Originally posted by turandot:
Arrrrgh

Fake has posted since he was banned. I hope the banning isn't a voluntary participation thing. [/b]

Originally posted by Ken Knapp:
As most of you know we had a recent incident with a publicly outed sock puppet.

There were many opinions on how the matter should be handled. Some thought that the humiliation was enough punishment, while others thought banning was appropriate.

Well, in order to seek out what was appropriate action, I went to the rules. It was then I discovered that the rules MAKE NO MENTION of sock puppets, nor did I find it stated abywhere "Do this and you will be banned". [/b]

Originally posted by newguyonforum:
...so then why isn't everyone given a fair chance as of the decision? If there was no mention of sock puppets in the rules, it would appear that Pianomadam was playing within those rules at that time, as were a number of other individuals that hadn't been caught.

Although I don't have a personal interest in having Pianomadam nor TFLF stay, it seems that banning them for previous behaviour is punishing them for breaking rules that were not (and still are not) in place.

Does this mean then, that it is open season for exposing the rest of the culprits on here?

Is this action sent as a warning to only to future offenders, or can we/should we hunt around and look for socks in the history and then report them to the mods?

Please understand that I am all for enforcing the rules, but I believe the action taken in this case is not an example of that taking place, but rather a response to some very emotional reactions to an event with a self-serving member.

Also, I think it wise to remember that this forum, since it includes dealers and technicians, will always include advice/opinions/FUD tactics from many more undiscovered, and slightly more crafty Pianomadams. This is one of the reasons Piano World will remain a very dangerous place to those seeking honest and impartial guidance or advice. Not that there isn't some excellent advice given on here, but really, how many new piano buyers can separate the real information from the clever obfuscation? And how many new piano buyers will be influenced by how many positive hits brand x has compared to the negative hits brand y has?


Interesting to see how everything plays out from here... [/b]

Originally posted by Pianomadam:
Goodbye all and best of luck [/b]

Originally posted by Sir Lurksalot:
While the rules don't specifically prohibit socks, they do prohibit self-promotion. IMO, having just re-read the rules, PM was guilty of violating several of them - sublty and indirectly, yes - but perhaps that's even worse.

Regardless of all that, not banning PM would have made a sad statement about the importance of truth, accuracy, and credibility on this forum. [/b]

Originally posted by Piano World:
Stop the Self-Promotion![/b]
It is NOT ACCEPTABLE[/b] for you to create posts thinly disguised as an innocent discussion when in fact they are nothing more than a promotion for your business.

If you make a genuine effort to be honest and helpful, you just may pick up some business because people trust you. That's fine, I have no problem with that. Anything beyond that, see our Professional Advertising options.

Some Guidelines:[/b]

Not Necessarily Self Promotion...[/b]
If a private individual is enthusiastic about a brand and talks about it a lot, it's not self-promotion. (quick side question about this one... I am self-employed as a piano tuner/technician, and an associate member of PTG. (I used to briefly (for a couple weeks or so) work for a local Baldwin dealer before Ric Overton bought them, and around the same time lost my job tuning for a local Steinway/Yamaha dealer due to "conflict of interest".) I happen to like Baldwin Hamilton studio upright pianos, especially older ones like late 1940s to early 1960s, and often post to that effect. Would I fall into the category of this rule, or since I am a technician, have worked for a Baldwin dealer in the past, and happen to currently own two aforementioned pianos, should I be more careful?)

Now for what we do consider self-promotion:[/b]

*snip*
If you're in the business and hide yourself behind an alias[/b] to talk down/up a brand you're self promoting.
*snip*

This is not all encompassing and there can be exceptions to the cases stated above, but this is a general idea on how we view the subject.