I'm in the same boat. My 61-key Casio lights up too. I also want a full sized DP but it's hard to find one that has the guide lamps.

Maybe I'm an idiot but I've scoured this forum and I've asked the teachers in the teacher's forum and I seem to be the one-and-only person on the planet who thinks that lighted keys are a capital idea. What could be better for learning to finger chords and learn the notes? Once I learn the notes I turn the lights off and play. The problem is that the only full size DPs I can find with guide lights are some of the Yamaha Clavinovas which are a bit spendy for me.

Anyhow I've lurked here long enough to know that you can get a reasonably decent keyboard for $1000. I've read good reports here about the Yamaha YPG-635 but haven't laid hands on one so don't take my word. You'll probably be told that Williams isn't the best brand. And there's a guy named Gyro that tells everybody that all DPs are the same thing from the same factory, just packaged in a different box. Good luck.

Between those two, the Korg has a better action and possibly better sound. I would strongly recommend that one. Of course, if you're in a position to play both, by all means try to do this and decide for yourself.

It sounds like you really want a console-type model. There aren't many good choices under $1000. For less than $1000, you can get a stage-type Yamaha, but the very cheapest Yamahas are not that great. They have significant compromises in their action and sound samples. If you can afford a YDP-160 or CLP-320, those are strongly worth considering. A Kawai ES-6 is also nice, but would also be slightly over $1000.

Casios are not bad. Some people say that they don't hold up over time, but any others have had good luck with them. The AP-200 has just been replaced by a slightly upgraded model (I think AP-230). If you can find the older model on special it could be a good deal.

For me, the light up keys were just to help me with learning some simple songs .
Uhh, I never really used the 3-step lesson ._." it just made it harder for me ...
But yeahh- The Korg seems really nice, but my grandpa is paying for it.
He's retired, and you know- the $$$, and he encouraged me to buy a new one, but I dont wanna make him broke buying a Yamaha Nocturne N100 :\ [ my dream piano. ]
The Casio AP-200 is what my mom wants to buy cause we can get it cheap at Costco for $800.00- my grandpa is only paying for a portion of the piano, not everything. He's paying for $800.00, cause my grandpa thinks i'm getting the AP-200 and not the Korg.
My Williams piano looks good BUT i've never really heard of them- how is their customer service, and how well do their keys play?

You will be hard-pressed to find any favorable Williams feedback here. They're pretty low-end with an awkward and light key feel. I would spring for the cheapest Casio DP before I considered the most high-end Williams.

What about the Yamaha YDP-S31? I'm trying to aim for a Cabinet-styled digital piano, as a cheap sub for an acoustic. I also want it to have an either slide or falling key-cover... That's why I'm specifically looking at the Yamaha Arius series, or Korg.

PS- I can't find any Yamaha under $1000 .

Williams rarely get good comments on these forums. So honestly, I would stay away from them. The Korg LP350 was just released within this year, so that's always nice. Although it shares the EXACT same stats as its portable brother (SP250) and it's 300 bucks cheaper and was released three years ago.

I also have heard Korg has very bad costumer service and won't own up to warranties.

The only other thing I can think of under $1000 is Casio digital piano's. Great bang for the buck, but like Geoffk said, they are rumored to wear out quickly.

Good luck!

The Korg SP250 is nice, but I am looking for a cabinet type of digital piano ... but i will DEFINITELY keep that in mind ... Anything from Roland? From my observations, they are mostly stage/studio pianos. Yamaha isn't in my price range, and I don't know much about Kawai ... any other suggestions?

- Compact
- Under $1000
- Durable [ lasts long ]

So far, my best bet is the Korg SP250, but that's still a hugee MAYBE.
Gotta figure it out by the 25th :\

The cheapest cabinet-type Roland is the RP-101. This is a great piano, but will cost about $1500 or so.

The reason why light-up keys are disparaged by some teachers is that they encourage you to look at the keyboard and your fingers while you're playing. This discourages proper sight-reading and muscle memory for feeling the keys. I also think that they're a bad idea. In any case, you'll be hard-pressed to find them on any serious keyboard.

