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Originally Posted by keystring
AZN, it might simply be impossible to picture in this medium. As I saw in Morodiene's description, we start with the idea of the weight of the arm transferring to the finger which ends up depressing the key. But what happens to the weight of the arm once the note has been played and the finger relaxes? What's gone down has to come up again or something like that (?) If you are not lifting the finger after playing, and if there's been a weight transfer toward the finger in some way, then what happens at the end of that? My questions do tend to come at the end of the note these days.


OK< I'll try to answer, and hopefully I get what you're asking. The forum is often difficult to explain such things!

So the weight of the arm comes down in free fall. That weight is focused on a finger to allow for greater efficiency. We are using gravity to depress the key, and gravity has a greater effect on a heavier object (the arm) vs. a lighter object (the finger). Once that energy of the free fall is transferred to the key, it dissipates into the instrument. It is not longer in the hands, and you are left with simply the effect of gravity on the arm at rest. The pressure of the free fall if gone at that point, and it is simply gravity itself holding down the key. This is important, because you never want to continue adding pressure to the key beyond gravity itself once you've played it.

So after you have played a note and you're left with only gravity from the arm holding down a key, it takes very little effort to then lift the hand off the keys from the wrist. Or if playing another note afterwards, you will simply be taking the weight of the arm away from the finger, so then you're left with only gravity affecting the finger, which is not enough to hold down a key.

The transfer of energy (the pressure) goes into the key. If you are playing more than one note, then you can also use that same energy to transfer some of it to the next note. Of course, there will be energy lost when you get to the 2nd, 3rd & 4th notes if you transfer. Think of a two-note slur. The first note is always heavier than the 2nd note, and there should be a downward motion of the wrist one the first note, and an upward motion of the wrist on the 2nd. It would take more energy to make the 2nd note equal in sound to the first, because it doesn't have the advantage of pressure from the arm weight free-fall. In order to make note 2 as loud (or louder) you have to bounce the wrist down with pressing the key, allow for that free fall motion to happen again.


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keystring,
I think it might be helpful to think of Morodienne's description as partly a pedagogical metaphor.

There are aspects of it that, from a pure physics viewpoint, will seem either incomplete or simply wrong. Don't get sidetracked by that. The approach may still be highly effective at learning what you want to learn.



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Morodiene, thank you - that's exactly what I was looking for. I've encountered the word "weight" before outside piano. I'm seeing it now as an energy or transfer from the arm to the finger, so dynamic rather than the static heaviness one associates with weight and gravity.

I need a teacher for working with this in any meaningful way - that may actually become possible - but in the meantime a couple of things have fallen into place that help me. Thank you for taking the time to explain. My apologies to the OP for horning in on the thread.

KS

TimR #1223038 06/26/09 10:46 AM
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Originally Posted by TimR


There are aspects of it that, from a pure physics viewpoint, will seem either incomplete or simply wrong. Don't get sidetracked by that. The approach may still be highly effective at learning what you want to learn.



I certainly am no physicist, but if I'm wrong about something, please let me know. I don't want to be saying confusing things or using terminology incorrectly. This is where a forum, unfortunately is so much more difficult to divulge the information. I'm forced to use words where I would simply show the person instead.


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TimR - just saw your post. Thank you for the concern. It would be foolish to use the Internet as an "how to" - This kind of thing requires one-on-one. However, Morodiene's explanation was crystal clear where it counted and gave me exactly what I was looking for. Let's say that something fell in place for me.

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Originally Posted by Morodiene
I don't want to be saying confusing things or using terminology incorrectly.


You would not have been confusing to a layperson. You might have been to a physicist or engineer (like me) if we were in nitpicky mode. I wasn't sure of keystring's background, can't keep track of the players without a program. He indicates he understood clearly so all's well.

Last edited by TimR; 06/26/09 12:23 PM.

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Hey there! I've been playing and trying to improve my technique. Now I'm more confident in playing with dynamics but I still can't use my arms correctly. I've tried your practise tips but it's heck difficult to learn without a teacher.

Now I've been practising Chopin's Heroic Polonaise and I think I can play it fairly good. I wanted to ask you that what classical piece would be fine to learn after this, 'cause I really don't know much about classical music. And it's better that the piece isn't harder than Heroic Polonaise, 'cause this is far too difficult for my technical level :''D. Any suggestions?

Last edited by GaryOak; 12/25/09 10:18 AM.
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Hello there again, I'm here with a new video. I haven't had much time to practise lately but I guess I have improved at least a little. It's still quite hard to even practise to use wrists and arms better but I think I can improve in those too in upcoming years. So, this video is Yiruma's River Flows in You.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ipiieHe46yU

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