Welcome to the Piano World Piano Forums
Over 2 million posts about pianos, digital pianos, and all types of keyboard instruments
Join the World's Largest Community of Piano Lovers (it's free)
It's Fun to Play the Piano ... Please Pass It On!

Gifts and supplies for the musician

SEARCH
the Forums & Piano World

Trying Something New with Search
(ad) Pianoteq
(ad) Pearl River
Pearl River Pianos
(ad) P B Guide
Acoustic & Digital Piano Guide
(ad) Lindeblad Piano
Lindeblad Piano Restoration
Who's Online
143 registered (accordeur, AndrewJCW, anamnesis, AmandaH, 36251, AndreiN, 33 invisible), 1582 Guests and 6 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
(ad) Estonia Piano
Estonia Pianos
Quick Links to Useful Piano & Music Resources
Our Classified Ads
Find Piano Professionals-

*Piano Dealers - Piano Stores
*Piano Tuners
*Piano Teachers
*Piano Movers
*Piano Restorations
*Piano Manufacturers
*Organs

Quick Links:
*Advertise On Piano World
*Free Piano Newsletter
*Online Piano Recitals
*Piano Recitals Index
*Piano & Music Accessories
*Live Piano Venues
*Music School Listings
* Buying a Piano
*Buying A Acoustic Piano
*Buying a Digital Piano
*Pianos for Sale
*Sell Your Piano
*How Old is My Piano?
*Piano Books
*Piano Art, Pictures, & Posters
*Directory/Site Map
*Contest
*Links
*Virtual Piano
*Music Word Search
*Piano Screen Saver
*Piano Videos
*Virtual Piano Chords
Sheet Music
(PW is an affiliate)
Sheet Music Plus Featured Sale
Topic Options
#1159723 - 03/08/09 09:24 PM Damping Resonance vs. Stereo Sustain Samples
rgb12 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/01/09
Posts: 6
What is the difference between these two features? The definitions for both in the yamaha manuals see to be same, basically to simulator the resonance created when the damper pedal is depressed.

ie.
CLP-330 - Has damper resonance but no stereo sustain samples
P140 - Has stero sustain samples but no damper resonance

So, which would sound better when the damper pedal is depressed?

Comparing digital pianos is frustrating; too many fancy names and not enough good explanations of the underlying technology being used. (of course, thats why we try them out before buying smile )

Top
(ads) Sweetwater / Roland
Kawai Superb Stage Piano and Controller

Click Here


#1159730 - 03/08/09 09:43 PM Re: Damping Resonance vs. Stereo Sustain Samples [Re: rgb12]
Horwinkle Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/08
Posts: 1011
Ignore the marketing hype and just trust your ears.
If you like (or dislike) what you hear, that's all that matters.

Top
#1162551 - 03/14/09 12:02 AM Re: Damping Resonance vs. Stereo Sustain Samples [Re: Horwinkle]
rgb12 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/01/09
Posts: 6
Anyone know the difference between stereo sustain sampling and dynamic resonance? I'm quite curious as they both pertain to the damper sound.

Top
#1162568 - 03/14/09 12:49 AM Re: Damping Resonance vs. Stereo Sustain Samples [Re: rgb12]
Horwinkle Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/08
Posts: 1011
Stereo Sustain Samples
The Yamaha web page has sample mp3 files, comparing with and without stereo sustain sampling (SSS). It seems that **with** SSS you hear the decay of each note, as recorded. As a tone decays, it doesn't just get softer. It changes in a subtle way. Without SSS you won't hear that change. (The difference is significant. Frankly, I find this more important and noticeable than string resonance. BTW, the also have mp3 files comparing with/without string resonance.)

Dynamic Resonance
That's not a Yamaha term is it? Do you mean Dynamic Damper Effect (DDE)? Yamaha lists that as a feature on the CLP240, 270, 280, 340, 370, 380. My 240 has a button to turn it on and off. The difference ... nothing that I can hear!

Yamaha describes it as follows:
.. "DDE recreates the subtle resonances that occur when
.. you press the damper pedal down on a grand piano."

Translation:
.. "Bullcrap."

Top
#1162617 - 03/14/09 07:07 AM Re: Damping Resonance vs. Stereo Sustain Samples [Re: Horwinkle]
Geoffk Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 757
Loc: Tokyo, Japan
It seems like if they recorded the sample properly (i.e. the whole note with decay and not just the initial strike plus a loop) then you would automatically get the "SSS" effect as the original recording source decays. Of course you'd you to do that for each of the different loudness sample levels (3, 4 or 5) on each key. But any recent DP with good samples should have a natural decay sampled from the original. I'm not sure if that should have to be a "feature".

