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#1078011 - 11/27/04 11:52 AM Composition
Jeffrey Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/18/04
Posts: 2948
Loc: New York
Have any other adult beginners started piano composition, not just playing? How does one learn the skills for this?

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#1078012 - 11/27/04 03:15 PM Re: Composition
jdsher Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/04
Posts: 643
Loc: Plano, Texas
In the theory workbooks that I use, I am asked to compose beginning with some notes in measure 1 and measure 4. They usually ask me to use a certain key, to use sequence or repitition, and to end a certain measure on a strong beat and tonic or dominant, etc. This makes for good practice at composing.
I would suggest doing a google search for books about composing and see what you come up with.
Jon
_________________________
"In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity." Albert Einstein

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#1078013 - 11/28/04 04:56 AM Re: Composition
mikhailoh Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/20/04
Posts: 4288
Loc: Cincinnati
I have not yet, but have talked with my teacher about wanting to. Jd, what theory workbooks do you use?
_________________________
Michael

====

He is so solemn, detached and uninvolved he makes Mr. Spock look like Hunter S. Thompson at closing time.'

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#1078014 - 11/28/04 02:50 PM Re: Composition
jdsher Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/04
Posts: 643
Loc: Plano, Texas
This is the book I'm using. Number twelve is the last book in the series.
Here is a picture of the book.
Here is an idea of what one of the composing lessons looks like.
If you would like to order the series, let me know. The author lives here in Plano and is good friends with my teacher.
Jon
_________________________
"In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity." Albert Einstein

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#1078015 - 11/28/04 05:49 PM Re: Composition
Cindysphinx Offline


Registered: 02/14/03
Posts: 6416
Loc: Washington D.C. Metro
Jdsher,

Just for fun, how about you scan in some of your wonderful compositions and the rest of us go sight read them for practice.

Come on! It would be fun! We'd all have to address you as "Master Jdsher." ;\)
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#1078016 - 11/28/04 06:04 PM Re: Composition
jdsher Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/04
Posts: 643
Loc: Plano, Texas
Cindy, believe me when I say they are nothing special. However, if you want I'll send you an arrangement I made of Mendelssohn's "Shepherd's Complaint". It's pretty simple. Here's a preview.
Jon
_________________________
"In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity." Albert Einstein

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#1078017 - 11/28/04 06:06 PM Re: Composition
Cindysphinx Offline


Registered: 02/14/03
Posts: 6416
Loc: Washington D.C. Metro
Awesome! I'm off to give it a try!

*Master.*
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#1078018 - 11/28/04 06:10 PM Re: Composition
Cindysphinx Offline


Registered: 02/14/03
Posts: 6416
Loc: Washington D.C. Metro
Uh oh. I couldn't print it. How will you send it to me, Master?
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#1078019 - 11/28/04 08:25 PM Re: Composition
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8483
Loc: Ohio, USA
i did some small piece compositions as well when i got Finale notepad installed a while ago, but i didn't even learn to play them and just let Finale do it for me. they are not big deal works (who i am anyway) but i did them just for fun. i even wrote a few fugues just to see how they'd sound like.

i guess everyone can compose some simple stuff, because a simple piece such as a melody theme with repeats of it would become a song easily. however, writing a good composition is not easy, which requires the knowledge of the harmony and counterpoint theory.

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#1078020 - 11/29/04 06:06 AM Re: Composition
Cindysphinx Offline


Registered: 02/14/03
Posts: 6416
Loc: Washington D.C. Metro
You know what?

Wouldn't it be a kick in the pants to have a place here where members could submit their original compositions?

I'd like to see your stuff too, Signa. I'd like to have a go at everybody's stuff. I've never written any music, myself. Is "Finale" expensive?
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#1078021 - 11/29/04 06:14 AM Re: Composition
Teal'c Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/29/04
Posts: 34
The best score writing program is Sibelius and it costs about 600 (well over $1000). If Finale is as good then it should cost a similar amount.

(There are demo versions and "lite" versions of Finale, though, I believe.)

Anyway, the best way to get into composition is to sit at the piano and experiment. It's all very well reading theory books but if you don't experiment at the piano you will be lost on how to actually use the theory you know, because music is such an open and inaccurate subject.

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#1078022 - 11/29/04 07:14 AM Re: Composition
jdsher Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/04
Posts: 643
Loc: Plano, Texas
Finale Print Music ran about $39.00 on Amazon. There are some limitations, but for 95% of what you might want to do it's great. I've also used Play Music at my teacher's house and it looks about the same as the Finale product.
Jon
_________________________
"In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity." Albert Einstein

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#1078023 - 11/29/04 07:46 PM Re: Composition
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8483
Loc: Ohio, USA
 Quote:
Originally posted by Cindysphinx:
You know what?

Wouldn't it be a kick in the pants to have a place here where members could submit their original compositions?

I'd like to see your stuff too, Signa. I'd like to have a go at everybody's stuff. I've never written any music, myself. Is "Finale" expensive? [/b]
here is finale site where you can download the free notepad:

http://www.finalemusic.com/

you can play with it and see how easy you could actually compose something. if you need an example, i can email you a finale file of my composition and then after you installed the finale notepad, you could play the file and hear how it sounds. you may send me a PM with your email address, if you want it.

btw, Finale software costs about $600 perhaps. i never thought of buying it because i was not serious about composition.

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#1078024 - 11/29/04 08:03 PM Re: Composition
Cindysphinx Offline


Registered: 02/14/03
Posts: 6416
Loc: Washington D.C. Metro
Jdsher?

I played your piece tonight. How can I say this appropriately . . .

If you were dead, you'd be spinning in your grave right now! ;\)

Oh, I really butchered it good. The arrangement itself was quite nice. But every now and then I'd play a couple of notes and there would be this hideous, discordant (sp) sound. And I'd look down to see I was messing up your arrangement. I especially couldn't seem to get the A sharp into my head.

It was great sight reading practice, though, as I am totally unfamiliar with the original. I'll try again tomorrow. Let me know when you do another one.

Or should I start sending you requests for pieces I'd like you to arrange? ;\)
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#1078025 - 11/30/04 07:32 AM Re: Composition
jdsher Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/04
Posts: 643
Loc: Plano, Texas
Cindy, sorry to cause you so much trouble, here is link to about a minute of Horowitz playing it as an encore. Vladimir Horowitz Shepherd\'s Complaint by Felix Mendelssohn Op. 67 no.5
Jon
_________________________
"In the middle of difficulty lies opportunity." Albert Einstein

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