Based on what you've written either the Korg or the Casio AP-200 would be a reasonable choice. Unless you find something used, you won't do any better than these two within your budget. And both are good instruments.

LP350 has very good speaker for the price. And it looks freaking nice
RH3 keys are good, used in their high end M3-88 synth too

No wonder I'm not very good at sight reading o_o
Especially ledger lines, ahaha.
What about Yamaha? None under $1,000?

I'm not sure if that matters to me, Geoffk. I've no intention of learning to sight read. I find that I can learn music from the guide lights driven by MIDI files. The MIDIs are easy to find on the web or with a little work I can make my own. What's wrong with that?



You mentioned Costco. Costco.com is advertising the Yamaha DGX630 for $750 if that appeals. Not a high-end DP but a step up from your 61-key Casio....if you can live without those cool light-up keys.

Ahaha, well- I was looking into buying that.
Although, I hear the speakers aren't of the best quality.
My mom is leaning for the Korg, but she won't give me a Christmas present this year :P
[ to think of it, what about the past 3 years?! xP ]

But yeah- she's probably gonna pay around $300-400 more...
$800.00 from my Grandpa for the Korg LP-350
$200.00 from my mom to pay for the REST of the Korg
$200.00 for this fancy bench ;D

But that's still a maybe on the $400.00- but I don't think that the Guitar Center i'm going to sells the Korg with a bench.. I think I'm gonna have to get it separately.

Anyone know any good benches? xP
Height Adjustable, with a 2-3 inch compartment for music, and padded? Nothing over $125 :\

Use the coupon below to get a Yamaha dp for $850.

http://www.music123.com/Yamaha-Arius-YDP140-Digital-Piano-703247-i1393192.Music123

1 Spring Fever Party Instant Savings for Yamaha
Coupon Code: YAMAHAOFF
($200.00)
($200.00)

Yamaha Arius YDP140 Digital Piano (#703247)
Availability: In Stock

$1,049.99
$1,349.00
Free Shipping! $1,049.99


Enter coupon code YAMAHAOFF

Subtotal: $849.99 Shipped

I would use that code [ cause that's a REALLY good deal! (= Thanks for post! ]
But my mom has to get it through the store- she, like me, wants instant gratification.
Although- if she won't buy the Korg, i'll tell her about that
And she'd probably want to get that rather than the Williams or Casio AP-200
Any stores in California Los Angeles / Long Beach area that sells the Korg LP350?

If you print out a copy of the Music123 cart and take it to a Guitar Center store, they will likely match the price (or at least come close).

You should call the store before you go to make sure they have it in stock, but I wouldn't ask them to match the price until you are in the store. If they don't have it in stock, ask them to check on their computer if any other guitar center stores in your area have it. The YDP-140 is fairly popular, so most likely they will have it.

So what do I tell them when I walk up to the register?
Because if I print out the cart, I think Guitar Center would be confused.
Are Music123 and Guitar Center related - in any way ?

Both stores are owned by the same company and Guitar Center has a 110% price match policy. That means they might even sell it for less than $850. However, I wouldn't push it because the 110% price guarantee is usually after the sale. They will likely match the price though.

Price match policy:

http://guitarcenter.custhelp.com/cgi-bin/guitarcenter.cfg/php/enduser/std_adp.php?p_faqid=1280

I thought that was Musiciansfriend.com that was the Web store for Guitar Center.
Did they acquire music123?

My 2 cents on the topic: if you can get the YDP-160 for under $1000 (and that is not impossible with such economy), it is a good cabinet DP, significantly better than the YDP-140 (action, amplification and piano voices are better).

EPIC thanks (=
Much appreciated! ^.^
Uhh, where do you find the promo codes? xP
I wanna get one [ for the korg ]
Ahaha :P
But that will be a second choice- definitely.

You are correct. Musician's Friend is a Guitar Center operation. Also, the Williams is a Guitar Center house brand. It is relatively feature-rich for the price, and looks pretty good as well. As far as the touch and tone of the Williams (or any of these) you really have to be the judge by shopping in person. Do not rely heavily on others' opinions. They will not be paying for or playing your new piano.

Lighted keys may seem like a cheap gimmick to some. To others they are a cool feature. They are available on digitals in different price ranges from different makers. They are not some sort of cheap come-on. Again, you need to be the judge.

Many of the opinions expressed here are regurgitation of other opinions. For example, the poster from Japan has never seen, heard, or played a Williams, but nonetheless never misses an opportunity to tell you that their touch and tone are inferior to just about everything else on the market. I can not emphasize this enough...try out the different options and make up your own mind. If you are dealing with Guitar Center and/or Musician's Friend, study their return policy very carefully so as to understand your rights as a buyer. Also, pay attention to warranty terms and what is required of you to fulfill the conditions of the warranty.

There is a new free website that gives you a lot of free information on digital piano shopping. You can access it by entering pianobuyer.com and reading the section on digitals. The advantage is that the writer Alden Skinner (a member here) has tried the instruments about which he writes and is very knowledgeable about the current market.

I doubt I would be getting the Williams piano anyways-
considering that I have a promotion code for the Yamaha Arius YDP-140
Although- I will try the it, even if I were going to buy it or not.
So far, I'm going to be trying the Yamaha YDP-140, Korg LP-350, and the Williams

As for the return policy, I'm going to analyze and print it [ ahaha! ]
Yes, ahaha, just like for school! =P

Props to Alden Skinner for making Pianobuyer.com!

They acquired Music123 more than a year ago. I agree that the YPD-160 is much better. I just bought one using the coupon above for $1150. It took less than a week to arrive. No guitar center stores in my area had it in stock, but they did have the 140.

Well, now- the competition is harder :P
the KORG LP-350 -vs- YAMAHA ARIUS YDP-140 ...
If I get lucky I might get the 160 =\
Highly doubt that she's gonna get it though
the Korg itself is a push at $1k

I have a Williams Overture, which
I believe is a less expensive model
than the Elite. I personally like
the Overture, so the Elite should
be even better.

However, I have a long history
with pianos, which has produced
an attitude towards them that
maybe goes somewhat against
the grain. I grew up
with classical piano lessons
and acoustic pianos only, an
upright at home, and uprights and
grands in the teachers' studios
and at recitals. I quit in
high school, and when I restarted
as an adult 20 yrs. later, the
first piano I bought was an
expensive upright, thinking that
the best piano I could afford
would help my playing. A similar
model today would be in the
~$20,000 price range, although
when I bought it, it was less
than $6000. I soon discovered,
however, that I had made a big
mistake and had wasted a lot of
money, because the expensive
upright didn't do anything for
my playing. That upright is
now in storage and is going to
remain in storage because I find
digitals much more practical.
Frankly, I think acoustic pianos,
particularly uprights (grands
are still nice as furniture in
the home), are all but obsolescent
for home use, and I can't see
why people even bother with
them anymore.

Since that bad experience with the
expensive upright, I've been
very skittish about spending a
lot on a piano. I've been playing
only digitals since 1989, and
I've owned four. A Korg C-800
console, bought new in a store
in 1989 for $1700. This was
in the early days of home digitals,
but even back then there were
fully-weighted key digitals. This
was a very expensive option, however,
back then, and I refused to shell out
the extra money for them, and so
I got the C-800, which had
semi-weighted keys.

My next one was a Casio AP-24
console bought sight-unseen
online in 2005 for $700. This
was my first weighted-key digital.
By 2005 the prices for digitals
had come way down, and this
was right in line with my thinking,
and so I bought the least
expensive console available.

My third digital was a Korg
SP-250 lightweight console,
bought sight-unseen online in
2006 for $900.

My fourth and current digital
is a Williams Overture, bought
sight-unseen online in 2009
for $600.

So you can see from the above
that the general trend with me has
been to get lower and lower-priced
pianos: ~$20,000(~$6000) ---> $1700
---> $700 ---> $900 ---> $600,
even as my playing has gotten
more advanced. This is the
reverse from most people, who
tend to upgrade to more expensive
pianos over time.

I've have used all five of the
above pianos to work on the same
music, including advanced classical
works like the Chopin op. 14
Concert Rondo. The op. 14 plays
just fine on the $600 Williams,
so why bother with getting a
more expensive piano is how I
think.

I
think I
am
going to be
sick.

Gyro, I still do not understand why you keep such acoustic hidden in a storage - What is the model (and serial #)? I might have friends who would be interested to buy it from you if the price is right.

Well- I want to get a quality piano, because I'm probably not gonna get one for 6-10 years...
and by then, I'm probably going to get a contemporary grand DP,
like the Yamaha N100- as my permanent piano,
until something goes wrong with it .
But I believe that the Korg will work fine in those 6-10 years,
as comparison to the Yamaha,
which I would feel that I
would have to buy the YDP-160 in later years.

[apologies for the off-topic]

Gyro, may I ask why your posts are formatted with manual carriage returns after five/six words?

Kind regards,
James
x

If you're happy with it, than it's fine. But it's like saying, "I don't need to read books; I can just get an audiobook for anything I want". Yes, that would work, but it's clumsy and time consuming. Once you learn to read, you'll find it actually works much better. It's the same with sight-reading music. Your skills will improve faster, and you'll have a much wider range of source material.

The poster from Japan encouraged him to try one out for himself if he could. But since no one, possibly apart from Gyro, is able to recommend them, I can't do so in good conscience either.

Perhaps Williams will become popular in Japan. If that ever happens, I'll fly a pig down to the store and try one.

YDP140 feels lighter than LP350 and sounds a bit thinner, like P70/85
but YDP160's touch is miles better, very nice action

Fair enough that you can't recommend a Williams. But in the meantime, until you saddle up the pig , it might be a good idea to refrain from statements like this:

"Between those two [Korg and Williams], the Korg has a better action and possibly better sound. I would strongly recommend that one."

Statements such as this (and you have made many) give the incorrect impression that you have first-hand experience with Williams pianos.

Just.Jose - My first keyboard lit up and played that annoying Titanic theme song ;-)

Your best bet, by far, on your limited budget is to focus on the keyboard action, rather than the sound, because you are not going to get great sound for that price. If you can get a $500 keyboard with halfway decent action, which I know Guitar center has, make sure it has USB out and get it. (I tried Williams at Guitar Center and while the sound was terrible the action wasn't that bad for the price.) Then download Pianoteq on your computer and try it (Buy itfor $350), spend $50 on an M-Audio USB sound device, hook some speakers into it, and you nearly have a $6000 Roland V-piano for less than $1000.

Yes you would get more realistic action with a $2000 DP, but you are on a budget.

Summary, focus on the action, not the sound, as you can get the best sound available doing the above with any keyboard.

The keyboard will be in my living room, which- doesn't have a computer, hence, the sub for an acoustic. I also dont want to get an acoustic upright because I doubt that it has any headphones ... As for now, I'm on getting the Korg LP350, or the Arius YDP-140/160.

As for my wants/needs:

• Graded Hammer Action [ GHA ]
• 88-keys
• under $1000.00
• compact [ we're soon getting the 103" Panasonic Plasma screen TV for our living room -___- ]
• cabinet-styled

:P Both the KORG and YAMAHA fit both of those :\

Any pros/cons on the yamaha, or any tips to figure out which one I should get?

On specs alone, I would go with the Korg over the Yamaha. The Yamaha speakers are considerably less powerful. However, play both for awhile at Guitar Center or something, maybe visit a piano shop and play an acoustic too to know what a real piano sounds and feels like, then get the one you like better. In a couple of years, when you may consider upgrading, think about spending $1000 on an extra PC or laptop, Pianoteq, and a couple monitor speakers to sit next or on your DP for a quick effective upgrade.

