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#1186504 - 04/24/09 01:33 PM Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA
piano_buyer Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 25
Dear all,

It has been many years since I had the pleasure of having a piano. In fact, I have never even played on a baby grand. But recently, I realized how much I miss having a piano and practicing, and decided to purchase one. Currently, my budget is modest -- only 6K for a baby grand.

Because I have never had experience with a baby grand whatsoever, I honestly cannot tell which piano is the one merely by playing different brands. Alas, I came here to ask for your suggestions regarding brand and prices.

I was quoted $5800 for a brand new Weber baby grand.

I was quoted $5900 for a used (only for a few weeks) Kawai MX10 (spell?) but based on research found out that I should get RX that I cannot afford.

I saw an ad for $8K Perzina 5'4 grand.

I suppose that I would ask for a 20-30% discount from those prices if I were to purchase one based on what I read on this forum.

Please kindly advise.

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#1186512 - 04/24/09 01:36 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: piano_buyer]
piano_buyer Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 25
I could wait and allow for a 10K-12K budget, but I would love to get a piano as soon as possible. Please let me know if that would really make more sense than rushing now to buy something for 6K, although with the bad economy, a bargain could be had.

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#1186533 - 04/24/09 01:58 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: piano_buyer]
Furtwangler Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 1545
Loc: Danville, California
Ilona

If I were you I would wait until you have a larger budget.

And no - I do not think you could expect a 20-30% discount from the prices you mentioned above. The discount you should bargain for would be from the "list" price of the pianos, but they have already been substantially discounted, I believe.

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#1186564 - 04/24/09 03:00 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: Furtwangler]
dr.dai phan Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/24/09
Posts: 100
Hi,

I think a Henry F Miller 5'3 will cost you about 5300.00. I have it and it is an excellent entry level piano. It is a better piano in that price range. If you are very skilled pianist, I think you should save some and get one in the low 10K. DP

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#1186585 - 04/24/09 03:27 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: dr.dai phan]
Kurtmen Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 632
Loc: San Mateo, CA
In my opinion the Kawai GM10 K is a good deal. At this point this piano still under manufacturer's warranty besides that it is most likely to be trouble free. Another advantage is that because of the brand recognition you can always turn around and sell it.
Best of Luck.
_________________________
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#1186596 - 04/24/09 03:36 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: Kurtmen]
piano_buyer Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 25
Hmm, what is the best way to approach my piano search? I am thinking about calling local California piano dealers and asking them to provide their best deal/price on what they consider the best product in my price range.

Your thoughts? I am not sure about purchasing a piano via craigslist.

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#1186599 - 04/24/09 03:37 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: Kurtmen]
John Mila Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/11/08
Posts: 245
Loc: So California
The GM10 for $5900. is a great deal. Sure the RX1 would be better, but not $5900. You may want to use the GM10 for a few years and then move up to a RX1. Sell your yourself in a couple years and get $5000 for it, and than buy the RX1 separetly for your best advantage.
_________________________
John Mila de la Roca, Manager
Keyboard Concepts, Tustin CA
714-544-0088
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#1186631 - 04/24/09 04:16 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: John Mila]
Rod Verhnjak Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/09/06
Posts: 3659
Loc: Vancouver B.C. Canada
Most dealers will not give you the lowest price over the phone.
BTW getting the lowest price will often also mean the least amount of preparation done to the pinao your buying. And in your price range that's a problem.

You should visit the dealers you want to get prices from.
_________________________
Verhnjak Pianos
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of Fine Heirloom Pianos

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#1186786 - 04/24/09 09:31 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: Rod Verhnjak]
Rickster Offline


Registered: 03/25/06
Posts: 8589
Loc: Georgia, USA
Good advice so far; so, I’ll add my .02 for free. grin

It is my view that a decent grand piano can be had for 6K or less but they are not plentiful, as a general rule; which means that you may have to look long and hard to find one.

When I was looking for a good pre-owned grand (euphemism for used grin) I looked at a few at piano dealers and the prices were astronomical in my view. To get a good used grand in the 6K range it will most likely be from a private owner who needs to get rid of it suddenly for some reason (downsizing, moving, etc…). You will need to be patient and act quickly when you find a prospect. Do your research ahead of time if possible.

