I would like openions on Petrof grands vs. Kawai RX. Thanks. Ansley

Welcome to the forum, Ansley. A question like that is a little hard to answer without more detail about the specific models you're interested in comparing. So my reply will be similarly vague: When I was auditioning pianos during my search several years ago, I preferred the RX action (which I thought was absolutely terrific) to the Petrof action (which I found to be much lighter than my liking).

Have you played them? What did you think?

Monica. Thanks for the reply. Yes, I have played both. I really like the light action of the Petrof, but I feel the the Kawai has a more beautiful sound. Ansley

My 2 cents: We are taking delivery of a Petrof III today. We liked the touch and tone much better than the Kawai's but that is very personal. In Larry Fine's book the Petrof is rated as a "good quality performance piano", while Kawai is rated "upper-level consumer grade piano". page 42 and 43 http://www.pianobuyer.com/publication.html

Of course this means little if you like the sound of the Kawai better. We did like the Kawai RX series, but just loved the Petrof. Truth be said we liked the sound of the used Petrof much better than the new, for whatever it's worth.

If it's opinions you're looking for, here's mine.

Tone: Petrof
Touch: Kawai RX

So my opinion is opposite of what you prefer. And we're both right! Imagine that

I liked both, but the Petrof won out due to the great deal the dealer made me on the Petrof.

Thanks to all. I admit that the Kawais in the show room don't sound as good as the Petrof. I have an RX6 which has had a lot of voicing done on it. It has a pretty good sound-perhaps darker and richer than the Petrof. What I really don't like is the heavy touch and the fact that the tenor range dosen't sing. Has anybody else had experience with these two. What I really, really want is a Bechstein. It's the price which is out of my range. Ansley

I've been looking for a piano for a while now - almost a year. I have time and many other priorities and so I am not so much in a rush with the piano.

Every few months I have focused on a different group of pianos, both grands and uprights, first the Japanese (Yamaha and Kawai) and then the Korean (Pramberger) and now I am interested in the Chinese pianos (Hailun and Brodmann) and many others both used and new. Boston has also been one of my favourites too.

I am remaining open minded about any of these brands during my search, always trying to make comparisons.

I love the feel of the action of the Yamahas. These actions must be quite versatile in that some are adjusted somewhat differently and yet always feel comfortable to play for me. I find the sound stronger in the treble. Yes, these are generalizations and each piano may be different and I must stress these are my opinions only - and maybe influenced to some extent from reading pianoworld.com for many months. But honestly, before I take someone's opinion to heart I run the piano through my own playing tests later and feel out the tone myself in comparison to all other pianos I've played.
I personally liked the tone of most of the Kawais I've played better than the Yamahas in my lower price range, but the action, or maybe its the tone generated from the action, seemed more "acoustic" feeling to me on a Kawai. Sometimes I feel I would like to take a Kawai and fit it with a Yamaha action for my perfect piano. Yet the Kawai Millenium 3 action is supposed to be amazing - I need to try this - perhaps I have but I wasn't aware of it? That is the next question I will ask the dealer when I try a Kawai. I am still uncertain about plastic action parts in Kawais, but thats me, maybe I need to rethink this and personally accept this. But thats difficult with me. The trouble is I have an anti-plastic attitude towards all products made from plastic, not just for pianos. Its an environmental concern with me - why use more non-biodegradeable plastic when we have an over abundance of wood especially in applications where wood is already acceptable? Here at least, in BC, Canada we have excess wood. More products need to be made with wood rather than less and I think we are gradually seeing this occur with the environmental movement.

Yamahas seems more digital sounding in their precision. Don't misinterpret my use of digital versus acoustic in my description of action and tone. They are all acoustic pianos but I am using the terms digital versus acoustic as an analogy to describe the feel of the control. Its like the subtle difference some people say they can hear between music from a CD versus a record. Yamahas seem more precise to me and for some musicians, that is a good match. The problem with my comments about Kawai is that I am not sure if I am or am not playing the Millenium 3 action and therefore my comments may not be valid. I am not knowledgeable enough to comment about all Kawai pianos but at this point in time I have moved on to look at other pianos instead because I have yet to find a Kawai that matches my touch - I will remain open minded however.

I'm going to miss a lot of my story out to keep this focused, but at one point I went through a Petrof phase and tried every Petrof I could find used and new over about a 4 month period - I'm currently remaining open minded about Petrof hoping one day I will find one I like - but I am loosing hope about this. They are wonderful pianos, but for me, and this might be because perhaps I need to refine my technique or need to play another 1000 more hours of piano (I'm a classical piano player), I couldn't develop control of tone when playing mid volume on the Petrofs. I especially tried three Petrof IV grands made in either 2008 or 2009 plus many other Petrofs of various sizes. The bass in these grands is fantastic, especially when played with power. I particularly have a strong touch and feel I can connect with the Petrof bass. Recently, I've read Petrofs can be said to have a lighter action - very interesting - I think I can agree to this but need to re-audition them to consider this comment. When played lightly (but still with weight to the bottom of the keys) to achieve a glowing delicate melody, the Petrof responds beautifully and I believe this may be due to the ebony-capped bridge which captures every nuance in the treble. Love the treble. But for me, its the in-between playing, when playing not too loud but not too soft that I can't seem to feel in control. Likely, this is poor piano technique on my part I may admit - but I am not so sure. It could very well be that Petrofs simply aren't a good match for me. I may be a player who prefers a heavier action. So, for what its worth I thought I would share my comments - please remember they may only apply to me, but you asked for opinions and I was happy to share them!

Summary:
my favourite pianos I've played so far:
Steinway (was either an L or an O) (wow!) (beyond my price range however)
Boesendorfer (beyond my price range) (obviously a different experience from a Steinway)
Boston 178? (love this piano and sound)
Hailun (nice)
Brodmann
Steigerman premium upright


Pianos I would like to try but haven't found in my area yet (Metro Vancouver)
Bohemia
Perzina
Ritmuller
Palatino
wendl & lung (likely the same as a Hailun)

Pianos I need to try again:
Brodmann
Baldwin H165C
Fazioli (always need to play one of these to strengthen my piano perception)

Pianos which I have enjoyed playing:
heintzman (new heintzman grands)
Pramberger PS-185
Schimmel


Pianos I likely am considering:
used Samick grand
used Knabe (Wm.? - can't recall)
rebuilt grand


Perhaps you might consider trying some of these pianos as well?

Ansley,

It is not clear to me what type of Petrof grand you want to compare to Kawai.

But as you said you're owning an RX-6 right now, I suppose you are looking at the 7' or longer models?

Also are you talking about the 'old' series or grand, i.e. teh Roman numbered models or the new generation grands like the Passat, Monsoon and Mistral? There should be a significant difference between the two series.

Whatever, there was a time that Petrof was an alternative sounding piano to the mid-price Japanese pianos.
Since Petrof implemented it's new pricing strategy and launched the new generation of grands they are now priced well above a similar sized Kawai or Yamaha.

Would you like the 'old' Roman numbered grand I suppose there are still means in the U.S. of finding heavily discounted Petrofs, either left over stocks from the former distributor GIC or close out sales.

If member Turandot would chime in here he will certainly address the issue of warranty of old GIC stock.

schwammerl.

You can always add weight or take away weight from the keys to adjust how heavy the touch is. Keep that in mind.

I just purchased a Petrof IV used - 5 years old. Its about 6ft. I played and researched and priced just about everything in the market (new and used). Funny I narrowed it down to 3 the RX2, rebuilt Yamaha G2 and the Petrof.

The Petrof's tone is awesome, but as stated, the actions are a little heavy. I have been told by several tecnicians that the actions lighten over time with play (as in 5 plus years), but I was willing to sacrifice the harder action for what I believed was tremendous sound and consistency that rivaled the newer Steinways. I've actually gotten used to the heavier actions after 2 wks of play.

Get what you like, but you should feel great buying a Petrof. I've done the legwork and am very happy with my decision. Had it for 2 weeks now. And by the way, the Petrof cranks out the volume, so if you have a "loud home" with wood floors, hard plaster, etc you may want to invest in some area rugs. I've been shocked at how loud this 6 footer really is. Going to have it tuned and voiced when it settles into my home - may soften it a hair.

For information, this is my first post here. I have been reading this forum for 2 months now, using information to purchase my piano. I appreciate all the opinions and the information you folks provide us. Its a great public service.

I thought the Petrof's action and touch was rather light. I just re-read my post and maybe I was not very clear. I prefer a moderate to heavy action and I never seem to find that in a Petrof. I have a strong touch perhaps and need the resistance from the keys or I feel I loose control. Maybe that is why the Petrof isn't appropriate for me. I have not yet tried the new generation Petrofs (Passat, Monsoon and Mistral) and look forward to playing one to see how they compare.

In reply to Louis: I could have a tech adjust any piano brand (closer) to my liking but I would rather start with a piano that is already close (or exactly suited) to my preference knowing that only small adjustments (or ideally no adjustments at all) would be required.

INtersting perspective. No, the Petrofs I played were heavier to the touch, not lighter. But they were newer. But I neve played any uprights.

But keep in mind that I have been playing a 35 year old Yamaha g2 that had a very light action.

I felt is was a bit heavy, but as I also stated, I've adjusted almost completely.

I do remmeber playing a bechtstein and remembering how light the action was...too light for me.

Thanks for all of the input. I returned to the store today to play Petrofs, Kawais, and Bechsteins. For my taste, the Bechstein wins hands down. I just have to decide whether to spend the money or not. Ansley