeld/videos

Top
#1061027 - 11/22/08 10:43 AM Re: Goodbye
wj3 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/05/08
Posts: 313
Loc: Salem, Or
Frycek. Don't be so hard on yourself. We will never be as good as we want to be. Music and playing the piano is a long journey and there will always be that goal or technique or that piece that is beyond us that we strive to play and will never reach. I started from scratch at 60 I have been learning (very slowly) for two years. I realize that I probably won't live long enough to learn to play as well as some of the people here in this formum, but I will certainly try be get as good as I can be. As far as quitting the forum goes why not stay around. I am not anywhere near an expert on the piano but if I can help someone who is learning the same things I struggled with and I can offer advice then I feel that I am a contributing member of this forum. You, as you can see from the response to your post, that you are concidered a valuable member. Please stay with us.

Walt
_________________________
wj3

2010 Roland KR-115m
Alfreds AIO Level 2:
Working on (Simply Joplin) Solace, Peacherine Rag, A Breeze from Alabama:, (Burgmuller) Progres, Limpid stream.




Top
#1061028 - 11/22/08 11:55 AM Re: Goodbye
Margareth Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/04/05
Posts: 99
Loc: Estonia
I just want to show mu support to You, too. I have always found your posts very friendly and helpful, too.

Maybe you just need a little break.

BTW - who told you or where did the idea of "you lacking fundamental musicality" came from? And musicality can be developed, too and you've been real good at it.

You have made great progress so far! Keep it up!

I was very encouraged the other day when my piano teacher told me that if I myself enjoy what I'm playing then the listeners often will, too. And I'm so sure that you have had many emotional moments on your journey. Otherwise you wouldn't have hanged on for so long \:\)
_________________________
Attitude is everything.

Top
#1061029 - 11/22/08 01:18 PM Re: Goodbye
Ina Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/16/06
Posts: 109
Loc: Slovenia
Dear Frycek,

I don't know you. I agree with Margaret and many others, that musicality is something that you can develope. It's a journey... toward well being. Music can bring you somewhere else, up to the sky (and sometime obviously down down to earth and benath... ). Don't give up just because somebody told you something ... I mean... so what... we are not perfect.

I hope you find another teacher and enjoy your playing again. And again. And again.

My teacher thought a lady, who was 86 years old. All she wanted to do for all her life was playing piano. She got some instruction as a child and then restarted with my teacher at 74. She was not brilliant. But she was enjoying the music road.

I'm 41 and I know I won't perform for nobody. I know my limitations. But... with a little help from my teacher (and sometimes a kick in the posterior from myself) I'm progressing. And I like it, though sometimes I just wanna quit. And I think of MOYD, funny, but it helps practicing.

So, dear Frycek, I hope you just had a bad day.
_________________________


Top
#1061030 - 11/22/08 01:47 PM Re: Goodbye
kluurs Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/24/02
Posts: 3739
Loc: Chicago
Frycek,

You are such a sweet person. It saddens me that you've gotten hurt in all this. Your music is so much a part of you and your spirit. You have a great gift for music - and have shared it with others which is wonderful I've appreciated your courage in sharing so much of you.

What others think? - I know a bit of that. I have a friend who wonders why anyone would do anything if they can't be "competitive" - but that's not what music is all about. It is in finding solace or joy or humor - in it - it can be a deeply personal thing.

Don't ever give up that which is you - you are an exceptionally wonderful and gifted person.

Ken

Top
#1061031 - 11/22/08 02:45 PM Re: Goodbye
mdsdurango Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/01/04
Posts: 1755
Loc: Durango Colorado
Wendy and I had dinner last week at a local restaurant that has a beautiful old M&H centered in the eating area. The guy playing was about my age (55) and was totally fluent. He needed not even look at the notes he was playing and he could play requests without the music in front of him. As a player I listened closely and heard only two notes that I might consider "mistakes". He played fully and it was quite luscious.
Needless to say - He really p***ed me off!
After that evening I had to remind myself that it will be only what it will be for me. I have to practice very hard just to be average. I will not likely ever have that mans ability. But I will play like me, and hopefully that is not too bad.
Hey, even The Geezer Trio (three old men with one kids talent) has it's fans , , , ,Thankfully

In other words; Don't fret the small stuff. Enjoy yourself and play like you! "Musically" or not! I know a guy who sings like Bob Dylan with a cold, but he writes incredible lyrics and those make his songs spectacular.

