Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Gifts and supplies for the musician
the Forums & Piano World

This custom search works much better than the built in one and allows searching older posts.
(ad) Yamaha CP4 Rebate
Yamaha CP4 Rebate
(ad 125) Sweetwater - Digital Keyboards & Other Gear
Digital Pianos at Sweetwater
(ad) Pianoteq
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
Who's Online
137 registered (Almaviva, accordeur, A Guy, A-Tom, 42 invisible), 1412 Guests and 17 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Pianos
Topic Options
#1150478 - 09/20/07 10:55 PM Diminution?
ZeroZero Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/31/07
Posts: 240
Loc: UK
Could someone explain a little more about the concept of diminution - as mentioned by Fux. I understand it is a form of "improvisation" where a singer adds intervening notes, but there seems some form of rules for its application that are not apparent to me.

thanks in advance


Piano & Music Acc. / Sheet Music

Sheet Music Plus Homepage
#1150479 - 09/20/07 11:25 PM Re: Diminution?
pianoexcellence Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/14/07
Posts: 753
Loc: Abbotsford, BC, Canada
I am not familiar with Fux, but I do know that diminution is a technique where a theme is played at twice the rate as usual. A Quarter would be played thus as an eighth.

It is the opposite to the technique of augmentation, where the theme is played at half speed. A quarter is then a half

Augmentation is used more frequently in the fugues of Bach.

I realize that I am giving quite basic information here, so please forgive me if you are talking about something different.
Music is the surest path to excellence

Jeremy BA, ARCT, RMT
Pianoexcellence Tuning and Repairs

#1150480 - 09/21/07 12:34 AM Re: Diminution?
Harmosis Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/15/07
Posts: 308
Loc: California
Fux's diminution is related to the normal definition as explained by pianoexcellence, but he uses it in reference to what we might call passing tones. For example, on page 33, Fux shows us the skip of a 5th using two whole notes. Then, he shows us the same thing again, but with the first whole note being subdivided into four quarter notes diatonically leading down to the 2nd whole note. So we have D descending a perfect 5th directly to G, then D desecending to G by diatonic stepwise motion - the same melodic interval but via "diminution."

I hope this helps!

#1150481 - 09/21/07 11:09 PM Re: Diminution?
ZeroZero Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/31/07
Posts: 240
Loc: UK
Thanks, passing tones I understand. From what is said I can think of dimunition of substituting passing tones between two counterpoint positions, I presume these must be diatonic of course.
When the diminution tones are substituted - these are treated as part of the counterpoint and subject to the rules - I think?
Sometimes Fux seems to consider diminution as infered - the notes being hidden or implied, I am not sure if he is thinking that this is always the case between all counterpoint tones, or if he is only sometimes considering it.

#1150482 - 09/22/07 12:59 AM Re: Diminution?
Harmosis Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/15/07
Posts: 308
Loc: California
Yes, the rules would still apply with diminution, which is why Fux brings it up to prove his point about direct motion to a perfect consonance. Fux calls attention to diminution because the possibility of it occurring must be considered when making choices about voice leading (actually, we don't really have to consider it if we just follow the rule; but Fux is giving us a reason for this rule).

#1150483 - 09/23/07 09:43 AM Re: Diminution?
ZeroZero Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/31/07
Posts: 240
Loc: UK
Got it - thanks harmosis - again. Today I downloaded "Counterpointer" software which will allow my exercises to be marked - and give aural feedback. I will post when I get it going.
I currently feel like I am learning more about history than music - but I shall persevere


Moderator:  Piano World 
What's Hot!!
The February 2015 Issue of our Free Piano News Newsletter is out now! FREE Piano Newsletter
The best thing I've learned on Piano World....
Posting Pictures on the Forums
Forums Rules & Help
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
(ad) Jazz Piano Online
Jazz Piano Online Lessons
Ad (Seiler/Knabe)
Knabe Pianos
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
New Topics - Multiple Forums
What does River Phoenix play for his audition in ++
by riley80
03/01/15 07:50 PM
Chickering Quarter Grand
by Randy R. Johnson
03/01/15 06:16 PM
Why not a worm drive to tension strings?
by Beemer
03/01/15 05:48 PM
Chopin, Rondo's
by dolce sfogato
03/01/15 05:31 PM
PianoDisc ProRecord
by Mompou's Cat
03/01/15 05:14 PM
Forum Stats
78,358 Registered Members
43 Forums
161,974 Topics
2,378,502 Posts

Most users ever online: 15,252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM
Gift Ideas for Music Lovers!
Find the Perfect Gift for the Music Lovers on your List!
Visit our online store today.

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |

copyright 1997 - 2015 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission