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#1073095 - 07/27/08 11:33 AM Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
Strat Offline
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Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 557
Loc: Toronto, Canada
Wondering if anybody could suggest some that would be feasible considering I've been playing for a year, only.
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#1073096 - 07/27/08 11:55 AM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
Woody-Woodruff Offline
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Registered: 01/11/08
Posts: 605
Loc: Coastal Mississippi
I would recommend starting out with the Waltz's. The A-Minor is fairly easy to learn and play and work your way up from there. The C#-minor Nocturne (see below) starts out fairly easy. Try it, you'll like it.
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#1073097 - 07/27/08 12:03 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
-Frycek Offline
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Registered: 08/06/05
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Loc: SC Mountains
The least difficult of the etudes is probably 10/6. Eleanor Bailie calls it grade 8 but I don't see why. You might at least explore the possibilty of that one. As far as genre is concerned, Chopin's waltzes and mazurkas have the highest proportion of less demanding pieces.
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#1073098 - 07/27/08 12:06 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
Strat Offline
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Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 557
Loc: Toronto, Canada
Never heard etudes being referred to as 10/6. Is that its title, somehow?

WW - Yeah, I adore that one. It has a haunting quality, which is probably why it's the 1st track on The Pianist soundtrack (which I can't get enough of - amazing interpretations!). I'll look into it, but there are some difficult passages for sure.
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#1073099 - 07/27/08 12:11 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
-Frycek Offline
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Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5310
Loc: SC Mountains
 Quote:
Originally posted by Strat:
Never heard etudes being referred to as 10/6. Is that its title, somehow?
[/b]
Chopin published two sets of twelve etudes each. The opus numbers are Op 10 and Op 25. 10/6 just means the sixth etude in Op 10. This is a usual way of referring to Chopin's etudes. The famous "Revolutionary" etude is 10/12 meaning Op 10, number 12. The "Winter Wind" etude is 25/11 meaning Op 25 number 11.
With the possible except of 10/6 the etudes range from difficult (grade 8) to more difficult (grade 8+) to very difficult (diploma level.)
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#1073100 - 07/27/08 12:25 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
loveschopintoomuch Offline
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Registered: 04/05/06
Posts: 4668
Loc: Illinois
This is a bit off the topic, but I ruined my copy of Spring Song by Chopin. I can't remember where I can download another copy for free.

BTW, Strat...this is relatively easy and quite lovely.

Thanks,
Kathleen
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After playing Chopin, I feel as if I had been weeping over sins that I had never committed, and mourning over tragedies that were not my own." Oscar Wilde, 1891

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#1073101 - 07/27/08 12:33 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
Mr. K Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/25/08
Posts: 84
Loc: Louisville, KY
Hey Strat, this isn't an Etude, but I just started working on Prelude No. 9 in E Major. I heard it and liked it, and it's only a page long. It's pretty but it only lasts about a minute and is much less demanding than a lot of other Chopin. I know you said you're looking for Etudes but I would listen to the Preludes and see how they grab you. They're shorter, many of them only a page long so there's less to memorize, and I think many of them are easier technically than the Etudes. Listen to a couple of the Preludes first.

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#1073102 - 07/28/08 01:17 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
Strat Offline
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Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 557
Loc: Toronto, Canada
That's a good suggestion, but if my memory serves me right (and it seldom does, so I could be wrong), the Etudes aren't as melodic-sounding as the Nocturnes... which is why I wanted to focus on those.

But I'll check out the preludes. Maybe I'll find something interesting and realistic to play.
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#1073103 - 07/28/08 01:37 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
sotto voce Offline
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Registered: 08/15/06
Posts: 6163
Loc: Briarcliff Manor, NY, USA
Strat,

The easier preludes are the first pieces by Chopin that many people learn. And, of course, "ease" is relative; less technical challenge doesn't mean they're easy to play well musically.

If you're set on an etude and don't find 10/6 to your liking, there's another that should be manageable: Trois Nouvelles Etudes #2 in A-flat major. (It's #3 in some editions, and either #26 or #27 in volumes of the complete Chopin etudes.)

The "easiest" nocturne is probably 37/1 in g minor. 15/3, also in g minor, has an easy first section, but the second part (and the transition leading to it) are somewhat harder. Other possible candidates for an ambitious beginner would be 9/2 in E-flat major, 55/1 in f minor and 72/1 in e minor.

There's a posthumous nocturne in c-sharp minor that's worth mentioning, too. I don't find much musical substance in it, but it's popular nonetheless and not difficult.

Steven
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Chopin: Allegro de Concert Op. 46
Schumann: Toccata Op. 7
Fauré: Ballade Op. 19

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#1073104 - 07/28/08 01:56 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
BB Player Offline

2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/17/06
Posts: 2335
Loc: Not in Texas
 Quote:
Originally posted by loveschopintoomuch:
This is a bit off the topic, but I ruined my copy of Spring Song by Chopin. I can't remember where I can download another copy for free.