Find your spot.

Mike
_________________________
WHAT???????
Yamaha S6, U5C, P120
http://michaelstith.com

Top
#1061032 - 11/22/08 04:21 PM Re: Goodbye
Woody-Woodruff Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/11/08
Posts: 615
Loc: Coastal Mississippi
Frycek,
Just a recommendation, PM Apple* and talk to her about your issues.
Woody
_________________________

Top
#1061033 - 11/22/08 04:29 PM Re: Goodbye
Rosanna Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/08/07
Posts: 1360
Loc: San Francisco Bay area
Frycek,

As long as you enjoy playing, keep playing. That's all there is to it!

You aren't ever obliged to record, to be in recitals, to participate in MOYD, or do anything else. Having said that, hanging out with the PW family is obligatory! \:D
_________________________

Top
#1061034 - 11/22/08 05:19 PM Re: Goodbye
Damz Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/19/06
Posts: 264
Loc: Montreal, Canada
I see that my message came off completely wrong, and now I feel like a horrible person. You know that I never said you lacked fundamental musicality, this is what you are telling yourself, maybe in an attempt to justify the fact that you're not progressing as fast as you would like... Why torture yourself like that? If indeed you're stalling in your progress, instead of focusing on the things you cannot change, like "innate musicality" - which, by the way, I'm sure you do not lack - why not focus on what you can change, like your teacher or even your mental state which seems pretty down right now and is certainly detrimental to your playing and everything in your life. And if somehow I'm the source of your down (or a part of it), then please realize that I was only trying to help and accept my sincere apologies, and I will refrain from further comments regarding you or your playing.

Top
#1061035 - 11/22/08 07:51 PM Re: Goodbye
Reaper978 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/08/05
Posts: 1326
Damz, your first post in the revolutionary etude thread pretty well reflects the attitude of the professional music world when it comes to music. Evenness, clarity, and musical sense are all characteristics of good music, but I don't take these things that seriously anymore. Human beings can't produce flawless results, at least in the way we normally think of "perfection" as being without error.

Top
#1061036 - 11/22/08 11:42 PM Re: Goodbye
Phlebas Offline


Registered: 01/02/03
Posts: 4654
Loc: New York City
 Quote:
Originally posted by Damz:
I see that my message came off completely wrong, and now I feel like a horrible person. You know that I never said you lacked fundamental musicality, this is what you are telling yourself, maybe in an attempt to justify the fact that you're not progressing as fast as you would like... Why torture yourself like that? If indeed you're stalling in your progress, instead of focusing on the things you cannot change, like "innate musicality" - which, by the way, I'm sure you do not lack - why not focus on what you can change, like your teacher or even your mental state which seems pretty down right now and is certainly detrimental to your playing and everything in your life. And if somehow I'm the source of your down (or a part of it), then please realize that I was only trying to help and accept my sincere apologies, and I will refrain from further comments regarding you or your playing. [/b]
I think your initial post in that thread was unfortunate, and was thoughtless. It would help if we all remember that there are real people behind the pixels here, and while one shouldn't sugarcoat, one also shouldn't be dismissive and cruel.
Sorry to single you out, but there's too much of this happening at PW.
There, now I'm being direct. \:\)

Top
#1061037 - 11/23/08 12:14 AM Re: Goodbye
Oxfords Gal Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/21/06
Posts: 1553
Loc: Jacksonville, Florida
Frycek,

I wouldn't take to heart any negative comments that might come from PW. As Phlebas, said there's much of this happening at PW.

The most accomplished pianist here offer great criticsm and couple that with words of motivation not put downs.

