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#1077412 - 12/31/08 12:03 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
blues flat 7 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 86
Loc: PA
 Quote:
Originally posted by Dave123:
All the things I am doing I have no doubt it will help me learn the piano. Some of the examples I have listened to on this thread is the direction I would like to go in.
I did get some DVD lessons from Mr Music Canada and I was surprised I did manage to get a couple his songs down quite well albeit not up to speed yet. I am not sure at this stage of the game if I am ready for the course, but my thoughts are my whole reason for me wanting to learn piano is right in that course, going off the information I have read and the samples I have heard. [/b]
I know what you mean. I have been jumping around a lot with different methods, but mostly reading so far.
Pete, I do have one question and there is no hurry. Just anytime that you get a chance, would you be able to leave a few tips on transfering that music to lead sheet? Don't leave any of the music but just the way you think when writing the lead sheet. I did purchase the Carpenters song from the link you posted above.
Maybe Rosa or Alene knows too ???

Thanks,
Dale
aka blues flat 7
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#1077413 - 12/31/08 03:34 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Pete the bean Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/06/04
Posts: 450
Loc: Canada
Rosa: I like your 2nd version of Hola very much. You are keeping busy on this song. I have one more worksheet for you. I got this idea from your version of Top of the World. Once again, you have changed things up, and created your own version which is so wonderful about playing by lead sheet.
So the idea is this. You are playing a lot of Root 5th and octave root pattern in Top of the World. You are a small step away from using the Latin Stride pattern. Find it here in this handout; http://www.sendspace.com/file/1hbg6x

The handout contains the Latin stride pattern for the B section of Hola.
Also, my tips about using 4 note chords in the A section of Hola were meant for the LH stride pattern. You will see a quick example of that at the top of the handout.

I will post some Latin stride songs. This pattern is also useful for pop ballad style, latin and Tango. It depends on how smooth or accented you play it.
My favorite song with this pattern is Hotel California.


Ragtime Clown; Thanks for sending me your hard work. I hope the suggestions I emailed you are of assistance.

Dave: Hang around. I am writing a set of easy blues pieces to get walking bass lines down. You may be able to get started on that. I will PM you when they get posted.

Blues Flat 7: Most of the songs I find are in Piano /Vocal/ Guitar format. That means they are often 6 or more pages long. Often a whole page is written out because 1 syllable is added in the second verse.

I use Finale print music to write out my sheets. My handwriting is a big mess and my handwritten charts are often a mystery even to me.

When creating my lead sheet, I often leave out the intro from the PVG chart unless there is a specific hook. I write out the top line(singers part) and the chords symbols above the singers line.
I usually write out the whole piece and then edit out any verses that are repeats with a slight variation. (No one has ever complained so far.)

If there is a section of the song that is not working on the piano, I will dump that too. No one has ever complained about that either.

If there are any odd sections like a measure of music that makes sense on the recording but doesn't fiton the piano arrangement, I get the axe out and chop. I end up with a tighter arrangement.Most songs I fit on a single sheet or half of the next.

If I was teaching Top of the World at my studio, I would only pencil in the LH notes onto the lead sheet (Bb F in bar 1) in measures where the chord shows up in the piece the first time. Should the chord appear a second time, I leave that LH pencil marks blank. This means my student has got to go back to where the chord has appeared for the first time. This gets a bit frustrating and soon just learning the notes of the chord is easier than repeatedly going back to find the first appearance of the chord.

I used to write everything out and be nice , but found no one really got the information into their head when it was easier just to read my notes. 5 years later, they still could not play a simple chord without assistance.

Writing out charts is work. I have several fake books with 1000 songs. However, I am always looking for the best songs. e,g.Roxanne cost me 25 bucks because I could only find it in a whole book. The rest of the Police material did not sound outstanding when played as a solo piano arrangement. (I have lots of $25 songs). Musicnotes .com is a God send for being able to download a single song.

I could transcribe the song off the recording but the time it would take makes the $25 a better deal (if time is money).

