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#1252222 - 08/19/09 09:46 PM Larry Fine's new book and website are "live".
Larry Fine Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/06/06
Posts: 32
Loc: Boston, MA
Thank you for your patience. Please read my special introductory letter to Piano World members.
_________________________
Publisher and Editor, Acoustic & Digital Piano Buyer
and Author, The Piano Book

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#1252225 - 08/19/09 09:56 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Larry Fine]
Norbert Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/03/01
Posts: 14138
Loc: Surrey, B.C.
A first class act - congratulations Larry!!

Norbert thumb thumb
_________________________
www.heritagepianos.com
Greater Vancouver B.C. piano dealers for : C.Sauter, Estonia, Brodmann, Ritmuller
604-951-8642

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#1252229 - 08/19/09 10:02 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Norbert]
Steve Cohen Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 10483
Loc: Maryland/DC/No. VA
Oh? You wrote a new book?
_________________________
Piano Industry Consultant- http://www.linkedin.com/pub/steve-cohen/6/b92/b80

Consultant & Contributing Editor - Acoustic & Digital Piano Buyer

Jasons Music
Maryland/DC/No. VA
Since 1937.

www.jasonsmusic.com
My postings, unless stated otherwise, are my personal opinions, not those of my clients.

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#1252243 - 08/19/09 10:23 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Steve Cohen]
Norbert Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/03/01
Posts: 14138
Loc: Surrey, B.C.
Congratulations and sincere thanks also to Steve Cohen!

He made it happen to have it free for all online users!!

Norbert
_________________________
www.heritagepianos.com
Greater Vancouver B.C. piano dealers for : C.Sauter, Estonia, Brodmann, Ritmuller
604-951-8642

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#1252252 - 08/19/09 10:40 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Norbert]
Rod Verhnjak Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/09/06
Posts: 3659
Loc: Vancouver B.C. Canada
Thanks Larry and Steve.
_________________________
Verhnjak Pianos
Specializing in the Restoration, Refinishing & Maintenance
of Fine Heirloom Pianos

Exclusive Dealer For Charles R. Walter Pianos
www.pianoman.ca
Verhnjak Pianos Facebook


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#1252253 - 08/19/09 10:44 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Norbert]
Piano World Offline



Registered: 05/24/01
Posts: 5593
Loc: Parsonsfield, ME (orig. Nahant...
Congratulations Larry, Alden, and Steve, great job!
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#1252254 - 08/19/09 10:45 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Piano World]
squonk Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/11/07
Posts: 95
Loc: California
Congratulations.

Now I'm never going to get any sleep.
_________________________
Estonia L190-6783

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#1252255 - 08/19/09 10:47 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Norbert]
FogVilleLad Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/02/05
Posts: 4680
Loc: San Francisco
Larry F.'s letter reinforces my expectation that he'll be able to retain his objectivity.

We often post re the increasing quality of Asian-made pianos, but I was struck by his mentioning that computerization has so broadly increased quality that he now sees his role as having changed from critic to guide.

And he's absolutely right about the consequence of the current expectation of money for nuthin' and chicks for free.

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#1252308 - 08/20/09 12:58 AM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: FogVilleLad]
Norbert Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/03/01
Posts: 14138
Loc: Surrey, B.C.
Quote:
We often post re the increasing quality of Asian-made pianos, but I was struck by his mentioning that computerization has so broadly increased quality that he now sees his role as having changed from critic to guide.


This is similiar to what I heared some say during my recent trip to Germany.

They said "we can't build for the price of Estonias and we'll most definitely never get anywhere near the cost of the Chinese".

"So, let's invent the next generation CNC machinery and sell that to them"

"If the Chinese are start building better and better pianos, go ahead, blame us - at least we'll make money with something".....

Norbert
_________________________
www.heritagepianos.com
Greater Vancouver B.C. piano dealers for : C.Sauter, Estonia, Brodmann, Ritmuller
604-951-8642

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#1252391 - 08/20/09 07:42 AM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Norbert]
M.O.P. Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/14/09
Posts: 982
Loc: Ocala, Florida
Very nice. Easy navigation. Recommendations will start today for clients who have been asking about the online version! Thanks, guys!
_________________________
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Seamstress for the Band

www.FortePianoGallery.com
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"The piano was God's gift to music." Lou Mason


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#1252443 - 08/20/09 09:04 AM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Norbert]
Steve Cohen Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 10483
Loc: Maryland/DC/No. VA
Originally Posted By: Norbert
Congratulations and sincere thanks also to Steve Cohen!

He made it happen to have it free for all online users!!

Norbert


No. The core ideas for the new business model, including creating the ability to provide the content free online were Larry's.
_________________________
Piano Industry Consultant- http://www.linkedin.com/pub/steve-cohen/6/b92/b80

Consultant & Contributing Editor - Acoustic & Digital Piano Buyer

Jasons Music
Maryland/DC/No. VA
Since 1937.

www.jasonsmusic.com
My postings, unless stated otherwise, are my personal opinions, not those of my clients.