Dust yourself off, consider the source and keep on trucking.
_________________________
Fuzzy Wuzzy was a bear, Fuzzy Wuzzy had no hair.>>> Herman Munster

Top
#1061038 - 11/23/08 12:24 AM Re: Goodbye
Betty Patnude Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/11/07
Posts: 4896
Loc: Puyallup, Washington
Frycek,

You said: "I just had confirmation of something I've suspected for a long time, that I am lacking some fundamental musicality, and that as I'm unlikely to develop it..."

That must have been a big blow to you and I'm so sorry to hear that. If someone said that to you, they had best be able to stand behind their words and explain to you what is missing and encourage how to go about fixing and improving.

Don't let someone rob you of your spirit and your love of music. It sounds absolutely thoughtless for someone to say that to you, which I am assuming might have happened, like a huge criticism coming your way.

Even if the greatest teacher in the world said that to me, I would qualify exactly what was meant by it and go about deciding if there was something I could do about it and how would I proceed. Discouraged? Yes, I would be? Angry? That too!

We need our music in our lives and the companionship and support of others and sharing our problems and troubles sometimes.

Because you have shared here, I think you will be healing soon, and any thoughts that you had of disappearing are going to be reevaluated by you.

One of my reminders to my students is that "Learning to play the piano is a big challenge, and you don't want to quit before the miracle that you are working for has been granted."

Purpose is all about investing our time, effort, energy, love, dreams, in the pursuit of something. We learn a lot about ourselves because of the ups and downs we face.

You have had a great turn out of people posting their encouragement to you. That is so nifty! Warmth and understanding from people a lot like us is a positive thing.

Saying good bye is harder to do.

Best wishes,

Betty

Top
#1061039 - 11/23/08 12:33 AM Re: Goodbye
Damz Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/19/06
Posts: 264
Loc: Montreal, Canada
 Quote:
Originally posted by Phlebas:
I think your initial post in that thread was unfortunate, and was thoughtless. It would help if we all remember that there are real people behind the pixels here, and while one shouldn't sugarcoat, one also shouldn't be dismissive and cruel.
Sorry to single you out, but there's too much of this happening at PW.
There, now I'm being direct. \:\)
And you are right.

Top
#1061040 - 11/23/08 01:21 AM Re: Goodbye
Larisa Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/03/08
Posts: 498
Loc: Philadelphia
One of the things I've found quite liberating is to say "This is me, this is how I play - take it or leave it." I came back to the piano at the age of 30 with seriously messed-up hands. I will never be a concert pianist - I have no endurance to practice enough for that. I cannot get the kind of flawless technique that others have. A cruel person, or someone who thought they were being "realistic", could just tell me to quit because I'll never be "good enough" - whatever that is. One of the more useful skills I learned, at the advanced age of 30, is that I don't care what cruel people say, and that I am going to keep playing regardless.

I listened to your recording of the Revolutionary Etude. You do not lack musicality. I think you should keep playing, and keep posting, and keep improving. That's all.

Top
#1061041 - 11/23/08 01:30 AM Re: Goodbye
Horace Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/28/04
Posts: 505
While some people might lack innate musicality, nobody who enjoys and is moved by music lacks innate musicality.

Top
#1061042 - 11/23/08 08:15 AM Re: Goodbye
Wombat66 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/31/05
Posts: 262
Loc: Cornwall UK
I am sorry to see anyone leave the forum and have in the past valued Fryecks contributions, but Damz, don't beat yourself up.
Your criticism was perhaps a little direct, but saying what you mean and meaning what you say is what makes a forum interesting. Anyone posting a recording needs to be able to take the rough with the smooth, although hopefully the rough is sympathetically phrased.
Fryeck I'm sorry you are feeling down about your musical abilites. Like everyone else here, I've been there and bought the t shirt - and indeed still wear it most weeks.
You're certainly not alone in your insecurity and dispirited feelings. One of the great things about PW is that it is a supportive place to go when one discovers that You-Tube is awash with far more talented four year olds than we'll ever be, looking around me at my own daughters school concerts I feel insecure about my own musicality.
However the forum has almost 40000 members, the majority of whom have quietly left without self indulgently announcing "goodbye" to the forum before flouncing out like a spoilt teenager.
If you want my encouragement about your playing - you have it.
If you feel wronged and hurt about your playing being criticised say so, I'm sure you'll get lots of support, including from me. But please, a little less histrionics and if you want to stop contributing to the forum just stop posting without devoting a thread to the subject (at least then you can change your mind and start re-contributing without having to worry about loss of face). I hope my straight talking hasn't caused too much offense, but I have a valid point that doesn't yet appear to have been made on your little thread, and yes it is OK - I wont think any the worse of you if you do change your mind and start posting again. But please, grow up and get back to doing what the rest of us do - devoting our lives to being just a little less crap at playing the piano.