I was very happy with the $2200 PF-500 from Yamaha for about 5 years, but as I played better and listened to real pianos more I realized the sound and resonance/color among were lacking and was going to buy a Roland V-Piano vs a cheap grand for $6 thousand dollars but spent less than $1000 on Pianoteq, Monitor Speakers, and a Yamaha Audiogram 3 USB sound device and ended up with a much better bargain and a better or at least equal playing and sound experience. As for compactness, I still have the DP sitting in the dining room, looking more or less the same as before (except for the speakers), as the PC is underneath it.

Good luck with your purchase!

Clumsy and time consuming?
Perhaps you're right Geoffk. Perhaps reading the dots & blips on the paper, interpreting the bizarre language of sheet music, correlating it to piano keys and doing all this while playing piano without looking is easier than learning the notes directly from the keyboard. To my mind it's like saying that it's easier to land a 747 on a dark night in a blizzard if you do it while carving a Thanksgiving turkey & texting on the cell phone.

Anyhow, I appreciate you sharing your thoughts.
Cheers.

Gyro keeps the acoustic chained up in a dark dungeon downstairs and sneers at it while gloating over his collection of cheap digitals.

Actually the "Clumsy and time consuming" reference was to my hypothetical audiobook analogy. But I understand what you're saying. Just consider this:

- The more complex the music is, the harder it gets to do what you propose. I shudder to think of trying to learn Chopin or Lizst by copying as the notes fly past.
- Even in typing, you're taught not to look at your hands because it slows you down. This is true for piano too.
- Sheet music lets you view the overall structure of the work, and see where the melody is going. It's like a visual road map of the music, once you get used to it.
- As you noted light up instruments are scarce. By getting rid of them, you free yourself to use the vast majority of (usually better) keyboards available.

Of course, piano is for fun, and you should do what you enjoy. But learning to read music and trying to sightread are skills that are worth having, even if it's a little hard to pick up at first.

... and it is fairly easy to learn.

I'd have to agree that light up keys are a dead end. Get the $1.56 Hal Leonard Student Keyboard Guide Template It's a piece of plastic with pictures of the notes that stands vertically along the 88 keys on the back of your keyboard.

You can learn it in 1 day. Don't use the magical light up keyboard, PLEASE!

WOOT WOOT GUYS !
I'm trying/getting the DP today! :]
Wish me luck [x
Trying the ... Korg - Yamaha ARIUS YDP-140 - Williams Overture Elite - Casio AP-200 - Acoustic
This should be fun ^_^
Thanks everyone for the input in helping me get the DP (:
Much appreciated !

-Jose P.

UGHH .
Guitar Center didn't even HAVEE the Korg :\
The 140 felt ... okay- it was a decent feel.
Williams Overture Elite felt somewhat light, but it was fine.
The Casio AP-200 felt nice, but the sound quality wasn't in my favor.
Anyone else know where I could find the Korg LP-350?

Online. I've had good experiences with MusiciansFriend.com and Kraft Music. Musicians Friend is owned by Guitar Center I believe but they have a wider selection.

Is there a store? :\
Cause we can't get it online ...
Were about to leave to New York on the 26th ...
and we won't be here for delivery .

I was thinking of just getting the Casio PX-800 or the Yamaha Arius YDP-140
:\
The Privia, the ONLY reason I'm getting that is cause right after we get it, ther'se coldstone's next to it
Free ice cream x]

I guess you'd have to call around your area and ask. Musician's Friend does have reasonable 2-day delivery rates, so you could get it the 24th or 25th without too much expense.

Or you could wait till you get back???

When I get back, it's school registration... and my mom && dad will be working

I understand where Gyro is coming from. An upright acoustic is large, heavy, and needs to be maintained. A DP is virtually maintenance free (never needs tuning). I also see lots of ads for acoustic uprights on Craigslist that are either dirt cheap or free (as long as you agree to move it). Why are so many people giving away acoustic pianos if they are so great?

My son has been playing on acoustic and digital pianos for 7 years and he says that our new YDP-160 is the best piano he has ever played.