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#1252453 - 08/20/09 09:30 AM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Steve Cohen]
ChasT Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/06/09
Posts: 649
Loc: Georgia
I just spent the last 20-30 minutes wandering through the site. It's excellent! Lots of information, easy to navigate, looks good. Thank you.

Charles

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#1252455 - 08/20/09 09:34 AM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Steve Cohen]
Monica K. Offline

Platinum Supporter until Dec 31 2012


Registered: 08/10/05
Posts: 17778
Loc: Lexington, Kentucky
"Piano Buyer" is quite impressive, Larry. thumb Congratulations! In particular, I was pleased to see your new format for grouping and ranking pianos. Having a smaller number of categories, and not ranking them within category, reflects more accurately the state of parity in piano manufacturing today, and it will undoubtedly save you a WHOLE lot of grief from fans and manufacturers who want to quibble with differences in rankings that really didn't mean that much.

I wish you the best of luck in this new venture.
_________________________
Mason & Hamlin A -- 91997
My YouTube channel: http://www.youtube.com/pianomonica

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#1252473 - 08/20/09 09:56 AM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Monica K.]
SophieM Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/12/08
Posts: 353
Loc: New York City
Larry et al - Thank you for providing the book on line for free! smile

Just a thought - I actually prefer the old rating system for pianos. There are definitely unmistakable variations in terms of performance and musicality among the pianos listed under Category 2 but they are all lumped together.... I guess this is meant as a very generic guide and the pianist must then discern for him/herself.

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#1252474 - 08/20/09 09:57 AM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Monica K.]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19366
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: Monica K
In particular, I was pleased to see your new format for grouping and ranking pianos. Having a smaller number of categories, and not ranking them within category, reflects more accurately the state of parity in piano manufacturing today, and it will undoubtedly save you a WHOLE lot of grief from fans and manufacturers who want to quibble with difference in rankings that really didn't mean that much.



As I count it there are 6 categories in the latest edition compared to about 13 in the previous one. But in neither one were the pianos in each group ranked. The pianos in each group in the last edition were listed alphabetically.


Edited by pianoloverus (08/20/09 09:58 AM)

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#1252480 - 08/20/09 10:07 AM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Monica K.]
Steve Cohen Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 10483
Loc: Maryland/DC/No. VA
Originally Posted By: Monica K.
In particular, I was pleased to see your new format for grouping and ranking pianos. Having a smaller number of categories, and not ranking them within category, reflects more accurately the state of parity in piano manufacturing today, and it will undoubtedly save you a WHOLE lot of grief from fans and manufacturers who want to quibble with differences in rankings that really didn't mean that much.


Originally Posted By: SophiaM
Just a thought - I actually prefer the old rating system for pianos. There are definitely unmistakable variations in terms of performance and musicality among the pianos listed under Category 2 but they are all lumped together.... I guess this is meant as a very generic guide and the pianist must then discern for him/herself.


Damned if you do...and damned if you don't! wink

LOL
_________________________
Piano Industry Consultant- http://www.linkedin.com/pub/steve-cohen/6/b92/b80

Consultant & Contributing Editor - Acoustic & Digital Piano Buyer

Jasons Music
Maryland/DC/No. VA
Since 1937.

www.jasonsmusic.com
My postings, unless stated otherwise, are my personal opinions, not those of my clients.

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#1252481 - 08/20/09 10:07 AM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: SophieM]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 19366
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: SophieM
Larry et al - Thank you for providing the book on line for free! smile

Just a thought - I actually prefer the old rating system for pianos. There are definitely unmistakable variations in terms of performance and musicality among the pianos listed under Category 2 but they are all lumped together.... I guess this is meant as a very generic guide and the pianist must then discern for him/herself.


Fine said there was no unaninimity of opinion among the techs who offered opinions about these pianos.

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#1252483 - 08/20/09 10:11 AM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Steve Cohen]
SophieM Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/12/08
Posts: 353
Loc: New York City
I know, LOL! grin That's whay I sais "just a thought." Also people (at least me) don't like changes unless they are really necessary...

Congratulations again on a worthy undertaking! smile

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#1252487 - 08/20/09 10:14 AM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: pianoloverus]
SophieM Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/12/08
Posts: 353
Loc: New York City
Very true. But I was just looking at it from a pianist point of view. That's why the standard forum adivce is to try as many pianos as you can and buy the one you like! smile

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#1252550 - 08/20/09 11:18 AM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: M.O.P.]
Aliwally Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/07/07
Posts: 521
Loc: Washington, D.C.
Wow!! Who said good things are not "FREE" anymore. Thanks to all who had their hands in this project. My only problem is between Pre-Season Football & The Buyer's Guide I will not get any rest this weekend.

Peace,
Aliwally
_________________________
Yamaha P-120, Feurich 122

Always look ahead, but never look back. - Miles Davis

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#1252558 - 08/20/09 11:32 AM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Aliwally]
Norbert Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/03/01
Posts: 14138
Loc: Surrey, B.C.
Quote:
But I was just looking at it from a pianist point of view. That's why the standard forum adivce is to try as many pianos as you can and buy the one you like!


Which, as we all know, is the essence of things...