Top
#1061043 - 11/23/08 08:59 AM Re: Goodbye
Peyton Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 2548
Loc: Maine
Hey Frycek... we've been in the same boat and been friends for too long for me not to speak up. I'm in there with you... 53, and a permanent amateur/intermediate. Every time I post a recital as I did of my 10/3 in the last etude recital I know that there will be some beginners that might listen and go wow but there will be a lot more knowledgeable musicians that will cringe. I would LOVE to just once post a perfect recording of a Chopin piece but I accept that it will just never happen. As far as the cringers go... Hey, that's why we're here in the beginner forum. You want to hear perfect recordings, go to the pianist forum. That's where the pros are. \:\)

The point is, as others have said... I think you, I and many others here are in this just for the fun of it. We will never be great. Maybe we dream a little... and maybe do really shine every now and then.

But the whole point of this forum , at least for me, is to have a chance to be with other people (be it cyber-reality) that share the same hobby I do. I'm not quite so alone with my piano when I can come here and read and hear other's experiences.

And there is even drama! Now THAT'S entertainment! \:\)

I hope I said something that helps. I know what it feels like to be down about your piano playing.

P.
_________________________
"One's real life is often the life that one does not lead."- Oscar Wilde
www.youtube.com/Biffer5
www.peytonart.com


Top
#1061044 - 11/23/08 03:15 PM Re: Goodbye
Roger Ransom Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/19/05
Posts: 1253
Loc: SouthWest Michigan
Look, I'm 67 and cannot play as well as I used to. My technical skill is going backward. This does not upset me. I can't do a lot of the things I used to do.

I concentrate on making the things i can play just as beautiful and as musical as I can. I am so happy that I can make music at any level. I don't know what the percentage is but I'm certain that there is a very low percentage of people on earth who can play anything at all.

As far as people who play better than me, I just admire their music, enjoy it and feel happy for them.

We can play music all our life as long as we don't have unrealistic expectations for ourselves.

relax, don't stress out over it and just enjoy playing what you can.

It's an awesome thing to be able to do.
_________________________
Laugh More
Yamaha G7 - Roland FP7

Top
#1061045 - 11/23/08 03:27 PM Re: Goodbye
ShiroKuro Online   content
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/26/04
Posts: 3473
Loc: not in Japan anymore
Wombat, with all due respect, for anyone who has posted so much and been such a presence on this forum as Frycek has, it would be more than appropriate to make a goodbye post if they decided they needed to stop posting.

Furthermore, this situation has a slightly more complicated background than "I'm too busy to post," and I think your dismissal of this thread as being based on "histrionics" is significantly lacking compassion.

I'm certainly not interested in starting an argument (dear moderator, I'll go back to lurking here in a minute.) But I just wanted to let you, Wombat, and other posters, know that your opinion about this thread is not shared by all who read/post in this forum.
_________________________
Started piano June 1999. My recordings at Box.Net:
https://app.box.com/s/j4rgyhn72uvluemg1m6u




Top
#1061046 - 11/23/08 04:21 PM Re: Goodbye
Theowne Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 1099
Loc: Toronto, Canada
 Quote:
Originally posted by Damz:
I see that my message came off completely wrong, and now I feel like a horrible person.[/b]
While your post may have been a bit blunt, it does not approach the level of oddness that some of Reaper978's later statements in that thread had.

I don't really know Frycek well enough to presume anything about what caused him/her to be demotivated in such a way, but regardless of this, the comments I have mentioned were so utterly strange to see in this forum that I wondered how anyone could actually voice them in such a way.