Good luck!

Rick
_________________________
Piano enthusiast and amateur musician: "Treat others the way you would like to be treated". Yamaha C7. YouTube Channel

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#1187645 - 04/26/09 12:06 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: Rickster]
piano_buyer Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 25
If I do happen to find just such a bargain in my price range, would be it reasonable for me to expect free delivery and in-home tuning? I will try to buy a piano from a dealer as opposed to craigslist.

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#1187676 - 04/26/09 12:54 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: piano_buyer]
pianobroker Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 4309
Loc: North Hollywood CA.
Nothing is actually "free" as in delivery or the in home tuning.It is all computed into the price of the piano from a dealer.Funny story!.A dealer friend of mine sold a piano to a client with an inhome "free" tuning included. The client wanted to withold the $ for the tuning until it was performed.The dealer told the client that "she has to pay for the piano but the tuning was free so how is one to withold $ for something that is free. The client was confused for a secound. grin He was just joking ! wink


Edited by pianobroker (04/26/09 01:03 PM)
_________________________
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#1187717 - 04/26/09 02:02 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: piano_buyer]
Marty Flinn Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/25/06
Posts: 2604
You should be able to find several Samick products from their Indonesian factory in about that budget new, ie. Remington, Knabe. You should be able to find several used Korean built pianos in the used catagory less than fifteen years old, ie. Samick, Kohler & Campbell, Young Chang. Also, there should be several choices in new Chinese built products, ie. Pearl River, other stencil name brands.
_________________________
Co-Author of The Complete Idiot's Guide To Buying A Piano. A "must read" before you shop.
Work for west coast dealer for Yamaha, Schimmel, Bosendorfer, Wm. Knabe.

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#1187725 - 04/26/09 02:14 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: Marty Flinn]
piano_buyer Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 25
Based on my research, a lot of which was actually reading post after post on this forum, I am going to try my best to be patient and find a newer Kawai.

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#1187734 - 04/26/09 02:29 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: piano_buyer]
Furtwangler Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/22/07
Posts: 1545
Loc: Danville, California
Ilona

Kawais are very nice instruments.

There are some other brands that are quite nice as well. Take your time and look at as many as you can.

For many, a grand piano is a lifetime purchase. Enjoy the experience of shopping.

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#1187774 - 04/26/09 03:45 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: Furtwangler]
piano_buyer Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 25
what is your opinion regarding a brand new Weber that I can get in this price range?

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#1187791 - 04/26/09 04:18 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: piano_buyer]
Hop Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/24/08
Posts: 654
Loc: Hudson, FL
You could probably get a Hailun HG 151 for about $6,000, perhaps slightly more, depending on how motivated your dealer is. I liked them better than the Kawai GM10. I was planning on buying one, but the HG 178s were being promoted by Hailun at a price I couldn't refuse. I liked the tone better than the RX-2, although I thought the touch was slightly better on the RX-2.

Another possibility is the new Hobart Nelson pianos, now made in China. I have heard good things about them, and they are less expensive than the Hailuns. Try one, and see if you like it.

So keep looking, all the time deals are appearing.

Also, if you get very lucky you may find a pre-owned instrument in your price range that you are entirely pleased with.

Hop
_________________________
HG178, Roland FP-5, Casio PX 130

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#1187814 - 04/26/09 04:59 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: Hop]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19836
Loc: New York City
Go to the advanced search function at
pianomart.com

There were 29 grands for under 6K in California, but I don't know how close any of them are to you. You could also enter a figure higher than 6K in your search since most of the prices are probably not final prices.

If you're very lucky you might find a great bargain(excellent condition and/or recent vintage + great price). But of course it can be more tedius buying a used piano.

You absolutely must get it checked out by an independent tech if you take this route!

If you're fussy about the finish, remember that minor scratches can usually be removed at only a small cost.


Edited by pianoloverus (04/26/09 05:02 PM)

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#1187816 - 04/26/09 05:02 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand in CA [Re: pianoloverus]
tickler Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/14/07
Posts: 376
Loc: Chicagoland
Why are you focused on getting a baby grand? Why not get an upright?