Norbert
_________________________
www.heritagepianos.com
Greater Vancouver B.C. piano dealers for : C.Sauter, Estonia, Brodmann, Ritmuller
604-951-8642

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#1252590 - 08/20/09 12:10 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Norbert]
DanLaura Larson Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/01/08
Posts: 695
Loc: Pocatello, Idaho
Just spent a few minutes skimming through and the online book looks great. I'm looking forward to reading more. I liked the piano ratings in the old supplements, but I think this works just fine too. Great job Larry, Steve, and everyone else who contributed.

Dan
_________________________
Dan and Laura Larson
Fazioli and Ibach grands
Larson Piano Studio
http://www.stoneformsart.com/

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#1252625 - 08/20/09 12:58 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: DanLaura Larson]
Rod Verhnjak Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/09/06
Posts: 3659
Loc: Vancouver B.C. Canada
I too like the old rating system, a bit more separation is easier to decipher.

To me it seems to be ranked more by price.

Some manufactures sell direct to dealers an there is no middle man getting a cut but the quality of said piano may be just as high or higher than a more expensive piano.

Also foreign currency, shipping costs & the middle man may put some pianos in a higher price range but it may not transfer to better quality.




_________________________
Verhnjak Pianos
Specializing in the Restoration, Refinishing & Maintenance
of Fine Heirloom Pianos

Exclusive Dealer For Charles R. Walter Pianos
www.pianoman.ca
Verhnjak Pianos Facebook


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#1252642 - 08/20/09 01:39 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Rod Verhnjak]
apple* Offline


Registered: 01/01/03
Posts: 19862
Loc: Kansas
gosh.. i was going to mow.

the format is excellent.. how the pages zoom and turn.
_________________________
accompanist/organist.. a non-MTNA teacher to a few

love and peace, ├Ľun (apple in Estonian)

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#1252651 - 08/20/09 01:59 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: apple*]
Steve Cohen Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 10483
Loc: Maryland/DC/No. VA
As to the suggestion that pianos were ranked somewhat by price, I can tell you they were not. After the rankings had been determined we looked for the price ranges of those in each group.
_________________________
Piano Industry Consultant- http://www.linkedin.com/pub/steve-cohen/6/b92/b80

Consultant & Contributing Editor - Acoustic & Digital Piano Buyer

Jasons Music
Maryland/DC/No. VA
Since 1937.

www.jasonsmusic.com
My postings, unless stated otherwise, are my personal opinions, not those of my clients.

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#1252656 - 08/20/09 02:10 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Steve Cohen]
Deerwood Dad Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/04/07
Posts: 478
Loc: Minneapolis
Nobody is going to mention the elephant in the room? NY Steinways right there among 11 other brands (ranging in the old version between group 1B to 2B). Sorry, not meaning to start a war -- I for one love Steinways and do not believe them to be overpriced.


Edited by Deerwood Dad (08/20/09 02:55 PM)
_________________________
Mason & Hamlin A (2006); Yamaha P140

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#1252662 - 08/20/09 02:17 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Steve Cohen]
Strings & Wood Offline


Gold member until Dec. 2012


Registered: 05/22/08
Posts: 1838
Loc: USA
Canceled my webstore online order and ordered direct for a $aving. Browsed the online version and it looks great, but I prefer one on the shelf that I can grab whenever.
Hopefully, in the spring we will get a discounted pre-print notification/offer? smile

BTW... loved the website. Very easy to navigate!


Edited by Carl Mc (08/20/09 02:21 PM)
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#1252704 - 08/20/09 03:06 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Strings & Wood]
Akshay Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 08/12/09
Posts: 17
Loc: Netherlands
Beautiful!

I will certainly order it once I am in the market for a grand. We should support
all the work that went into this!

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#1252800 - 08/20/09 05:02 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Akshay]
Norbert Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/03/01
Posts: 14138
Loc: Surrey, B.C.
Quote:
NY Steinways right there among 11 other brands (ranging in the old version between group 1B to 2B). Sorry, not meaning to start a war -- I for one love Steinways and do not believe them to be overpriced.


Funny, I feel exactly same about Estonia.....

Norbert wink
_________________________
www.heritagepianos.com
Greater Vancouver B.C. piano dealers for : C.Sauter, Estonia, Brodmann, Ritmuller
604-951-8642

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#1252842 - 08/20/09 05:57 PM Re: Larry Fine's new book and website are "live". [Re: Norbert]
Steve Cohen Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/26/01
Posts: 10483
Loc: Maryland/DC/No. VA
Originally Posted By: Norbert
Quote:
NY Steinways right there among 11 other brands (ranging in the old version between group 1B to 2B). Sorry, not meaning to start a war -- I for one love Steinways and do not believe them to be overpriced.


Funny, I feel exactly same about Estonia.....

Norbert wink


Now THAT was funny! laugh
_________________________
Piano Industry Consultant- http://www.linkedin.com/pub/steve-cohen/6/b92/b80

Consultant & Contributing Editor - Acoustic & Digital Piano Buyer

Jasons Music
Maryland/DC/No. VA
Since 1937.

www.jasonsmusic.com
My postings, unless stated otherwise, are my personal opinions, not those of my clients.

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