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#1212541 - 06/05/09 11:46 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: DameMyra]
Ralph Offline
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Registered: 12/09/01
Posts: 943
Loc: Delaware (slower/lower)
I think it's going to be Bozhanov. I think he's been the most consistant, but it could go to another. Tsujii is the sentimental favorite.
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#1212547 - 06/05/09 11:52 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: Debussy20]
DameMyra Offline
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Registered: 12/21/04
Posts: 1534
Loc: South Jersey
Originally Posted By: Debussy20
Does Haochen remind anyone of McLovin? laugh laugh laugh

Must be a teenage thing?




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#1212550 - 06/05/09 11:59 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: DameMyra]
Debussy20 Offline
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Registered: 03/13/06
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Loc: Earth...hopefully
They talk pretty much the same also... laugh




Matt


Edited by Debussy20 (06/06/09 12:06 AM)
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#1212551 - 06/06/09 12:03 AM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: DameMyra]
Horowitzian Online   blank
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Posts: 8208
I enjoyed her Beethoven too. She definitely has the maturity where some of the younger competitors do not with Beethoven.

My favorite to win is Bozhanov (aside from the facial expressions, he's my favorite anyway), and Tsujii and Vocatello are next in line in my book. I don't think Tsujii is quite gold medal material, but he deserves a medal for all his hard work and wonderful playing, which has only gotten better as the competition goes on. There aren't many seeing pianists who can brag about being finalists at the Cliburn, let alone blind pianists.
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#1212566 - 06/06/09 12:37 AM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: Debussy20]
newport Offline
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#1212663 - 06/06/09 09:34 AM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: newport]
Emanuel Ravelli Offline
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Registered: 10/15/04
Posts: 537
Loc: Reston, VA
It's always hazardous to pick winners before the playing is done, since that ignores the real possibility of a brilliant performance or a total flameout in the last two days. But assuming each finalist finishes up in a way that's consistent with his/her caliber of play so far, my money is on Bozhanov for the gold. Tsujii should win silver on the merits, but I fear the jury may have reservations about his ability to handle the heavier concert schedule and public relations chores associated with one of the top two prizes. I know these things shouldn't have any influence on the jury's decision, but I think they will. His playing has been too amazing for him to finish out of the money, so I think he'll take the 3rd place crystal award.

So who gets second? Who knows? They're all good enough to deserve it. But my wild guess is that Son will get it, for a reason competition veterans will grasp: Bozhanov is going to start a major fight in the jury room, a compromise will be needed in order for them to give him the gold, and Son is the player whose restrained, classic style is most likely to appeal to jurors who dislike Bozhanov. On the other hand, I could be dead wrong. Stay tuned.
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#1212700 - 06/06/09 10:38 AM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: Emanuel Ravelli]
signa Offline
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Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8452
Loc: Ohio, USA
i do wish Bozhanov wins, since he is the most imaginative pianist among the finalists (or maybe all contestants) in this competition, and makes everyone else sound like 'a good student'. i don't ever remember there's such a pianist in all the competitions i watched before (in past 10 years). whether you like his way of playing or not (even my teacher doesn't always agree with something he does), he stirs somehow your emotions or casts shadows in your heart.

i would guess that he has made some jurors like him and others hate him, even though no one can deny his musical imagination. we may have to wait till he finishes Rach 2.


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#1212719 - 06/06/09 11:17 AM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: signa]
Auntie Lynn Offline
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Registered: 12/07/04
Posts: 980
Loc: San Francisco, CA
I have seen awards ceremonies where Mr. Cliburn has gotten in front of the mike and droned on...and on...and on...and on...(zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz). Is there any way to get him the message: give us five easy sentences and get on with it...many thanks!

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#1212721 - 06/06/09 11:20 AM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: Auntie Lynn]
Auntie Lynn Offline
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Registered: 12/07/04
Posts: 980
Loc: San Francisco, CA
Matinee Performance:
1:30 p.m. - Mr. Haochen Zhang (Recital)
2:45 p.m. - Ms. Yeol Eum Son (Prokofiev, Piano Concerto No. 2 in G minor, Op. 16)
3:45 p.m. - Mr. Nobuyuki Tsujii (Rachmaninoff, Piano Concerto No. 2 in C minor, Op. 18)

Evening Performance:
7:30 p.m. - Ms. Di Wu (Recital)
8:45 p.m. - Mr. Evgeni Bozhanov (Rachmaninoff, Piano Concerto No. 2 in C minor, Op. 18)
9:45 p.m. - Ms. Mariangela Vacatello (Prokofiev, Piano Concerto No. 3 in C major, Op. 26)

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#1212724 - 06/06/09 11:22 AM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: signa]
pianoloverus Offline
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Originally Posted By: signa
i do wish Bozhanov wins, since he is the most imaginative pianist among the finalists (or maybe all contestants) in this competition, and makes everyone else sound like 'a good student'.


Far too harsh IMHO. There are some of the best pianists under 30 in the world. Many/most who didn't even make the semis have successful performing careers already.


Edited by pianoloverus (06/06/09 11:25 AM)

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#1212743 - 06/06/09 12:13 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: pianoloverus]
Ralph Offline
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Registered: 12/09/01
Posts: 943
Loc: Delaware (slower/lower)
James Conlon is giving an interesting talk, but he's engaging in a little bit of tangential thinking. He's skipping over a lot of ideas and thoughts, some of which I'm not sure are related.
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#1212756 - 06/06/09 12:46 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: signa]
Numerian Offline
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Registered: 11/04/05
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Some observations:

1) Will no one rid us of these meddlesome pianists - the ones who can't let the music speak for itself? It's bad enough that every single competitor has learned to sway to the music, close their eyes dreamily during tender passages, and scowl at the piano when things get technically difficult. Now we have to put up with the inhuman antics of Lang Lang and Bozhanov, inhuman because their facial expressions do not correspond to any typical human reaction to the emotions supposedly being represented. What does all that puckering of the lips, bouncing of the eyebrows, and conducting the performance with one hand flopping around in the air have to do with the music? Unfortunately, by elevating Bozhanov to the finals we are guaranteed dozens more imitators in the future, since no one wants to put a stop to these horrors.

2) This competition ended at the preliminaries. That was the last opportunity to hear some pianists who deserved to win - not because they were necessarily better pianists (though some clearly are than this last group of six) - but because they deserved a chance at a career. You know what the six finalists have in common? They don't need to win. They all have careers already. They perform in recital or with major orchestras around the world. They have recording contracts. They are established as teachers. They've been at this business all their lives. Zhang made his debut at five performing all the Bach two-part inventions. Bozhanov made his debut at 12, as did Tsujii performing at the same age at his Carnegie Hall debut. They all represent very safe choices for the jury, ready to hit the road tomorrow as Van Cliburn winners.

3) Musically, the one finalist who really stands out is Bozhanov. Listen to his Chopin concerto compared to Tsujii - much more poetry, passion, and tonal contrast. His sense of touch - very evident in his Schumann performance - exceeds that of any of the other finalists. His only flaw musically is a tendency to wrong notes in fast passages. Then of course there is the fact that he is the sort of pianist you can enjoy only in the safety of your own home listening to a CD, so you don't have to look at him.

4) Tsujii has already established that the soloist doesn't have to watch the beat of the conductor in order to perform a piano concerto properly. So what do we need James Conlon for? Aren't you getting tired watching him conduct while he rests his butt on the piano?

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#1212768 - 06/06/09 01:07 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: Numerian]
pianoloverus Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 14698
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: Numerian
Some observations:

1) Will no one rid us of these meddlesome pianists - the ones who can't let the music speak for itself? It's bad enough that every single competitor has learned to sway to the music, close their eyes dreamily during tender passages, and scowl at the piano when things get technically difficult. Now we have to put up with the inhuman antics of Lang Lang and Bozhanov, inhuman because their facial expressions do not correspond to any typical human reaction to the emotions supposedly being represented. What does all that puckering of the lips, bouncing of the eyebrows, and conducting the performance with one hand flopping around in the air have to do with the music? Unfortunately, by elevating Bozhanov to the finals we are guaranteed dozens more imitators in the future, since no one wants to put a stop to these horrors.
In contrast to Lang Lang, I don't think the facial expressions of the finalists are fake(even Bolzhanov's eyebrows...no one would do that on purpose), and I don't find any of them extreme, the slightest bit annoying, unusual or out of place except Bolzhanov.

Originally Posted By: tomasino
2) This competition ended at the preliminaries. That was the last opportunity to hear some pianists who deserved to win - not because they were necessarily better pianists (though some clearly are than this last group of six) - but because they deserved a chance at a career. You know what the six finalists have in common? They don't need to win. They all have careers already. They perform in recital or with major orchestras around the world. They have recording contracts. They are established as teachers. They've been at this business all their lives. Zhang made his debut at five performing all the Bach two-part inventions. Bozhanov made his debut at 12, as did Tsujii performing at the same age at his Carnegie Hall debut. They all represent very safe choices for the jury, ready to hit the road tomorrow as Van Cliburn winners.
Are you suggesting only pianists without already established careers should be allowed to win? If you check the pianists eliminated in the prelims, I think you'll find of them already have good careers also.

Originally Posted By: tomasino
4) Tsujii has already established that the soloist doesn't have to watch the beat of the conductor in order to perform a piano concerto properly. So what do we need James Conlon for?


The orchestra doesn't need a conductor or you just don't like Conlon? Since he has had to conduct up to 5 concerti on some days in either rehearsal or performance, I don't really mind where he rests his butt unless he fall backward into the piano if the lid falls down.


Edited by pianoloverus (06/06/09 01:19 PM)

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#1212781 - 06/06/09 01:30 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: pianoloverus]
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8452
Loc: Ohio, USA
regarding facial expressions, i sort of agree with pianoloverus, which are mostly not intentional. look at Zhang's when he was playing some passage, with closed eyes or a sort of dreamy frown look, which you can also call it fake but it might be just what he feels at the moments. for Bozhanov, i can see that some of that were not controllable (like habits), since i saw that in his rehearsal as well. last night, i actually felt that he was trying to control it more at the beginning, but later he got into the music and didn't really care about anything anymore.

btw, Bozhanov is quite good looking if he keeps a straight face all the time. so, i doubt that he intends to make everyone see his face in not that gracious ways when he plays.

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#1212837 - 06/06/09 02:38 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: signa]
Theowne Offline
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Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 1098
Loc: Toronto, Canada
Bozhanov knows what makes people talk. If you start making ridiculous faces, you'll become the center of controversy, everyone will talk about you, and at least 20% will start comparing you to Glenn Gould. Personally, I find his face-making combined with his overtly grandiose gestures and hand movements to clearly be part of the same "package" he wants to put out there. It's a shame, because he is quite a good pianist, but I don't think I will be going to any of his concerts if he wins this thing as it is.


Edited by Theowne (06/06/09 02:39 PM)
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#1212838 - 06/06/09 02:40 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: signa]
Horowitzian Online   blank
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/18/08
Posts: 8208
Originally Posted By: signa
[...] last night, i actually felt that he was trying to control it more at the beginning, but later he got into the music and didn't really care about anything anymore.

[...]


I think he did too. His expressions were quite minimal until later in the program.
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Close only counts in horseshoes, hand grenades, and nuclear weapons.

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#1212842 - 06/06/09 02:47 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: Horowitzian]
signa Offline
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Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8452
Loc: Ohio, USA
Horowitzian, i think we pretty much agree on Bozhanov, and what a pity that some others couldn't see what we see!

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#1212846 - 06/06/09 02:56 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: Horowitzian]
pianoloverus Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 14698
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: Horowitzian
Originally Posted By: signa
[...] last night, i actually felt that he was trying to control it more at the beginning, but later he got into the music and didn't really care about anything anymore.

[...]


I think he did too. His expressions were quite minimal until later in the program.


I think it was because the first piece on the program by Takemitsu was more abstract than the overtly Romantic Schumann and Liszt. As soon as he got into the Schumann he started his grimaces. I can't imagine that he would all of a sudden try to control something he regularly does naturally.

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#1212848 - 06/06/09 03:05 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: signa]
Theowne Offline
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Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 1098
Loc: Toronto, Canada
Originally Posted By: signa
Horowitzian, i think we pretty much agree on Bozhanov, and what a pity that some others couldn't see what we see!


Or perhaps, the other way around.
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#1212874 - 06/06/09 04:09 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: Theowne]
Synapse Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/08/08
Posts: 68
Loc: Vermont
Man, Eum Son was one of my favorites until I heard the first movement of that Prokofiev =(

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#1212882 - 06/06/09 04:33 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: pianoloverus]
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8452
Loc: Ohio, USA
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
Originally Posted By: Horowitzian
Originally Posted By: signa
[...] last night, i actually felt that he was trying to control it more at the beginning, but later he got into the music and didn't really care about anything anymore.

[...]


I think he did too. His expressions were quite minimal until later in the program.


I think it was because the first piece on the program by Takemitsu was more abstract than the overtly Romantic Schumann and Liszt. As soon as he got into the Schumann he started his grimaces. I can't imagine that he would all of a sudden try to control something he regularly does naturally.

i agree.

btw, did anyone hear Son was out of synch with the orchestra sometimes? she did finally show some passion in her playing though.

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#1212884 - 06/06/09 04:37 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: signa]
Horowitzian Online   blank
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/18/08
Posts: 8208
Yeah, that's probably the best way to explain his facial expressions.

I did hear her out of sync a couple of times, but overall it was a quite good, passionate performance. I was hoping to hear a bit more power at the climaxes, but perhaps that's just restrictions of the medium?
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Close only counts in horseshoes, hand grenades, and nuclear weapons.

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#1212887 - 06/06/09 04:39 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: signa]
Horowitzian Online   blank
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/18/08
Posts: 8208
Originally Posted By: signa
Horowitzian, i think we pretty much agree on Bozhanov, and what a pity that some others couldn't see what we see!


Well, this is extremely subjective. And ordinarily I would strongly dislike him for his "theatrics", but what he brings out of the piano captivates me in a way no other performer in this competition has done.
_________________________
~H

Close only counts in horseshoes, hand grenades, and nuclear weapons.

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#1212890 - 06/06/09 04:43 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: Horowitzian]
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8452
Loc: Ohio, USA
Originally Posted By: Horowitzian
but what he brings out of the piano captivates me in a way no other performer in this competition has done.

exactly what i feel!

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#1212896 - 06/06/09 04:53 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: signa]
Ridicolosamente Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/08/08
Posts: 1367
Loc: Miami, Florida, USA
Tsujii's start... eek!
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#1212898 - 06/06/09 04:55 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: Ridicolosamente]
Theowne Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 1098
Loc: Toronto, Canada
Is it just me or did the orchestra enter faster than his tempo....
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#1212902 - 06/06/09 04:56 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: Theowne]
Drunk3nFist Offline
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Registered: 08/11/08
Posts: 624
Loc: London
What the hell is wrong with the orchestra? The conductor should have taken even more responsibility than usual in Tsujii's playing.

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#1212906 - 06/06/09 05:01 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: Drunk3nFist]
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8452
Loc: Ohio, USA
in Tsujii case, it's difficult for the conductor too who basically has to follow the pianist all the time.

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#1212910 - 06/06/09 05:09 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: signa]
Horowitzian Online   blank
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Registered: 09/18/08
Posts: 8208
I missed the beginning, but it's definitely not my favorite Rach 2. frown
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Close only counts in horseshoes, hand grenades, and nuclear weapons.

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#1212911 - 06/06/09 05:09 PM Re: 2009 Van Cliburn Competition Megathread [Re: Drunk3nFist]
Theowne Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/06
Posts: 1098
Loc: Toronto, Canada
Originally Posted By: Drunk3nFist
What the hell is wrong with the orchestra? The conductor should have taken even more responsibility than usual in Tsujii's playing.


I don't know what's wrong with Conlon and the orchestra. The piece opens with a piano solo that sets the tempo with very clear bass notes...is it really that hard to enter in time with the piano? And then Conlon keeps looking over at Tsujii as if transmitting some cue to him. What a bad way to have one of your final performances begin...thank god it didn't fall apart.
_________________________
http://www.youtube.com/user/Theowne- Piano Videos (Ravel, Debussy, etc) & Original Compositions
音楽は楽しいですね。。。

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