For 6K, I'd think you could get a good upright without too much trouble. Less trouble than finding a good grand for this amount.


Mary
_________________________
Music should strike fire from the heart of man, and bring tears from the eyes of woman. -- Beethoven
1911 Steinway A-II (2007 Rebuild)

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#1187892 - 04/26/09 08:02 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand i [Re: piano_buyer]
Maestro Ng Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/19/08
Posts: 148
Loc: Auckland, NZ
Is there a particular reason why you would want to buy a baby grand? Because if it's sound you're looking for, you'll be better off buying a big/good upright, than a bad/small grand piano, because from my understanding, most big uprights actually have a bigger soundboard than baby grands.

If it's for looks, then I suggest you wait for your bigger budget, and buy second-hand.


Edited by Maestro Ng (04/26/09 08:03 PM)
_________________________
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Proud owner of a Schimmel K 189T and a Challen 130.

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#1187921 - 04/26/09 08:38 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand i [Re: Maestro Ng]
JazzFan Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/17/09
Posts: 8
Maybe this piano is available in your area. I was able to buy a 5'4 Kohler and Campbell KIG54 a few months ago for just under $7,000 from a Utah dealer (Piano Gallery). I'm a jazz piano player, pretty picky, and as I researched different brands I felt that for the money, the Kohler & Campbell was hard to beat.


Edited by JazzFan (04/26/09 08:46 PM)

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#1188054 - 04/27/09 12:21 AM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand i [Re: Maestro Ng]
88Key_PianoPlayer Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/02/02
Posts: 1920
Loc: El Cajon, CA
Originally Posted By: Maestro Ng
Because if it's sound you're looking for, you'll be better off buying a big/good upright, than a bad/small grand piano, because from my understanding, most big uprights actually have a bigger soundboard than baby grands.


I know that from experience, Maestro Ng. I have a 1956 45" Baldwin Hamilton sitting next to my mom's 1998 4'11" Young Chang PG-150, and the Baldwin sounds noticeably better than the Young Chang.
_________________________
Associate Member - Piano Technicians Guild
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1956 (#167714) Baldwin Hamilton
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#1188165 - 04/27/09 08:51 AM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand i [Re: 88Key_PianoPlayer]
Maestro Ng Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/19/08
Posts: 148
Loc: Auckland, NZ
Originally Posted By: 88Key_PianoPlayer
Originally Posted By: Maestro Ng
Because if it's sound you're looking for, you'll be better off buying a big/good upright, than a bad/small grand piano, because from my understanding, most big uprights actually have a bigger soundboard than baby grands.


I know that from experience, Maestro Ng. I have a 1956 45" Baldwin Hamilton sitting next to my mom's 1998 4'11" Young Chang PG-150, and the Baldwin sounds noticeably better than the Young Chang.


Point Proven.
_________________________
http://www.flickr.com/photos/maestro_ng/

Proud owner of a Schimmel K 189T and a Challen 130.

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#1188259 - 04/27/09 11:43 AM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand i [Re: Maestro Ng]
piano_buyer Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 25
Pardon the ignorance, but I have yet to research about Kohler & Campbell. Based on what I read here, it is a better option for under 10K for a baby grand than the entry-level baby grand by Kawai.

Do you agree? I will find dealers in Northern California.

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#1188750 - 04/27/09 11:40 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand i [Re: piano_buyer]
stanw909 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/04/08
Posts: 195
Loc: SoCal
If you have the room then get a baby grand.It is what you want.Enjoy your search.Play lots of pianos and be tough,don't get railroaded.Pianos are not flying off the shelves.Sleep on it and come here to ask more questions.The people here are very helpful and knowledgeable.

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#1189268 - 04/28/09 05:18 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand i [Re: stanw909]
Marty Flinn Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/25/06
Posts: 2604
Maestro NG,
Not necessarily point proven. More like comparing apples and oranges. We do the challenge on nearly a daily basis in the store where I work. We demonstrate the tone and show the repetition on the new Yamaha U3 52" then the GB1 4'11". Whenever the shopper is a player, we have them sit and play both. I have yet to have a shopper prefer tone or the touch of the upright over the baby grand. The GB1 is actually cheaper than the upright. We are not trying to angle or move the customer. The pianos speak for themselves. Comparing the GC1 5'3" is even more dramatic.
_________________________
Co-Author of The Complete Idiot's Guide To Buying A Piano. A "must read" before you shop.
Work for west coast dealer for Yamaha, Schimmel, Bosendorfer, Wm. Knabe.