As for this thread, I have heard some of Frycek's recordings, and I don't find anything lacking in "musicality" in them, nor do I think they are mediocre in any way. This forum is fairly unique and aimed at a very specific demographic, and it would be a shame for a member to leave because they think they aren't "good enough" for it.
_________________________
http://www.youtube.com/user/Theowne- Piano Videos (Ravel, Debussy, etc) & Original Compositions
音楽は楽しいですね。。。

Top
#1061047 - 11/23/08 04:40 PM Re: Goodbye
YD Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 590
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
 Quote:
Originally posted by Theowne:

As for this thread, I have heard some of Frycek's recordings, and I don't find anything lacking in "musicality" in them, nor do I think they are mediocre in any way. This forum is fairly unique and aimed at a very specific demographic, and it would be a shame for a member to leave because they think they aren't "good enough" for it. [/b]
Ditto. I refrained voicing my thoughts here for their triviality, but since the thread grew to the level of general "cheer up," here it goes:
Frycek is an asset to this forum, period. No matter what others say, and, come to think of it, no matter what the technical level of your playing is, as far as I am concerned, I have not seen anything in this forum by Frycek that wasn't in at least some respect valuable to at least some participants (can't say the same about other posters, myself included \:D ). No pressure from me, but I'd rather you keep playing and posting, I truly think it enriches the little world we make for ourselves here.
_________________________
Yuri
FWIW; YMMV

Top
#1061048 - 11/23/08 04:41 PM Re: Goodbye
YD Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 590
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Hmm, sometimes my English is just horrible... ROTFL
_________________________
Yuri
FWIW; YMMV

Top
#1061049 - 11/23/08 07:02 PM Re: Goodbye
gmm1 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/03/06
Posts: 1674
Loc: Spokane WA
Hey kiddo...

I've held off posting as I really am at a loss for words. Like YD, I feel that whatever I might have to add is trivial at best. But, I do want to add my thanks to you for your support of me and others over the years, and to let you know, if you decide it's best for you to back off for a while, that you will be missed.

I recall offering to trade all my guitars for just half of your skills. The offer still stands...

I wish for you happiness and peace.
_________________________
"There is nothing remarkable about it. All one has to do is hit the right keys at the right time and the instrument plays itself." Johann Sebastian Bach/Gyro

Top
#1061050 - 11/23/08 07:25 PM Re: Goodbye
NancyM333 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/06/06
Posts: 1547
Loc: Roswell, Georgia
Hi Frycek--

Hopefully, you are reading the posts here and feeling the support you have. I have felt the way you describe before--in piano, my reach definitely does exceed my ability to grasp. I love the beautiful pieces of Chopin and Liszt, and many make me sound like I'm all thumbs. I have learned from some of my over-ambitious choices that I will gain something from the effort, even if the end result is not something I would share with others. Mostly, I must admit, I just try to aim a little lower to avoid that discouragement.

I gain a lot from your contributions and hope you will continue to make your pursuit of music a communal one with us.

Sincerely,

Nancy
_________________________

Estonia 168, Yamaha UX3

Top
#1061051 - 11/23/08 09:52 PM Re: Goodbye
Danny Niklas Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/15/08
Posts: 905
Loc: Switzerland
Fricek,

You must use negative criticism as a motivational trigger. If we had to get depressed anytime someone insults or harshly criticize us, we should all be cronically depressed. There are so many people in this world, and no matter how talented and good and attractive you are, there will always be a lot of people opposed to you and ready to criticize you. Professional pianists are strongly criticized every day, and there are even "anti" forum out there. Rubinstein and Horowits have their non-fan-clubs on usenet.

There are so many writers, actors, musicians, dancers who have been told by their teachers and peers to find another job or another occupation.
There are famous dancers who had been suggested to give up ballets because of their body type.

I'm a fitness nut and I listen daily to inspirational stories which show me, not only that nothing is truly impossible but that we're more likely to succeed when we ignore those who harshly criticize us for aiming high.