Thanks,
Kathleen [/b]
Do you mean Springtime? If so and if you subscribe to Pianist magazine, it was in there a couple of issues back (I believe issue 40).
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#1073105 - 07/28/08 04:17 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
Strat Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 557
Loc: Toronto, Canada
 Quote:
Originally posted by sotto voce:
Strat,

The easier preludes are the first pieces by Chopin that many people learn. And, of course, "ease" is relative; less technical challenge doesn't mean they're easy to play well musically.[/b]
THANK YOU! Most people don't know the difference between playing the notes and having music flowing through your fingers.

I'll definitely check into the other suggestions as well.

Thanks a lot, everybody! \:D
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#1073106 - 07/29/08 12:43 AM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
YD Offline

500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 590
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
Gentlemen:
Strat has been playing for a year; I think suggesting any if 10/ or 25/ is a great disservice to his development as a pianist (unless he is incredibly talented and dedicated, which I certainly hope is the case; in that case, we'll see him in Carnegie Hall pretty soon).

Strat:
I would advise against even the easiest of Chopin Etudes. Like you said, "Most people don't know the difference between playing the notes and having music flowing through your fingers." Op.10 and Op.25 are incredibly dense musically, even the easiest ones are very hard to play right with correct phrasing, required evenness and appropriate accentuation.
Now for suggestion. Did you play the easier Chopin pieces yet? Specifically, prelude #4? I know, it is kind of gloomy, but it's one of quintessential Chopin pieces nevertheless.
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FWIW; YMMV

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#1073107 - 07/29/08 09:46 AM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
Peyton Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/02/06
Posts: 2207
Loc: Maine
Strat, back in October 07 you were working on Chopin's Nocturne in C# m (Post). How did that go? I've listened to a number of your recordings and I would guess you could handle that well. For that matter, the way you play I would guess you could take on a good number of the Nocturnes.Take a look/listen to 9/1. That was the first one I learned to play and I still love it.
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#1073108 - 07/29/08 10:27 AM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
btb Offline
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Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 3669
Loc: Pretoria South Africa
Hi yuri,
Forgive the wish to want to shade your broad statement "Op. 10 and Op.25 are incredibly DENSE musically".

Dense tends to suggest a plump shading (not letting through much light) ... and yet most of the Etudes are Spartan in the athletic use of single-note outlines ... would it not be more correct to say that the Etudes are "divergent" ... spread over a large canvas ... treble and bass note patterns often as much as 3 to 4 octaves apart.

How this wide spread still maintains musical cohesion is a tribute to the genius of Chopin.

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#1073109 - 07/29/08 12:42 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
Strat Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 557
Loc: Toronto, Canada
To be honest, Yuri, I'm not familiar with most of Chopin's catalog seeing as how I discovered his works not too long ago. I'll be sure to give Prelude #4 a listen. There are a few Final Fantasy pieces I'd love to play, but the lot of them are far too advanced for my limited skills.

Peyton, thank you for the kind words. I try & I work hard, but sometimes that might be enough if I'm not advanced enough to give a given piece life. As a guitar player who actually plays very well, I can't tell you the number of so-called guitarists who would butcher a tune in a million different ways. I do not want to be one of those people who bite off more than they can chew and end up committing musical murder. lol!

Right now, I'm working on polishing Wind Crest, a piece from Final Fantasy X-2. Fur Elise would be a beautiful piece that I'd like to master, but the chordal section right before the main theme repeats itself and the legato phrasing after the bridge sound too complicated to me. Of course, I could be wrong, but it doesn't *sound* simple to me.

It would be a treat for me to be able to say that I have actually *finished* a Chopin piece. The Nocturne in C# was actually the 48.1 and although it's my favorite Nocturne, it gets far too complex with the rolling chords, so I had to stop when they showed up. \:\(
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#1073110 - 07/29/08 01:19 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8452
Loc: Ohio, USA
Chopin etude op.10.9 perhaps is among the easiest. i learned it and it was not too bad.

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#1073111 - 07/29/08 01:52 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
loveschopintoomuch Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/05/06
Posts: 4668
Loc: Illinois
There is a lovely nocturne by Chopin that is rated as a 6. It is not often played, and I don't know why because it is quite lovely...very Polish sounding. It's Nocturne in C minor, Posth.

Kathleen
_________________________
After playing Chopin, I feel as if I had been weeping over sins that I had never committed, and mourning over tragedies that were not my own." Oscar Wilde, 1891

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#1073112 - 07/29/08 07:39 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
YD Offline

500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 590
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
 Quote:
Originally posted by btb:
Hi yuri,
Forgive the wish to want to shade your broad statement "Op. 10 and Op.25 are incredibly DENSE musically".

Dense tends to suggest a plump shading (not letting through much light) ... and yet most of the Etudes are Spartan in the athletic use of single-note outlines ... would it not be more correct to say that the Etudes are "divergent" ... spread over a large canvas ... treble and bass note patterns often as much as 3 to 4 octaves apart.

How this wide spread still maintains musical cohesion is a tribute to the genius of Chopin. [/b]
Ah, thanx for the comment, btb. What I meant when I said "dense" is the density of elements of importance in the music (that is in constrast, say, to some classical sonatas where there are large stretches of scores that are there for the sake of the form). Now that you brought it up, the word "dense" does sound wrong \:\)
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#1073113 - 07/29/08 07:57 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
-Frycek Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5310
Loc: SC Mountains
Concentrated maybe?
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#1073114 - 07/29/08 08:21 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
YD Offline

500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 590
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
 Quote:
Originally posted by -Frycek:
Concentrated maybe? [/b]
Yes, that's it, thanx, Frycek!
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Yuri
FWIW; YMMV

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#1073115 - 08/01/08 01:16 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
Strat Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 557
Loc: Toronto, Canada
I'll be looking into Prelude #20. Happy songs don't interest me, but heavy or sad songs facinate me. Should be easy to learn and fun to add subtle coloring elements.

Can't wait until I buy a Roland HP-207 in 1.5 months to play this properly. \:\)
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#1073116 - 08/01/08 01:36 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
mwf Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/11/06
Posts: 398
Loc: Peterborough, England
Whatever you do dont attempt op10/1!!! I still cant play it and I have been playing piano for over 10 years, I consider myself an advanced player too, but its still such a difficult piece, its definatley diploma level this one!
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#1073117 - 08/01/08 02:52 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
Strat Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/02/07
Posts: 557
Loc: Toronto, Canada
The good news is that my ear is *very* developed, so I know how to recognize an advanced piece even when it doesn't show at 1st glance.

If it were up to me, I'd play a whole bunch of Nocturnes and a slew of Rachmaninoff pieces, but I'm definitely not even near that stage, yet. Hopefully, I'll reach it, someday.

I do work hard...

*fingers crossed*
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#1073118 - 08/01/08 03:10 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
YD Offline

500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 590
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
 Quote:
Originally posted by mwf:
Whatever you do dont attempt op10/1!!! I still cant play it and I have been playing piano for over 10 years, I consider myself an advanced player too, but its still such a difficult piece, its definatley diploma level this one! [/b]
ROTFL. Horowitz is rumored to have said that he can't play 10/1 properly. Seriously, I think it is playable by advanced amature IF (that's a BIF IF) yo u can live with a slower tempo, like 120 instead of proper 144-160. Some of the broken chords there are pure torture! I've been tinkering with it for years, and still havn't the guts to take a plunge.
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#1073119 - 08/01/08 03:55 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
-Frycek Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5310
Loc: SC Mountains
Yuri, what do you think about the relative difficulty of 25/10?
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#1073120 - 08/01/08 04:20 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
YD Offline

500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 590
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
 Quote:
Originally posted by -Frycek:
Yuri, what do you think about the relative difficulty of 25/10? [/b]
Sorry, Frycek, I don't know - this one I never really approached. I guess it depends on how good you are with octaves. It is not lightning fast like 10/1 or 25/11 (or 25/12 for that matter), but all those octave FFs are certain to make it very tiring...
Have you looked here
http://www.chopinmusic.net/en/works/etudes/
?
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Yuri
FWIW; YMMV

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#1073121 - 08/01/08 07:21 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
mwf Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/11/06
Posts: 398
Loc: Peterborough, England
hmmmmmm... looked at that chopin link, interesting take on them. At last someone actually describes the op25/12 etude as the hardest out of them all! I have heard so much about this etude being one of the easiest! I dont see how it is personally, it requires incredible stamina and accuracy from the pianist.
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#1073122 - 08/01/08 09:05 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
YD Offline

500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/06
Posts: 590
Loc: San Francisco Bay Area
 Quote:
Originally posted by mwf:
hmmmmmm... looked at that chopin link, interesting take on them. At last someone actually describes the op25/12 etude as the hardest out of them all! I have heard so much about this etude being one of the easiest! I dont see how it is personally, it requires incredible stamina and accuracy from the pianist. [/b]
25/12 one of the easiest????? You've gotta be kidding me! In my view, it is certainly in the top 4 spots with 10/1, 25/6 and 25/11. Which one is really the hardest I don't know; maybe 10/1, maybe not.
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#1073123 - 08/01/08 10:59 PM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
-Frycek Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5310
Loc: SC Mountains
Thanks for the link, Yuri. I hadn't seen that. I think I will explore 25/10 with the possiblity of next year. I've got pretty high endurance - if nothing else. ;\)
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#1073124 - 08/02/08 12:46 AM Re: Easier Chopin nocturnes/etudes?
gerg Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/02/07
Posts: 1650
Loc: Houston, TX
25/10 is not too tough mentally, physically yes.

I approached it as a young man in my early twenties. Like 28/18, I only started it, never finished.

It is physically exhausting to play, mentally, not too tough. The sound of it reminds one of huge dusty old bellows, or a tornado - something to do with wind...

You're a fighter, Frycek. You should tackle that beastie! (after 10/12 of course :-) )
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