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#1227926 - 07/06/09 09:24 PM Bossa Nova
Elssa Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/15/05
Posts: 1555
Loc: NY
Hi all,

Just wondering if anyone else is into playing bossa nova (Jobim, etc) on the piano/keyboard? What is your favorite rhythm pattern for it? Has any specific site or method helped you with this?

Thanks. smile


Edited by Elssa (07/06/09 09:30 PM)

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Piano & Music Accessories
#1227974 - 07/07/09 12:22 AM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: Elssa]
Jazz+ Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/07/04
Posts: 838
Loc: Banned
,,,,

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#1228009 - 07/07/09 07:17 AM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: Jazz+]
dario77 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/21/09
Posts: 35
bossa nova is actually fairly easy, just play 1,1,7,7 of the chord on the beats in your left, if you have large hands you can play 10ths also instead of 7

with 5,5,1,1 fingering

the best to practice is "song for my father"

later when you develop that technique use 2,3,4 fingers for harmony


Edited by dario77 (07/07/09 07:18 AM)

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#1228015 - 07/07/09 08:11 AM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: dario77]
knotty Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/01/07
Posts: 2993
Loc: Bethesda, MD (Washington D.C)
for song for my father, I'd do something along these lines, using just 1-5 in the bass:


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#1228060 - 07/07/09 10:50 AM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: knotty]
KlinkKlonk Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/19/09
Posts: 358
Listen to any guitar comp of indigenous bossa nova and you'll notice that there's no eight notes in the bass, just quarter notes notes alternating 1 and 5. All the other syncopation is in the treble chords togheter with the anticipations of the melody.

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#1228067 - 07/07/09 11:10 AM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: KlinkKlonk]
jjo Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/09/08
Posts: 626
Loc: Chicago
This is the basic rhythm I was taught, although it's hard to describe in writing. It's a two bar pattern:

In the first bar, play on beat 1, beat 2, the and of 3, the and of 4 (which holds over to the next bar; then play on beat 2 of the second bar, and the and of 3 and the and of 4 in the next bar. This pattern can go on endlessly and blissfully. As I was once told, it should sway, not swing.

You can "retart" the pattern by playing both on the and of beat 4 in bar 1 and the first beat of bar 2.

You also have to think about when to change the chord. Depending upon the melody, you can change on the and of 4 in the bar just before the chord changes, or hit the new chord on beat 1.

The pattern I've described is what you'll hear guitar players using, and it works great for piano. The Song for My Father pattern quoted above is something I think of as the bass line, rather than for a chordal instrument.

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#1228073 - 07/07/09 11:30 AM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: jjo]
knotty Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/01/07
Posts: 2993
Loc: Bethesda, MD (Washington D.C)
yeah, that snippet above is meant as a baseline. From memory, that's more or less what Horace Silver plays, but I could be wrong.
It's easy to play as a bass-line and not get lost.

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#1228129 - 07/07/09 01:54 PM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: knotty]
Elssa Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/15/05
Posts: 1555
Loc: NY
Hi Knotty,

Your pattern was the one I was using most often with "Wave", sometimes varying it by hitting the root twice in a dotted rhythm like that and then going up to the fifth, sometimes root down to fifth, etc. I don't think you can hear the bass lines too well with my recording because I was using the Jazz Guitar setting of my Roland, which doesn't have a loud bass sound. I use this same common pattern with other songs like "So Nice" (Summer Samba).

Jjo, that's the basic bossa pattern I was taught by a teacher years ago, and I still use that for songs like "Meditation" (Jobim). That pattern seems more difficult.. It didn't work for me at times with "Wave", maybe because the melody is busier.

Thanks all for the great info and ideas.

Just found this site:
http://www.bluesjazzpiano.com/bossa-nova-bass.html


Edited by Elssa (07/07/09 01:58 PM)

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#1228437 - 07/08/09 05:30 AM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: KlinkKlonk]
KlinkKlonk Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/19/09
Posts: 358
Originally Posted By: KlinkKlonk
Listen to any guitar comp of indigenous bossa nova and you'll notice that there's no eight notes in the bass, just quarter notes notes alternating 1 and 5. All the other syncopation is in the treble chords togheter with the anticipations of the melody.


I mean halfnotes in the bass...

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#1228453 - 07/08/09 07:49 AM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: KlinkKlonk]
Bob Newbie Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/02/06
Posts: 1549
Ellsa .. the pianoguy had Bradley Sowash demonstrate Latin Rythms
on the show last week..(repeat)

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#1228564 - 07/08/09 01:23 PM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: Bob Newbie]
Elssa Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/15/05
Posts: 1555
Loc: NY
BTW, my teacher also mentioned the "clave" rhythms, including the "bossa nova clave":
www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clave_(rhythm)

Hi Bob,

Wish I got Piano Guy on PBS here. I e-mailed the station and requested it a while ago, but they still don't have it. I did a quick check on youtube for the Bradley Sowash's Latin Rhythms that you mentioned but couldn't find it, unfortunately. I bet it was great. smile


Edited by Elssa (07/08/09 01:25 PM)

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#1228639 - 07/08/09 04:36 PM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: Elssa]
Bob Newbie Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/02/06
Posts: 1549
Elssa: this might help! the Latin thing is in the "Blue Bayou" episode.. also check with your cable company listings in the Digital TV portion ..it wasn't available for me either until I checked higher up digital bandwith in my area it was ch.. 257

http://www.youtube.com/user/pianoguytv

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#1228661 - 07/08/09 05:42 PM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: Bob Newbie]
Elssa Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/15/05
Posts: 1555
Loc: NY
Thanks for the link and suggestions! I just looked but couldn't find the show on my cable/digital list anywhere. Couldn't find his "Blue Bayou" on you tube either. He also used to have a video lesson with the song "South of the Border", but that's gone now as well. Oh, well..There are some other ones that look interesting there. Guess I'll also try asking PBS again to get the program.

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#1228715 - 07/08/09 08:09 PM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: Elssa]
Bob Newbie Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/02/06
Posts: 1549
Elssa: Bradley visits this board infrequently..perhaps you can ask him about the latin segment?

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#1229047 - 07/09/09 05:46 PM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: Bob Newbie]
Elssa Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/15/05
Posts: 1555
Loc: NY
Good idea, Bob, will do. smile

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#1229597 - 07/10/09 03:06 PM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: Elssa]
hv Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/18/04
Posts: 1226
Loc: Cape Cod
My wife and I recently started getting into Jobim. I think it was the seductively sweet vocals that drew us in as much as the music... the language is so beautiful. She started by listening to a Jobim/Ellis Reginia CD to learn the pronunciation. Then picked up The Music of Jobim for the music. I just happened to have my video camera set up to record something totally different when she was telling another musician friend how cool Jobim was and decided to do a piece for the 1st time ever... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UWopPz1Aj6o ... Glynn was just reading the bass line and had never heard of Jobim before. Notice that Sue changed a few notes on the sheets up front for Glynn's benefit and to get them to jive with the CD she'd been listening to.

Here's the 2nd piece she learned ... and the 1st time playing one in public: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-K179a5AZa8

Just spent the holiday weekend out on Cape Cod and was blown away by how many Brazilians we met. They tell me one of their favorite performers is James Taylor who apparently shows up occasionally singing Bossa Nova in Portuguese.

Howard

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#1231035 - 07/13/09 04:43 PM Re: Bossa Nova [Re: hv]
Elssa Online   content
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/15/05
Posts: 1555
Loc: NY
Those were really wonderful performances! smile Thanks so much for posting the videos!

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