Don't let criticism and even hard times discorauge you, use them instead to get more motivated and fired up. What doesn't kill you make you stronger, and criticism and even momentary failure are that sort of thing.

Your musical abilities are not something passive you have or don't. You build your abilities, and if you feel (for whatever reason) that you're lacking in them, that shouldn't discourage you but increase your determination in succeeding. As we say where I live "that should make your claws come out".

Top
#1061052 - 11/23/08 10:44 PM Re: Goodbye
gabytu Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/26/05
Posts: 1522
Loc: Portland, Or.
Frycek. Don't even think about quitting. It is obvious you love the piano, and that is what is important.

I haven't a clue as to what you mean when you say you are "lacking some fundamental musicality." Who told you that? And again, I ask,what does it mean?

What is important is the joy you get from playing the piano. If someone has belittled your playing, ignore them.

Sure, it is an uphill battle, and there will always be compositions beyond our reach. But the journey is worth it. Gaby Tu

Top
#1061053 - 11/24/08 03:15 AM Re: Goodbye
Mati Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/25/05
Posts: 1276
Loc: Lodz, Poland
Frycek, don't you ever think we will say "Goodbye" to you that easily. You are one of great contributors here - one with enormous knowledge, spirited and helpful. You are a friend. Don't you dare leaving us.

Piano is about heights and falls - each of use have or had or will have days of dejection. But the most important thing is to enjoy it - play for yourself, rethink your goals and take pure joy out of it. And don't get upset with comments about your playing - it is you and only you who can judge it.

Stay with us, Frycek.

My best wishes,
Mateusz
_________________________
Mateusz Papiernik
My youtube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/Maticomp
"One man can make a difference" - Wilton Knight
Kawai CN21 (digital), Henryk Yamayuri Kawai NX-40 (grand)

Top
#1061054 - 11/24/08 03:59 AM Re: Goodbye
cruiser Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/19/07
Posts: 1171
Loc: Cornwall, England
 Quote:
Originally posted by Mati:
Frycek, don't you ever think we will say "Goodbye" to you that easily. You are one of great contributors here - a man with enormous knowledge, spirited and helpful. You are a friend. Don't you dare leaving us.

Piano is about heights and falls - each of use have or had or will have days of dejection. But the most important thing is to enjoy it - play for yourself, rethink your goals and take pure joy out of it. And don't get upset with comments about your playing - it is you and only you who can judge it.

Stay with us, Frycek.

My best wishes,
Mateusz [/b]
Well said Mati!

Just one small correction, if I may... our dear Frycek is female ;\)

Top
#1061055 - 11/24/08 07:06 AM Re: Goodbye
Mati Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/25/05
Posts: 1276
Loc: Lodz, Poland
Yiiiiiikess, embarrassing! \:o Sorry! I made an instant correction.
_________________________
Mateusz Papiernik
My youtube channel: http://www.youtube.com/user/Maticomp
"One man can make a difference" - Wilton Knight
Kawai CN21 (digital), Henryk Yamayuri Kawai NX-40 (grand)

Top
#1061056 - 11/24/08 10:28 AM Re: Goodbye
mdsdurango Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/01/04
Posts: 1755
Loc: Durango Colorado
Well my curiosity got piqued and I went and searched for what started all of this.
I have to say that the piece that Frycek played and posted was one that I would never even attempt (after 35 years of playing (and still an Adult Beginner)).
And although it was obvious not a "professional" recording, it (IMO) had its positive moments and certainly gave me the impression that Frycek probably played many simpler pieces absolutely beautifully and with great musicality!
_________________________
WHAT???????
Yamaha S6, U5C, P120
http://michaelstith.com

Top
#1061057 - 11/24/08 01:17 PM Re: Goodbye
Kymber Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/25/08
Posts: 1348
Loc: MA
Please don't go....

Who told you this anyway?