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#1189490 - 04/28/09 11:05 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand i [Re: Marty Flinn]
Maestro Ng Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/19/08
Posts: 148
Loc: Auckland, NZ
Originally Posted By: Marty Flinn
Maestro NG,
Not necessarily point proven. More like comparing apples and oranges. We do the challenge on nearly a daily basis in the store where I work. We demonstrate the tone and show the repetition on the new Yamaha U3 52" then the GB1 4'11". Whenever the shopper is a player, we have them sit and play both. I have yet to have a shopper prefer tone or the touch of the upright over the baby grand. The GB1 is actually cheaper than the upright. We are not trying to angle or move the customer. The pianos speak for themselves. Comparing the GC1 5'3" is even more dramatic.


I realise that upright and grands are very different, so it certainly is up to personal preference. It may not be true that large uprights are better than small grands for ALL cases of large upright vs small grands, for example, I won't compare a small Steinway grand to a large Yamaha, but it does make a lot of sense if you look at it from the technical point of view. And of course you speak of money, and that is true too. I can guarantee the large Bosendorfer upright will be better than a small Kawai grand for example, but it'll almost certainly be much more costly.
_________________________
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Proud owner of a Schimmel K 189T and a Challen 130.

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#1189499 - 04/28/09 11:16 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand i [Re: Maestro Ng]
stanw909 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/04/08
Posts: 195
Loc: SoCal
We had a wonderful Kawai 52" upright that sounded great but bought a 4'11' baby grand for the action.We believe the cheap baby grand from China has a more lively,ringing tone with not much difference in the low end.We had the upright in the same room for several weeks until we could sell it, so side by side comparison was easy.B.T.W. We did need to have the grand prepped to get it really sounding good.


Edited by stanw909 (04/28/09 11:18 PM)

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#1189578 - 04/29/09 02:43 AM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand i [Re: stanw909]
pianobroker Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 4309
Loc: North Hollywood CA.
Let's even the playing field somewhat. Aside from the issue of the action comparison of a grand vrs. an uprt.repetition,aftertouch,letoff etc.You take the kickboard and front panel off a good U3 and than make the comparison. grin


Edited by pianobroker (04/29/09 02:44 AM)
_________________________
www.pastperfectpiano.com
Largest selection in the USA
100+Steinway and M&H grands
Warehouse showroom Onsite Restoration
Preowned & Restored
Hailun dlr.818-255-3145
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#1189712 - 04/29/09 10:42 AM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand i [Re: pianobroker]
dglo Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/30/09
Posts: 103
Loc: New York
I think I got very lucky back in January, but with a little persistence, you could find a good used grand in your price range. I tried dozens of pianos from Craigslist, and that was a huge disappointment. Every single piano was listed as a 'hidden gem,' but each of them was beyond the pale. I nearly gave up and decided to stick with my 46" Knabe. But an old aquaintance who was moving his studio had some pianos at a huge discount. He picked out five of them for me after I told him what I hoped for in the action and sound. I didn't care about the cabinet so much. I wound up with a 1928 Sohmer with new strings, pins, reconditioned board, pinblock, pedals. I paid less than $5,000 and I've been thrilled. The cabinet needed some work, but with a weekend of TLC, it looks very good for its age.

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#1191792 - 05/02/09 01:15 PM Re: Only 6K to spend on a new or used baby grand i [Re: dglo]
hanfrac Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/14/08
Posts: 42
Loc: Menlo Park, CA
There's a 6'4" mid-1970's Knabe grand for sale from a local pianist for something like $6500. Sounds nice and well-kept from the ad. Are the mid-1970's Knabes, if well-kept, good instruments?

Like dglo, we have a 46" Knabe/Samick. I would love to upgrade into a grand, as we have the space and my 8 year old has taken a strong liking to piano (unlike me, when I was 8 years old).

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