I have been doing this since I was 14 and that was 1974.
I have learned a lot about picking the right song- The hardest part of playing Pop by lead sheet is finding good songs that can take the pattern treatment. If it cant take the pattern approach, mediocre is the best the song will sound on solo piano arrangement. If you like American Songbook Standards, it is easy to find songs.

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#1077414 - 12/31/08 06:20 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Ragtime Clown Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/03/08
Posts: 684
Loc: Ireland
Pete, its amazing how a simple two-beat pattern can throw you. I've started by playing the two beat pattern on the left hand and throb style chords on right. i think this is important in order that I develop the pattern without the complication of adding melody fills. Would you agree?

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#1077415 - 12/31/08 12:05 PM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
rosa2007 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 168
Loc: Hong Kong
Thanks Ragtime Clown for your kind words and Pete for the help you are giving to each one of us.

I looked at the pdf file and really like the Latin stride pattern you put there. I never thought of playing it like that. I always play the first beat octave and then come up to play on the 2nd beat. But the way you notated is very very very .... (indeedy) easy to play and I love it. I'll try to see if I can incorporate this into On Top of the World.

We don't want to overwork you. So what you do for Ragtime clown and Dave123 about the blues, and b7, you can just post everything here and we will all feast on everything you offer. I like the songs that Clown chooses so we can work on common things together.

Hey, it's already new year in HK. I have already stepped into 2009. Want to wish Pete and everyone here a Happy Fun Year 2009!!!! :3hearts:

Rosa

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#1077416 - 12/31/08 07:26 PM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Alene Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/03/05
Posts: 78
Loc: Oregon
\:\) Hi Everyone and Happy New Year!

Rosa, your recordings are really nice and along with Pete's, I'm inspired to give it a try. I haven't rec'd the book yet,of course, but I'm trying out the first lesson.

This still needs work and the recording button scares me witless but I'm hoping to learn so if I don't give it a try I'll be missing the opportunity Pete is giving us....which is really appreciated.

http://www.box.net/shared/b6xecgliq7

I tried putting in the 4-note chords on the A section and the 10th in the B section....while a lot of thinking was going on so it's not too smooth.

Any help would be appreciated!

Alene

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#1077417 - 12/31/08 08:11 PM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Pete the bean Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/06/04
Posts: 450
Loc: Canada
Alene: Holy Smokes! Lots of good ideas happening in your improv. I am glad you are having to think. I hope it means you are learning some new tricks and pushing your boundaries.
I loved the little chromatic line on the last 4 chords. I was thinking that an E major arpeggio would fit on top of your final Am chord to keep the tension going. This would give you Am(maj9) which is a big word for E major / Aminor.
Keep pushing that record button. And keep playing things over many times. You will get smoother the more you do this.
I hope you are having fun.

Rosa: Since we are on the topic of Carpenter's and Latin stride, try We've only just Begun - Latin stride A section, Straight stride B section
Happy New Year All!

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#1077418 - 12/31/08 11:43 PM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Alene Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/03/05
Posts: 78
Loc: Oregon
\:\) Hi Pete: Thank you so much for the comments and the tip about playing the Am(Maj9) for the last arpeggio. I just tried it and I'm going to like it with some practice. That's such an easy way to remember what any minor(Maj 9) chord is...just play the minor chord with it's 5th in a major chord above....how neat!

I haven't used some of these different rhythm patterns so it's fun to learn them plus haven't done a lot of improvising so have lots to learn.

This is a great thread and so nice of you to help us out.

Alene

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#1077419 - 01/01/09 12:40 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
rosa2007 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 168
Loc: Hong Kong
 Quote:

Alene: Holy Smokes! Lots of good ideas happening in your improv............
Keep pushing that record button.

Way to go Al!!! I am so glad you posted your recording. Yes, keep pushing that record button....and post them for all of us to enjoy. Thanks for a great recording.

Pete, great.....I'm going to try We've only just begun.....great song. RagClown, are you joining us? You'll love playing this song. \:\)

Rosa

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#1077420 - 01/01/09 05:54 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Ragtime Clown Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/03/08
Posts: 684
Loc: Ireland
Rosa and Alene, you are really putting on the pressure here. I feel that I'm being left behind here. I get up this morning to find one of my favorite Carpenters tunes given the full treatment by Pete our maestro, he really has the knack of simplifying everything on the piano so far.