If you heard me play you would think twice about your so called "mediocrity".
_________________________
“The doubters said, "Man cannot fly," The doers said, "Maybe, but we'll try,"
And finally soared in the morning glow while non-believers watched from below.”
― Bruce Lee

Top
#1061058 - 11/24/08 02:40 PM Re: Goodbye
TrapperJohn Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 3571
Loc: Chocolatetown, USA
 Quote:
Originally posted by -Frycek:
I have finally recognized my mediocrity and will no longer be taking advantage of the kindness of you all by participation in the ecitals or the discussions. [/b]
And just what's so bad about mediocroty ? Some of us here have been working long & hard just to ultimately get to that exalted level, and would happily settle for a certain degree of respectable mediocrity!

Believe me when I say that I know mediocrity when I hear it (and when I play it) and you don't qualify - in fact, you're over-qualified, which means, in effect, you're just too good . Sorry, but that's just the way it is - so, forget about it, move on, get busy on your next piece because you'll just have to deal with it and get over it - no mediocrity for you pal!

Regards, JF
_________________________
Every difficulty slurred over will be a ghost to disturb your repose later on. Frederic Chopin

Current favorite bumper sticker: Wag more, bark less.

Top
#1061059 - 11/24/08 04:16 PM Re: Goodbye
GeePee Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/30/08
Posts: 30
Loc: Christchurch, New Zealand
 Quote:
Originally posted by John Frank:
 Quote:
Originally posted by -Frycek:
I have finally recognized my mediocrity and will no longer be taking advantage of the kindness of you all by participation in the ecitals or the discussions. [/b]
And just what's so bad about mediocroty ? Some of us here have been working long & hard just to ultimately get to that exalted level, and would happily settle for a certain degree of respectable mediocrity!
[/b]
"Respectable mediocrity" ... what a great level to achieve.

Do any of you remember toward the end of the movie "Amadeaus", where the character playing the part of Antonio Salieri was being wheeled out of the mental institution. He declared himself to be the "patron saint of mediocrity" before "forgiving" all the other inmates around him.

I know it was just a movie, but imagine for a moment that history had indeed recorded this very utterance from Salieri. Since his music is still played and heard today then I say bring on mediocrity!

The point is Frycek, the character Salieri in the movie was doing what we all do, comparing what we currently do/have with those that can do more/have more ... this comparison is the basis of most of our human so called "unhappiness". Bring the focus back to your love for playing piano and the personal enjoyment you get from it, not to mention the enjoyment others get from your playing (even if you're still comparing yourself to Vladimir Ashkenazy and coming up short), and get a smile back on you dial.

Now that's an order girl!
_________________________
Grotrian Steinweg Charis 208

Top
#1061060 - 11/24/08 04:36 PM Re: Goodbye
Manndrew Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/23/08
Posts: 267
Loc: Massachusetts
Frycek,

Well, I am fairly new to this forum and so I don't have the sense of where you are with your music. Everything that has been said, everyone that has shown their support and affection for you is proof enough of your worth as a member of the forum I simply want to tell you what music has meant to me in my life.

Like so many of us my parents were responsible for introducing me at a young age to the mysteries and challenges of the piano. Over the years, off and on, I managed to develop a decent level of playing, but the joy I received for this gift of music are immeasurable.

A few years ago my mother was in a nursing home. Now it had been many years since she heard me play. On one visit I decided to bring her down to the main dining hall (she was confined mostly to her room). There was a grand piano there. I brought her right up next to the bench, sat down and started playing for her. I think it was when I played "Summertime" that she began to cry. She said things like "Oh, Andy" and was completely overwhelmed. I told her that she was responsible for bringing the piano into my life and I thanked her for that.

This may have little to do with your situation, Frycek, but I think we have to acknowledge the gift we've been give, whether grandiose or mediocre and simply enjoy the wonder.
_________________________

Top
#1061061 - 11/24/08 04:55 PM Re: Goodbye
whippen boy Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/02/05
Posts: 3886
Loc: San Francisco
Frycek: for years I've enjoyed reading your thoughts, stories, comments - your writings reveal a unique character whom I appreciate; if you remove yourself completely, we lose much.

This has absolutely nothing to do with how well you (or any of us) play the piano.
_________________________
Grotrian 225
S&S Hamburg-C
M&H "A" at home

Top
#1061062 - 11/24/08 04:57 PM Re: Goodbye
ProdigalPianist Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/08/07
Posts: 1049
Loc: Phoenix Metro, AZ
This is gonna sound mean at first but read the whole thing anyway.

"Lack of musicality?" "Mediocrity" That's crap.

You were trying to play a piece that was way too hard for you. That's not mediocrity or lack of musicality. That is trying to play a piece of music that is way too hard for you! It is probably painful to hear, but it certainly can't be worse than telling yourself you lack musicality or are mediocre!

You do not lack musicality. Musicality cannot come to the fore if you are struggling (or failing) to hang on to the technical demands of a piece for dear life. You can only demonstrate musicality, and improve it, when you are playing a piece that is comfortably within your grasp.

This doesn't mean that you should only play "easy" stuff...it means you should be realistic about choosing pieces that will be possible to play with a certain amount of work and a good teacher. And increasing the level of difficulty gradually.

Take the best grade school football player in the US. He's hot stuff, right? Then have him play a game with an NFL team. He's gonna get creamed. Does that mean he's "mediocre" or "lacks talent"? NO. It means he has a lot to learn and a lot of growing to do before he can play in the NFL.

No I am not suggesting you are at the level of a grade school kid, it's just an example...amateur musicians compare themselves to professional musicians, that's just the way we are. And it's not really a fair comparison, because we are rarely playing music that is as well learned and technically within our grasp as they are.

Child prodigies aside :rolleyes: you can't just pick up a very advanced piece and learn it...unless you have done the technical groundwork first. You can't build something without the necessary tools in the toolbox. In fact, wasn't that the original point of your post in that thread?
_________________________
Adult Amateur Pianist

My only domestic quality is that I live in a house.

Top
#1061063 - 11/24/08 05:08 PM Re: Goodbye
jasperkeys Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/22/05
Posts: 411
Loc: Safford, AZ
Frycek,
The other day I heard someone say to a young man about learning a musical instrument, "You'll only get out of if what you put into it." I only wish that were true all of the time. The fact is, there will be days when your fingers absolutely refuse to cooperate that you'll wonder what good all the practice was. Of course, the good days more than make up for the bad days and you'll be thankful you can play no matter what your skill level. We all wish we could play better than we can right now and yes, sometimes there are fleeting thoughts of giving up. Next day we'll be at it again. What else can we do?
Frycek, my advice is to think back and try to remember why you wanted to play music to begin with. Was it to impress friends? Was it because of the wish to reproduce the sweet sounds you had heard? Perhaps a combination of both? I believe you began to play the piano because of your love of music and the feeling that you had something of yourself you could express through the piano. Despite the technical difficulties we grapple with, after all is said and done the piano sounds so beautiful on those days when we get it right. Sometimes we just have to put one foot in front of the other to keep going. Sounds like you've got a lot of friends here.
_________________________
"I wish there was a way to know you're in the good old days before you've actually left them." Andy Bernard

Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >

Moderator:  BB Player, casinitaly 
What's Hot!!
HOW TO POST PICTURES on the Piano Forums
-------------------
Sharing is Caring!
About the Buttons
-------------------
Forums Rules & Help
-------------------
ADVERTISE
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
(ad) HAILUN Pianos
Hailun Pianos - Click for More
Ad (Seiler/Knabe)
Seiler Pianos
Sheet Music
(PW is an affiliate)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
Who's Online
169 registered (acortot, accordeur, Abby Pianoman, 36251, 52 invisible), 1876 Guests and 20 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Stats
75896 Members
42 Forums
156839 Topics
2304540 Posts

Max Online: 15252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Speaker/monitor quieries
by Enthusiast
26 minutes 35 seconds ago
Rubinstein or horowitz couldn't play op 10 no 1?
by rov
27 minutes 44 seconds ago
For Sale: PE-2 PIANO PEDAL EXTENDER
by TakomaRose
Today at 02:04 PM
How is this possible?
by kaanguner
Today at 02:03 PM
Questions About Piano Magic for Sheet Music Readers
by newbert
Today at 01:51 PM
(ads by Google)

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
|
Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2014 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission