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#1220339 - 06/21/09 12:05 AM volunteering accompanist service
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1253
Loc: northern California
I am interested in teachers' comments:
Do you volunteer as a pianist at local schools as an accompanist?
I have done this at my kids' elementary school (they are in high school and college now) for the past 7 years. Choir class met one morning per week, 3 concerts per year. This school closed last week due to budget cuts. Choir director I played for moved to a jr. high, where choir class meets 5 mornings per week. He asked me to play for him. Stipend will be $500 for the whole school year.
Do I take it? Gas will cost me about half of this. I love the director dearly. Could be good exposure for me but lots of work and time involved. Would you do it?
_________________________
Piano Teacher 1991

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#1220432 - 06/21/09 09:08 AM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: Barb860]
Morodiene Online   content
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 7495
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
I don't "volunteer" but if I'm asked to accompany I do get paid for it.

Maybe for $500 per year for performances, but not every rehearsal! Your time is worth something, and apparently the school doesn't know that. When I was in high school, our choir director didn't play piano well, so she would plunk out our notes, but hire an accompanist when it came close to a performance. Perhaps this would be the best thing for everyone.

Break it down for them: it;s about 36 weeks in a school year (not counting partial weeks for holidays), times 5 a week that's 180 days, plus concerts let's say twice a year. $500/182 = $2.75 per day. This doesn't even include time it would take for you to practice on your own to learn the pieces, nor does it consider gas/mileage! How can they consider paying a professional that amount to be anything close to reasonable? That's not even half of minimum wage.

Exposure is great, but you can get paid for what you do and still get the exposure. Tell them your terms, and the worst they can say is no and be without an accompanist at all (or have to pay someone else to do it). I would say that for $500 per year, that would include the concerts plus a few days before each concert to rehearse with the choir. If they want you for more time, then you'll have to be paid per rehearsal. Still, I wouldn't want to be there 5 days a week, even if it was a reasonable pay unless accompanying is your main thing.
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private piano/voice teacher - full time
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#1220459 - 06/21/09 10:42 AM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: Morodiene]
Kreisler Online   confused
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 12480
Loc: Iowa City, IA
$2.75/hour = No.

If I had the time and interest, I'd rather volunteer and do it for free. At least that way I could quit if something else came up or if the gig turned out to be more trouble than it's worth.

If they pay you a stipend, you'll be committed for the whole year, and if something goes wrong, then you're stuck. (For example, if they decide to move choir to 2pm, or if during contest time they suddenly expect you to be there from 3-5pm, etc...)
_________________________
"If we continually try to force a child to do what he is afraid to do, he will become more timid, and will use his brains and energy, not to explore the unknown, but to find ways to avoid the pressures we put on him." (John Holt)

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#1220708 - 06/21/09 07:22 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: Kreisler]
musiclady Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/19/05
Posts: 409
Loc: Toronto, Canada
That is really really low, it's almost doing it for free. Professional accompanists here are usually around $25-$30 per half hour!

Meri
_________________________
Clarinet and Piano Teacher based out of Toronto, Canada.Web: http://donmillsmusicstudio.weebly.com

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#1220716 - 06/21/09 07:30 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: musiclady]
Stanny Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/08/06
Posts: 1292
Since she HAS been doing this as a volunteer basis, maybe the stipend is really just to cover gas. This new position is so much more time though, so you'd have to decide if you really want to volunteer that much.
_________________________
~Stanny~

Independent Music Teacher
Certified Piano Teacher, American College of Musicians
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#1220735 - 06/21/09 08:43 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: Stanny]
lalakeys Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/05/06
Posts: 284
Loc: Chicago 'burbs
There's a huge difference between volunteering one morning each week and volunteering every school day! Seems to me you're being taken advantage of ($500 for an all-year, every day commitment is nowhere near fair compensation). If I were you, I would maybe be willing to come in a few days before a concert and rehearse a couple of times; then accept $200 for the 2 or 3 rehearsals and concert.
_________________________
Private piano & voice teacher for over 20 years; currently also working as a pipe organist for 3 area churches; sing in a Chicago-area acappella chamber choir

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#1220747 - 06/21/09 09:13 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: Kreisler]
John v.d.Brook Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/18/06
Posts: 6119
Loc: Olympia, Washington, USA
Originally Posted By: Kreisler
$2.75/hour = No.

If I had the time and interest, I'd rather volunteer and do it for free. At least that way I could quit if something else came up or if the gig turned out to be more trouble than it's worth.

If they pay you a stipend, you'll be committed for the whole year, and if something goes wrong, then you're stuck. (For example, if they decide to move choir to 2pm, or if during contest time they suddenly expect you to be there from 3-5pm, etc...)


Remember that volunteer service, done as a professional activity, such as you're doing, is tax deductible. As soon as you receive remuneration, of any kind, it's no longer deductible, rather, it becomes taxable. You get a double whammy.

If you haven't been deducting your volunteer hours, get with your tax adviser, go back through the last several years, and submit amended returns. This is a significant tax break for musicians, and it is in the tax code.
_________________________
"Those who dare to teach must never cease to learn." -- Richard Henry Dann
Full-time Private Piano Teacher offering Piano Lessons in Olympia, WA. www.mypianoteacher.com
Certified by the American College of Musicians; member NGPT, MTNA, WSMTA, OMTA

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#1220756 - 06/21/09 09:35 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: John v.d.Brook]
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1253
Loc: northern California
Originally Posted By: John v.d.Brook
Originally Posted By: Kreisler
$2.75/hour = No.

If I had the time and interest, I'd rather volunteer and do it for free. At least that way I could quit if something else came up or if the gig turned out to be more trouble than it's worth.

If they pay you a stipend, you'll be committed for the whole year, and if something goes wrong, then you're stuck. (For example, if they decide to move choir to 2pm, or if during contest time they suddenly expect you to be there from 3-5pm, etc...)


Remember that volunteer service, done as a professional activity, such as you're doing, is tax deductible. As soon as you receive remuneration, of any kind, it's no longer deductible, rather, it becomes taxable. You get a double whammy.

If you haven't been deducting your volunteer hours, get with your tax adviser, go back through the last several years, and submit amended returns. This is a significant tax break for musicians, and it is in the tax code.


Thank you, John! I have been volunteering for the past 7 years and did mention this to my tax accountant some time ago. I recall him saying that I could use it as an advertising expense, something like that, for my piano teaching studio.I will bring it up again. We need all the $ incentives we can get, we greedy piano teachers laugh
_________________________
Piano Teacher 1991

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#1220761 - 06/21/09 09:39 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: lalakeys]
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1253
Loc: northern California
Originally Posted By: lalakeys
There's a huge difference between volunteering one morning each week and volunteering every school day! Seems to me you're being taken advantage of ($500 for an all-year, every day commitment is nowhere near fair compensation). If I were you, I would maybe be willing to come in a few days before a concert and rehearse a couple of times; then accept $200 for the 2 or 3 rehearsals and concert.



Yes, you are right. They actually want me to come in 3 times per week, which is still a lot more than once per week.
The kicker here is: I ADORE THE DIRECTOR. He is an awesome musician and I love accompanying for him and his groups. I've taken many other accompanist jobs but this guy is THE ONE for me to play for. So I really want this to work out. He asked if I would do it for $1500, if he could get the school to pay. I said I would think about it. Thanks everyone for your support and comments.
_________________________
Piano Teacher 1991

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#1220764 - 06/21/09 09:52 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: Barb860]
Gary D. Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/30/08
Posts: 3453
Loc: South Florida
My take:

We are in horrible times. You mentioned a school closing due to budget cuts. Music programs have been entirely cut in my area, and I'm not talking about cut back. They are gone, and so are the jobs of very good musicians who had jobs teaching.

I don't see things getting better, at least not for a long time.

This puts you in a very precarious situation. If you have the time, I can see you volunteering your services *because of extraordinary economic times*. I would not do it, but I would admire you for giving of yourself in this way.

However, taking money suddenly puts it into another area, to me. Now you are being paid something that is extremely low (as others have pointed out) and that may or may not even cover gas and extra wear-and-tear on your car.

So if you simply give your time, I think you can present this as a personal commitment to music, in general. It seems to me that taking $500 is actually worse, because you are then seen as working in a professional capacity for "slave wages".

Tough situation, I know. I'm glad I'm not in it. smile
_________________________
Piano Teacher

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#1220766 - 06/21/09 09:54 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: Barb860]
John v.d.Brook Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/18/06
Posts: 6119
Loc: Olympia, Washington, USA
Originally Posted By: Barb860
Thank you, John! I have been volunteering for the past 7 years and did mention this to my tax accountant some time ago. I recall him saying that I could use it as an advertising expense, something like that, for my piano teaching studio.I will bring it up again. We need all the $ incentives we can get, we greedy piano teachers laugh


Barb, that's not correct. Musicians, performing musicians, who do volunteer work can deduct actual rates of a specified amount. I forget what it was, perhaps $30/hr, $40/hr. It's in the tax code for performing artists. This is a special case. You should claim it, because it is deducted directly from your teaching income, thus reducing your overall taxes by a considerable amount.

Earlier in my teaching career, I accompanied a choir gratus, filled in for the regular organist, and took both the time and mileage as deductions. It is not an advertising expense, although you could stretch it to be "good will."

You need to bring this to the attention of your tax preparer, who should look it up and correct your past returns.
_________________________
"Those who dare to teach must never cease to learn." -- Richard Henry Dann
Full-time Private Piano Teacher offering Piano Lessons in Olympia, WA. www.mypianoteacher.com
Certified by the American College of Musicians; member NGPT, MTNA, WSMTA, OMTA

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#1220900 - 06/22/09 08:52 AM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: Gary D.]
jjtpiano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/19/08
Posts: 213
Loc: Jamestown, NC
I paid an accompanist $450 for a semester. The gig was to accompany a community chorus.

One rehearsal per week (12 of them) and two performances.
_________________________
Live Music Is Best

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#1220923 - 06/22/09 10:34 AM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: John v.d.Brook]
Morodiene Online   content
7000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/06/07
Posts: 7495
Loc: Boynton Beach, FL
Originally Posted By: John v.d.Brook
Originally Posted By: Barb860
Thank you, John! I have been volunteering for the past 7 years and did mention this to my tax accountant some time ago. I recall him saying that I could use it as an advertising expense, something like that, for my piano teaching studio.I will bring it up again. We need all the $ incentives we can get, we greedy piano teachers laugh


Barb, that's not correct. Musicians, performing musicians, who do volunteer work can deduct actual rates of a specified amount. I forget what it was, perhaps $30/hr, $40/hr. It's in the tax code for performing artists. This is a special case. You should claim it, because it is deducted directly from your teaching income, thus reducing your overall taxes by a considerable amount.

Earlier in my teaching career, I accompanied a choir gratus, filled in for the regular organist, and took both the time and mileage as deductions. It is not an advertising expense, although you could stretch it to be "good will."

You need to bring this to the attention of your tax preparer, who should look it up and correct your past returns.


Wow, I was not aware of this either. I was told by our accountant many years ago when we had asked about donating our web services. He said that any service can't be deducted, but if something tangible was donated (like a CD ROM or something) then we could deduct the cost of producing that item. I assumed this counted for performing as well. I'll have to look into this a bit further. Thanks!
_________________________
private piano/voice teacher - full time
WMTA member
www.musicperception.com

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#1221481 - 06/23/09 10:15 AM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: Morodiene]
cjp_piano Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/23/08
Posts: 202
Loc: Cincinnati OH
You should do whatever you want. If you WANT to volunteer your services because you love the director and you're fine with it, then do it! But you could charge alot more, too.
_________________________
MTNA Nationally Certified Teacher of Music, Piano
Instructor of Music Theory, Accompanist
Member: MTNA, OhioMTA, SW District OhioMTA
www.mtna.org
www.ohiomta.org
www.swomta.org

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#1221770 - 06/23/09 06:35 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: cjp_piano]
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1253
Loc: northern California
Hey everyone, many thanks for your support and suggestions. You are wonderful! My Favorite Director told me today that the school will pay $1500 for the whole year. I'll accept the position. Meanwhile, thanks to John here at PW for his information on the tax incentives. I asked my tax guy about this and he said John is absolutely right, there are incentives for performing artists who volunteer, he just didn't know I was doing that. So I may end up doing this as a volunteer, whichever way makes the most sense for me $$$.

Underpaid workers: unite!!!!! grin
_________________________
Piano Teacher 1991

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#1221845 - 06/23/09 09:31 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: Barb860]
Kreisler Online   confused
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 12480
Loc: Iowa City, IA
$1500 = Good! Have fun! laugh
_________________________
"If we continually try to force a child to do what he is afraid to do, he will become more timid, and will use his brains and energy, not to explore the unknown, but to find ways to avoid the pressures we put on him." (John Holt)

www.pianoped.com
www.youtube.com/user/UIPianoPed

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#1221852 - 06/23/09 10:27 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: John v.d.Brook]
Seeker Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/26/04
Posts: 293
Loc: Rockville, MD
Originally Posted By: John v.d.Brook
[quote=Kreisler]$2.75/hour = No.

Remember that volunteer service, done as a professional activity, such as you're doing, is tax deductible. As soon as you receive remuneration, of any kind, it's no longer deductible, rather, it becomes taxable. You get a double whammy.
SNIP SNIP SNIP SNIP SNIP----------------


John - that is GREAT advice. I know you're not an accountant, but can you point us at where in the tax code, or what IRS publication describes this deduction? I've done a lot of volunteering, and it would be nice to be able to document and deduct some of it.