Written arrangements of many songs I look at are beyond me but with Pete he seems to take the complexity out of everything.

I have to spend the next few days putting a lot of his lessons to practice and more to the point, joining in on the recording!

PS. I'm really getting into Hola. I think this is a good starting point before I take on The Carpenters.


Happy New Year to all!

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#1077421 - 01/01/09 10:07 PM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
blues flat 7 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 86
Loc: PA
 Quote:
Originally posted by Ragtime Clown:
Rosa and Alene, you are really putting on the pressure here. I feel that I'm being left behind here. [/b]
RC, I am the one that is being left behind. I tried Hola today, and the left hand chords went fine, but the right hand fingering of the melody is my problem. I am reading the notes fine, I just always stumble on fingering. Hope to get over this.

Happy New Year Everyone....

Dale
_________________________
http://pianotips.freeforums.org/
Adding stuff to a Piano Tips forum little by little.
Please add some tips to it too!

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#1077422 - 01/01/09 11:23 PM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Alene Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/03/05
Posts: 78
Loc: Oregon
Pete: Your recording Of "We've only just Begun" was beautiful and I know we all want to sound like you do but it's fun trying.

Dale & Tony: You are not being left behind, it's just that we are all learning something different than what we are used to....you'll notice I had many mistakes too. I must stay on this first lesson trying to learn all the patterns for rhythm and being free with that right hand melody so don't worry we just all have to work with what we can....baby steps will get us there, we hope! Plus Pete's guidance!

It's lots of fun to work together on things and we can learn from each other also so no pressure from me as you can tell that I struggle too.

Alene

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#1077423 - 01/02/09 12:18 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Pete the bean Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/06/04
Posts: 450
Loc: Canada
Alene: About sounding like me- Don't compare how you sound with how I sound. It is not fair unless we are on the same instrument.
I have invested heavily into a Mac computer and Ivory piano plug in software. I sound good without even playing a note.

My hot tip is that it is easy to pedal too much on a digital. Dampers are usually full on or right off on a digital . Not the most realistic situation. Editing the pedaling can take a lot of time when I am working a project.

Blues Flat 7: I suggest working RH alone in small sections to get the fingering down. Bar 8 is not exactly easy.

To All: I start the pop piano pro material with my students once we have reached Faber Piano Adventures level 3b. I would encourage you to keep up your method book work to the end of level 3 before dedicating too much time to my book. If you can work with a good teacher, you will progress much more rapidly.

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#1077424 - 01/02/09 12:35 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Dave123 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/24/08
Posts: 203
Loc: Canada
 Quote:
Originally posted by Pete the bean:


To All: I start the pop piano pro material with my students once we have reached Faber Piano Adventures level 3b. I would encourage you to keep up your method book work to the end of level 3 before dedicating too much time to my book. If you can work with a good teacher, you will progress much more rapidly. [/b]
*waves hand in air with next dumb question \:\) *
what is level 3 Faber piano equate to in other methods, particularly Alfred's that I am working with?

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#1077425 - 01/02/09 01:13 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Pete the bean Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/06/04
Posts: 450
Loc: Canada
Dave: I would advise completing level 2 Alfred's Adult Method book before I would proceed too far into my stuff. You need some basics.

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#1077426 - 01/02/09 11:26 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Dave123 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/24/08
Posts: 203
Loc: Canada
Okily-dokily

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#1077427 - 01/02/09 11:32 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
rosa2007 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 168
Loc: Hong Kong
Here is my version of We've Only Just Begun for the new Year 2009.

http://www.box.net/shared/83jh37lgup :rolleyes:

I really like this Latin stride pattern.
Do let me know what you all think. We are in this together so any comments help. (Ragclown, there is no such thing as falling behind, we are all beginning together. ;\) )


Pete, can you see if the A section sounds right? I can't do what you did in Section B so I just went back to my comfy Octave - 5th. I could not do the Latin stride in Section B.