As for damper resonance, this is *very* noticeable on the Roland HPs and adds a lot to the overall sound. If you don't notice it much on the Yamahas, than it hasn't been implemented well, because it's a very important element to a realistic piano sound.

Top
#1162673 - 03/14/09 11:01 AM Re: Damping Resonance vs. Stereo Sustain Samples [Re: Geoffk]
Horwinkle Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/08
Posts: 1011
As for SSS ... yes, it seems that if they sampled the decay, they wouldn't need to do looping. So, if they loop, they must not be using decay samples. Well, I don't know their specific methods. They have very little to say about it on the web, and that little bit is mostly marketing-speak.

As for string resonance ... I do hear it on the Yamaha mp3. It's there, but not very noticeable. It's not very noticeable on acoustics either, or on the synths that I've tried (Pianoteq, etc.) Yes, I hear it, but I just don't find it striking. I guess it's easy and cheap to implement, compared to some other improvements that would produce greater benefit (like better speakers).

Top
#1162743 - 03/14/09 02:43 PM Re: Damping Resonance vs. Stereo Sustain Samples [Re: Horwinkle]
mahlzeit Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/24/06
Posts: 1916
Loc: Netherlands
You can also approximate the decay of a string by putting the looping sample through a gentle low-pass filter. This slowly removes the higher harmonics from the sound. (This is actually the most basic form of physical modeling.)
_________________________
No idea what chords you are playing? Reverse Chord Finder Pro will tell you!

Top
#1163332 - 03/15/09 08:26 PM Re: Damping Resonance vs. Stereo Sustain Samples [Re: mahlzeit]
Geoffk Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/11/08
Posts: 757
Loc: Tokyo, Japan
Actually, I find string resonance to be a very subtle effect, and I might not miss it much if it was gone. The damper resonance is very noticeable, though, and I'd miss that a lot. You hear that every time you press the pedal.

Top

Moderator:  Piano World 
Shop our Store for Music Lovers!
Back to School Music SALE!
Save 10% in our online store
.
Just enter SAVE10 in the coupon box during checkout. *
And YES, you can save 10% AND still get free shipping on Jansen Artist benches!
PianoSupplies.com is Piano World's Online Store
Please visit our store today.
* Sale does not apply to advertising, how old requests, or any non-tangible items. Can not be combined with any other promotions. Ends August 31, 2015
(ad) Teaching Children Music
Teaching Music to Children
(ad) Yamaha Stage Pianos
Yamaha CP4 & CP40 Stage Pianos
(ads) PD - WNG - MH
PianoDisc
(ad 125) Sweetwater - Digital Keyboards & Other Gear
Digital Pianos at Sweetwater
(125ad) Dampp Chaser
Dampp Chaser Piano Life Saver
New Topics - Multiple Forums
Looking for Sheet Music for This Song....
by newbert
08/31/15 06:16 PM
Does a silent system harm the acoustic action (Kawai)?
by danielp11
08/31/15 01:32 PM
Nonprofit Steinway project update! (with audio sample)
by TwoSnowflakes
08/31/15 01:18 PM
1986 Steinway K
by Sketches
08/31/15 12:39 PM
ALESIS CODA PRO?
by sus4
08/31/15 12:23 PM
What's Hot!!
Posting Pictures on the Forums
-------------------
Forums Rules & Help
-------------------
ADVERTISE
on Piano World

The world's most popular piano web site.
-------------------
PIANO BOOKS
Forum Stats
80,579 Registered Members
44 Forums
166,567 Topics
2,440,788 Posts

Most users ever online: 15,252 @ 03/21/10 11:39 PM

Visit our online store for gifts for music lovers

 
Help keep the forums up and running with a donation, any amount is appreciated!
Or by becoming a Subscribing member! Thank-you.
Donate   Subscribe
 
Our Piano Related Classified Ads
|
Dealers | Tuners | Lessons | Movers | Restorations | Pianos For Sale | Sell Your Piano |

Advertise on Piano World
| Subscribe | Piano World | PianoSupplies.com | Advertise on Piano World | Donate | Link to Us | Classifieds |
| |Contact | Privacy | Legal | About Us | Site Map | Free Newsletter | Press Room |


copyright 1997 - 2015 Piano World ® all rights reserved
No part of this site may be reproduced without prior written permission