Have you ever had this problem, if so, how have you overcome it?

This is the current composition i'm working on right now, and it's just one of many I can't finish...

The Recluse[/b] - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ke0LFMy34jE

do you think it has potential? or does it suck?
what genre would you say it is?
would you like to see more of my compositions? I've got alot.
Will learning theory help?
Can you help me?

this is a piano only composition that I'm having trouble finding out how to make it longer, if anyone wants to finish it with me I'm more than happy to give you what you need to do so. The piano patch being used is caled "A Grand Piano" and it can be found in reasons default soundbank, it's not that great of a piano sound, but it's much better than it's midi counter-part.

I'm sure it's bad manners to post more than 1 composition at a time, so I'll hold back. There is more on my youtube channel, but those are only my latest works, and I have much better compositions on my computer, and I have finished quite a few, but the difference between my finished compositions and my incomplete ones is way to big.

I don't think it necessarily has to be longer and I actually like the way it just ends right now. It gives it an ethereal feel. Lots of short pieces are really gems. I'd leave it alone or just add a few measures to round out the ending just a bit.

Learning theory is always a good idea, but if this is the kind of style you write in then I don't think it would necessarily add anything to what you already do. You would spend your time better learning about form and doing some formal analysis. That will help you build "roadmaps" to possibly follow in new compositions. That can help you from getting stuck quite as bad.

thanks for the respond. one thing about your post though, what is formal analysis? I would look it up it's just the internet gives 50 different definitions for one thing and it's hard to find

edit 1.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3JgfZoXI4VQ

would you consider this to be one of those small compositions you mentioned? or does it feel unfinished?

I mean examining works to discern what form they are written in, like sonata, rondo, etc. There are several books available on musical form. There are hundreds of variations on standard forms and it's instructive to look how some famous works are structured to learn how the sections relate to each other and how they strengthen the piece as a whole - and how they use form to build tension and resolve it.

Your piece is interesting on a number of levels, and the ending sounds unfinished in a way, but not necessarily in a bad way. I personally think the ending could use just a couple of measures to bring it to a little more settled end, but if it was my piece I wouldn't go too far as to making it sound "over". It sounds like it wants to sort of fade off without having reached a complete finish, which could destroy its mysterious aspect. It seems to create a little world that in my mind can only be fleeting anyway.

Well, that's just my impression. I don't know what you were really trying to express.

i usually just toy around with sounds and a midi keyboard untill i remember something, in the toy piano case, i remembered a dark alley with a bunch of alley cats around, and for some reason, it also reminded me of paris france at night lol. the recluse one, i hit the first chord and it reminded me of the color teal, and darkish purple with some brown, which in turn reminded me of a mad scientist at ease in his den.

not sure if i should have posted this ... err i just feel the need to talk about music right now

I like what you have done so far.

Wanting to compose music, I restarted piano lessons at age 60. I am, at best, an "Intermediate Student", according to my piano teacher

The weekly lessons have helped me come up with tunes and forms which I may never have found otherwise. I am also writing notation now, which also seems to help.

When I get stuck with a piece, I have let it sit for a while. One sweet passage I let sit for 6 years, and it finally found its way nicely into a nocturne I wrote 6 months ago.

So, I think that it's not always necessary to complete something on your time schedule. I'm not certain how creative I am, but whatever bit of it I may posses, cannot be forced. Still, hard work is essential.

Also, in music composition, I'm not so certain that size matters.

Good Luck,

Sandy

So a teacher does help tons afterall eh?

one question, before the 6 years did you know what a nocturn was? or did you learn it during that time and then realized it was a nice structural guideline to finish your peice?

thanks alot for the response.

also, general question, when I'm studying musical forms, which ones should I start with? any tips on how to learn them and the aparatus to use would be much appreciated.

Sorry if I'm becoming an annoyance with all these questions, I really don't want to be that person, it's just i've consistently aquiring the most valuable information from these forums and I really really have an undying passion for composing.

Although I had lessons as a child and a teacher, I did not know what a nocturne was. After I wrote the piece, which I originally thought was a sonata, my piano teacher corrected me.

Because I practice different types of music for my lessons, I get a "feel" for themes, development etc., but I don't consciously employ the forms. I know my tunes have a certain structure because I must notate them (and correctly for my teacher).

My amateur 2 cents for now is, listen to many types of music and note how tunes start, develop, end etc., but think about getting a solid yet workable teacher who encourages composing and any other musical interests you may have. I also like noodling around with chords and melodies. Learning chord structure from my teacher by playing has helped me a lot, e.g., augmented, diminshed chords etc. This is learnable stuff.

BTW, it was my granddaughter's piano teacher who suggested I take lessons again, and I owe her a debt of gratitude.

Maybe some of the more experienced folks on this forum can provide more helpful advice.

Best,

Sandy

I mistakenly wrote "teacher" when I meant to say, "teenager". Sorry.

Nice little piece, very Debussyeske. It has that dreamy extemporaneous feel. Some of the rhythm seemed a bit unclear to me, but that may be by design.

I heard a number of ideas all of which could be developed more. There were some harmonic turns that were a bit surprising (in a good way). You might try taking your opening 12 seconds (the whole first phrase) and restate it with changed harmony. In fact that alone could be the basis for a piece. The repeated chord motive (the end of the phrase) is another part that could be developed. So there's no lack of ideas that can be further developed.


You ask if you should learn theory. The first year of college theory is learning nuts and bolts, scales, chords, 4 part voice leading, rhythm, ear training, etc. The second year focuses on form, sonatas, fugues, variations, analysis, etc. For a composer ear training is crucial, you simply have to be able to write down what you hear in your head. If you don't know the nuts and bolts then that would be useful knowledge to have.

Sometimes people come on here asking if they should learn theory like you have. It seems there's an innate fear of learning theory. Is learning theory hard? Not really, but it does take work and time. Perhaps the fear is that some fundamental aspect of their creativity or style will be compromised. I'll admit there's something about exploring music that's fun. But it's still fun to explore music once you know what you're doing. You see from my point of view I only had to learn theory once and it's informed the last 30+ years of my creative life. So should you learn theory? I think so, but what I think isn't important. What do you think?

I've recently seen a documentary about Sofia Gubaidulina's new violin concerto. She said that whenever she composes a piece, she usually starts at the end and thinks about how to get there rather than the other way round. Who knows, it might just work for you?

I've done that. In my case it was write a finale (because that was something I thought I needed to practice) and once that was done the question became what came before (2 other movements). It's a completely different paradigm than writing music wondering how to end it. Great idea!

Sometimes when you don't know what to do, the best thing to do is to make a huge mess, or create a huge problem that needs resolution. You can always connect it to the first part later. Or, think of writing the end and connecting it to what you have.

I think ScottM had some great advice about form. Some pieces are done in ABA form. This means that they start with an idea, A, then move onto a completely different idea, B, and then return to A (although A can be slightly modified). Or you can make a piece in AB form. The possibilities are endless, and really the whole point of form is to give the composer some structure.

Also, a good rule of thumb is to use repetition wisely. Too much new material without enough repetition seems meandering, and too much repetition without new materials seems predictable. Finding a good balance between both will help you.

I really think you have a gem of an idea here, it just sounds improvised, rather than composed. I think this is because it lacks that structure or repetition. I hope that doesn't sound negative, because I'm simply giving you observations, not opinions.