Pete, the audio you did for us really helps. If I didn't hear how you play that stride pattern, I would have played it much too fast, so thanks for doing the audio for us.

I am wondering if it is possible for you to post midi files instead so that we can see what you are doing. Sometimes I have to listen and guess from the mp3.

I think it would help if we can do lots of songs with this Latin stride, so that eventually it becomes auto pilot and we can easily apply to lots of songs. Is this Latin 2 beat stride applying to a 4/4 song here?

Rosa

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#1077428 - 01/02/09 11:48 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Alene Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/03/05
Posts: 78
Loc: Oregon
\:\) Rosa, that was beautiful! This is a different stride pattern for me too, so I'm practicing it so I can apply to other songs. Fun to listen to yours and Pete's both. Thanks for posting it.

Alene

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#1077429 - 01/02/09 03:02 PM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Pete the bean Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/06/04
Posts: 450
Loc: Canada
Rosa: You are a quick learner. Nice work!
Here are a couple of arranging tips.
Right at bar 1 -We've only just begun in the melody-I hear that as a pickup measure. I play a chord on beat 1 and leave out the LH pattern for that bar. It breaks the pattern up. Even if you get 1 bar different in a whole song it tends to just give a bit of relief.
Section B all I am doing is a straight stride pattern (Root Chord)
What you are doing works fine too. \:\)

Midi files: Sorry. SInce you can print the file, I am sure that it would be copyright infringement to post it.
Also-I can not stress how important it is to listen and figure it out. It may take some time to get that skill down but it will give you wings. I learned the skill by taping my lessons and going home and listening over and over.

You can use latin pattern in 4/4 as well. Just double the value of the notes in the pattern so you get dotted quaater, eighth , quarter, quarter.

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#1077430 - 01/02/09 08:00 PM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Mark... Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/27/06
Posts: 4372
Loc: Jersey Shore
I downloaded the Hola piece and was amazed how well I was able to put it together. I just used the "thros" so far, but like the sound of this so far.

In the 13th measure?? there is a C#DIM...and it does not sound right. Anyone know whats up with that?

I just might be able to play the pop/rock stuff I always wanted using this method. I think my 2 years in Alfred is making this workable.

Wow...

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#1077431 - 01/02/09 08:58 PM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Pete the bean Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/06/04
Posts: 450
Loc: Canada
Mark: The diminished chord falls on the seventh degree of the D harmonic minor scale. It is often used to lead into the tonic. It would sound tense if you play it slow or park before you reach the Dm chord.
If you still don't like it, try replacing it with the E/B that is in the same bar and see that works for you. (Did Beethoven ever suggest changing his stuff?) \:\)

I hope you are enjoying the lesson. Keep us posted on your progress.

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#1077432 - 01/02/09 09:19 PM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Mark... Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/27/06
Posts: 4372
Loc: Jersey Shore
 Quote:
Originally posted by Pete the bean:
Mark: The diminished chord falls on the seventh degree of the D harmonic minor scale. It is often used to lead into the tonic. It would sound tense if you play it slow or park before you reach the Dm chord.
If you still don't like it, try replacing it with the E/B that is in the same bar and see that works for you. (Did Beethoven ever suggest changing his stuff?) \:\)

I hope you are enjoying the lesson. Keep us posted on your progress. [/b]
Thanks Peter

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#1077433 - 01/02/09 11:50 PM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
blues flat 7 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/16/08
Posts: 86
Loc: PA
 Quote:
Originally posted by rosa2007:
Here is my version of We've Only Just Begun for the new Year 2009.
Do let me know what you all think. We are in this together so any comments help.
Rosa [/b]
Rosa,
I like it. You are really doing very well with Pop Piano Pro. It is back to the Method Book for me for a while. I can do the chords fine, but I am sooooo slow on the fingering of the melody, that I better get in a lot of right hand work on the Piano.

Pete,
You mentioned Fabers 3B. Did you mean the Popular Repertoire Piano Adventures books? I purchased 3A, 3B, 4, and 5. They have a lot of nice songs in them and will keep me busy for a while. I will also work on learning inversions from your book. Starting on Puff the Magic Dragon in 3A.
This one I can handle. Hope to get back to Hola soon.

Dale
_________________________
http://pianotips.freeforums.org/
Adding stuff to a Piano Tips forum little by little.
Please add some tips to it too!

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#1077434 - 01/03/09 12:42 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
rosa2007 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 168
Loc: Hong Kong
Thanks all for listening to my piece. My Latin stride is very stiff because I am not used to it. Pete's is very soothing but now that I know I am on the right track, I'll practice this with a few other songs like On top of the world, Puff the magic dragon, love story, etc.

Pete, thanks for the arranging tip. I will try the Root chord for section B.

I didn't realize there is the copyright issue with midi files. Thanks for letting me know.

Yes Dale, this pop piano method is working very well, esp when Pete does the audio for us to listen to. I can't stress how important these audios are because when I just read and try to apply, I tend to play everything too fast and miss the real flavor, and they don't sound good.

Also thanks Pete for all these extra tips and suggestions. You are really GREAT.

Rosa

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#1077435 - 01/03/09 01:31 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Pete the bean Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/06/04
Posts: 450
Loc: Canada
Latin Stride audio:
Fields of Gold

Good Bye Yellow Brick Road


Hotel California -wait for the verse


I'm not in Love

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#1077436 - 01/03/09 02:33 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Ragtime Clown Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/03/08
Posts: 684
Loc: Ireland
I'm on 'Top of the World' as my copy of the 'Pop Piano Pro' arrived this morning. I am really looking forward to working through it.

For anyone in doubt about this method, can I say that for two days I have been working slowly through Hola and have been able to develop a nice left hand patter, play melody notes at reasonable pace, increase my sight reading ability and apply these same techniques on other pieces.

Pete, I know this is a massive request but a video with overhead camera would be so welcome! Your latest recordings 'Goodbye Yellow Brick Road' and 'Hotel California' are excellent.

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#1077437 - 01/03/09 03:19 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Pete the bean Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/06/04
Posts: 450
Loc: Canada
Ragtime Clown: Glad you are making progress. I am hoping others are getting it as well.

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#1077438 - 01/03/09 04:08 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Ragtime Clown Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/03/08
Posts: 684
Loc: Ireland
Pete, great show! The reason I download the tracks is so I can play them in the car when driving. Its fills me with inspiration and ideas.

I have to confess that I'm a Beatles ballad fan, not much of what they did after Sgt.Pepper had the same appeal to me.

My favourites are If I fell, I'll Follow the Sun, Michelle and Girl. There is a nice version of 'If I Fell', played by the wonderful composer Henry Mancini here http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=nPXa1SaYTXU He uses a mix of arpeggios and jazzy chords to play this wonderful tune.

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#1077439 - 01/03/09 06:29 AM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Ragtime Clown Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/03/08
Posts: 684
Loc: Ireland
Apologies for the poor rendition of Hola but I just wanted to kick start my recordings. Heres is a very infantile version of Hola, mistakes and all.

I wanted to show that I was making an effort here!

http://www.box.net/shared/uxuk2bx4os

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#1077440 - 01/03/09 12:01 PM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
rosa2007 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/07
Posts: 168
Loc: Hong Kong
RC, way to go considering you only got your book today. Also it's good to post work in progress so that we can hear how we progress. Besides this is not a recital thread but a learning thread and we can learn from one another through listening to each other's recordings and with Pete coming in with his advice and suggestions.

Rosa

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#1077441 - 01/03/09 01:38 PM Re: Pop Piano Pro - Hot Tips and Mini Lessons
Alene Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/03/05
Posts: 78
Loc: Oregon
\:\) Hi Rc: I'm really glad you posted your recording as we are all learning together and it's hard to play patterns that we haven't played before while trying to improvise in the right hand also. You did good! If you are like me, that recording button can really be challenging but it's good for us to get used to it and hopefully we'll get over it somewhat. I really enjoyed listening and hearing the new things that you came up with to add to our bag of tricks.

Alene

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