Barb - talk to your tax person. I guess that if you take the money, you will wind up LOSING by the time you factor in transportation costs as well as what you'll have to pay in taxes.
_________________________
Andrew Kraus, Pianist
Educated Amateur Tuner/Technician
Rockville, MD USA
www.AndrewKraus.com
www.YouTube.com/RockvillePianoGuy
Twitter at @IAmAPianist

1929 Steinert 6'10" (Close copy of New York S&S "B")

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#1221859 - 06/23/09 10:55 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: Seeker]
John v.d.Brook Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/18/06
Posts: 6119
Loc: Olympia, Washington, USA
Andrew, I'm not an accountant nor a tax lawyer. That's why anyone interested should discuss this with their tax preparer. As far as I can see, for most situations, people cannot deduct their volunteer time, but it is my impression that performing artists fall into a special category. Something on my TurboTax software, I think. I've spent about 15 minutes doing an IRS web search on their site, and all I can find is that you can deduct mileage to and from the job. The case I sited was several years ago, almost a decade at that, so my recollection may be incorrect or the tax code could have changed. It may be that it's because a performance is something tangible. At any rate, check it out with your tax adviser.
_________________________
"Those who dare to teach must never cease to learn." -- Richard Henry Dann
Full-time Private Piano Teacher offering Piano Lessons in Olympia, WA. www.mypianoteacher.com
Certified by the American College of Musicians; member NGPT, MTNA, WSMTA, OMTA

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#1221883 - 06/24/09 12:15 AM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: John v.d.Brook]
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1253
Loc: northern California
Just to clarify:
I am not trying to do either of the following:
1. rip off the school
2. rip off the IRS

I just don't want to rip off myself in the process cool

Agreed: it pays to check the tax codes and consult a professional, and each situation could be different for us as self-employed folks.
_________________________
Piano Teacher 1991

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#1222126 - 06/24/09 12:50 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: Barb860]
John v.d.Brook Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/18/06
Posts: 6119
Loc: Olympia, Washington, USA
I need to correct something - I don't use TurboTax, I use H&R Block's Tax Cut software, which I found to be more comprehensive without all the gewgaws that TT incorporates.
_________________________
"Those who dare to teach must never cease to learn." -- Richard Henry Dann
Full-time Private Piano Teacher offering Piano Lessons in Olympia, WA. www.mypianoteacher.com
Certified by the American College of Musicians; member NGPT, MTNA, WSMTA, OMTA

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#1222551 - 06/25/09 10:37 AM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: John v.d.Brook]
Stanny Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/08/06
Posts: 1292
I use taxcut too...it's easy to use.
_________________________
~Stanny~

Independent Music Teacher
Certified Piano Teacher, American College of Musicians
MTNA

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#1222700 - 06/25/09 04:14 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: Barb860]
mkorman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/26/04
Posts: 180
Loc: Connecticut, USA
Wow, I am really impressed if you can do this every morning for the entire school year. That sounds a bit excessive to me. $1500 for the whole year is still only a little bit higher than a minimum wage job. I accompany for a community choir once a week that works out to around $20/hour, including performances, and that's probably about the lowest I would go.

And, if you really enjoy doing this, so much that you're volunteering, maybe you should look for gigs that pay better.

If you're an accompanist, you will always be treated as an employee, so you may as well be paid for it!


Edited by mkorman (06/25/09 04:17 PM)

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#1222707 - 06/25/09 04:33 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: mkorman]
Gary D. Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/30/08
Posts: 3453
Loc: South Florida
I don't think the point was enjoying the playing. I think that is secondary. Remember, a school has been closed. There are money issues.

It is unlikely that Barb will get paid much money. That was made pretty clear from the top. The question is whether or not she wants to do this "good deed", and whether it will be sufficiently appreciated, with some side comments about not getting hosed by the IRS!!!
_________________________
Piano Teacher

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#1222870 - 06/25/09 10:20 PM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: mkorman]
Barb860 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/11/09
Posts: 1253
Loc: northern California
Originally Posted By: mkorman
Wow, I am really impressed if you can do this every morning for the entire school year. That sounds a bit excessive to me. $1500 for the whole year is still only a little bit higher than a minimum wage job. I accompany for a community choir once a week that works out to around $20/hour, including performances, and that's probably about the lowest I would go.

And, if you really enjoy doing this, so much that you're volunteering, maybe you should look for gigs that pay better.

If you're an accompanist, you will always be treated as an employee, so you may as well be paid for it!


I hear you. Gary is right, though: it's much more than just the $ for me, this accompanist position. I dearly love playing for the director and have ties to the school and the district, lots of longevity there. And we have terrible budget issues in our state right now with education. I have a vested interest in my community here to keep music in the schools. That said, I still don't want to feel like this is a burden. It will be more like 3 mornings per week and the school is fairly close by. Some of my piano students are in the choir.
_________________________
Piano Teacher 1991

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#1222950 - 06/26/09 06:33 AM Re: volunteering accompanist service [Re: Barb860]
TimR Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/17/04
Posts: 1810
Loc: Virginia, USA
It's a good deed as well as fun, and with some small pay.

But also every gig is an audition. You're in public playing, and lots of people hear you, not just the kids. Other teachers, parents at the concerts, etc.

I would imagine you would generate significant other income with the people who walk up and ask for lessons or hire you for other gigs.
_________________________
gotta go practice

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