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#1315429 - 11/30/09 09:06 PM Keyboard for first timer.
Lhowatt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 13
Loc: Ohio, United States
I am 17 and have wanted for a long time to learn how to play the piano. I really dont know much about them so im asking for your guys advice in helping me purchase one. I have $300 to spend on something to get me started. I know thats not much but thats about all i can commit since i no longer have a job. I really have no idea what brand to get or why.
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#1315436 - 11/30/09 09:17 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: Lhowatt]
signa Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/06/04
Posts: 8482
Loc: Ohio, USA
a new DP will cost at least $400 and up, and therefore $300 would not buy you a new one but a used one. as to new ones, the cheapest and decent starter DP is perhaps Casio PX130, which costs about $500. all other well known brand models (Yamaha, Roland or Kawai), even the entry level models, cost more.

so, unless you can spend more money, you may have to look for some used one, or some previous released models. be sure however, if you want to learn to play PIANO, you want to find something with weighted keys, like on real or acoustic pianos. please ignore anyone who's trying to tell you to just buy a 61-key keyboard with no weighted keys.

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#1315440 - 11/30/09 09:22 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: signa]
AdventCloud Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 25
Im in the same boat youre in. So far Ive been recommended the Casio CDP100 it seems really good has 88 weighted keys it dosent have any features for synth but if your just looking to learn to play then this one seems good. Once I get a few more reviews about it Ill probably buy it...or not who knows but for $350 Im very tempted.

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#1315444 - 11/30/09 09:26 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: AdventCloud]
Lhowatt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 13
Loc: Ohio, United States
Originally Posted By: AdventCloud
Im in the same boat youre in. So far Ive been recommended the Casio CDP100 it seems really good has 88 weighted keys it dosent have any features for synth but if your just looking to learn to play then this one seems good. Once I get a few more reviews about it Ill probably buy it...or not who knows but for $350 Im very tempted.


where have you found it for $350?

Also where would someone suggest i purchase a used keyboard?
_________________________
~T

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#1315446 - 11/30/09 09:27 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: Lhowatt]
AdventCloud Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 25
At Guitar Center

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#1315451 - 11/30/09 09:35 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: signa]
snazzyplayer Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/26/09
Posts: 983
Loc: Earth
As the above post says, it would be best to get a 88 note weighted action instrument.

You won't find anything new for your price range, but a second hand Yamaha P-85 would be one of your best choices.

I have two of them, which I use both as stage pianos and as controllers...they are quite light, more than reasonably well made, and the piano sound is very good.

No auto-accompaniment functions, just a nice smooth actioned piano with graded weighted hammer action (top keys have a lighter response than the lower...like a real piano!) and excellent reliability. Mine have exhibited zero problems, in spite of above average use, and many gigs.

You may also find similar instruments by Casio and maybe Roland....just be sure the keyboard action is weighted like a piano.

Snazzy
_________________________
Semper Gumby: Always flexible \:^)

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#1315499 - 11/30/09 10:28 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: AdventCloud]
ChrisA Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 3841
Loc: Redondo Beach, California
Originally Posted By: AdventCloud
. Once I get a few more reviews about it Ill probably buy it...or not who knows but for $350 Im very tempted.


Today at Guitar Center it's $299 They are running a $50 off coupon on their web site. They will allow you to return it up until Jan 2010 if you don't like it. Just be sure to keep the box and packing



Edited by ChrisA (11/30/09 10:34 PM)

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#1315500 - 11/30/09 10:28 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: snazzyplayer]
Lhowatt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 13
Loc: Ohio, United States
I am considering the CDP100 it seems to be a good buy and a good starter.

@ChrisA: I do not see casio on the listed brands.


Edited by Lhowatt (11/30/09 10:34 PM)

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#1315512 - 11/30/09 10:40 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: Lhowatt]
ChrisA Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 3841
Loc: Redondo Beach, California
Originally Posted By: Lhowatt
I am considering the CDP100 it seems to be a good buy and a good starter.

@ChrisA: I do not see casio on the listed brands.


OK so I read from their web site... December 6th

It looks like you might get your best deal if you go to the retail store in person. I saw a $299 price tag, no coupon required. Call them up and ask them. I don't work there I was just there for a half day last Saturday trying out pianos.

They are also offering 12 month no interest, no payment financing. They seem to have a lay away plan too where 10% deposit holds it.
All this is on their web site, you can read it there under "We make it easy"
http://www.guitarcenter.com/


Edited by ChrisA (11/30/09 10:51 PM)

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#1315532 - 11/30/09 11:04 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: ChrisA]
Lhowatt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 13
Loc: Ohio, United States
_________________________
~T

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#1315545 - 11/30/09 11:15 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: Lhowatt]
snazzyplayer Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/26/09
Posts: 983
Loc: Earth
Lhowatt,

Although this instrument has a nice sound, the keyboard's Graded Soft Touch is not the same as weighted hammer action.

You may not build the same finger strength on the DGX-230, as you would on a P-85 or other graded weighted hammer action.

Moving from practicing on this instrument to an acoustic piano would not be easy.

Snazzy
_________________________
Semper Gumby: Always flexible \:^)

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#1315549 - 11/30/09 11:18 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: snazzyplayer]
Lhowatt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 13
Loc: Ohio, United States
What do you guys think of the CDP-100?
_________________________
~T

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#1315682 - 12/01/09 08:08 AM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: Lhowatt]
snazzyplayer Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/26/09
Posts: 983
Loc: Earth
The CDP-100:

The main piano sounds suffers from poor middle...top and bottom are good.

The second piano isn't very good.

The electric piano is good.

The strings and harpsichord sounds are good...the strings sound at their best when layered with piano.

The weighted action is pretty good, and feels okay for a budget piano.

If you can live with the main piano sound, which is your biggest concern, and the action appeals to you, it will make a good first piano for you.

I still recommend a second hand Yamaha P-85.

These are personal opinions.

Snazzy



_________________________
Semper Gumby: Always flexible \:^)

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#1315746 - 12/01/09 10:19 AM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: snazzyplayer]
AdventCloud Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 25
The P-85 is nearly double the price though, So I guess its whats in your price range. So far the CDP-100 seems like the best choice for the price and reason of just wanting a basic piano to learn on. Any other ideas?

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#1315793 - 12/01/09 11:14 AM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: AdventCloud]
snazzyplayer Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/26/09
Posts: 983
Loc: Earth
A poor sounding instrument, that feels bad to your fingers, that you got on the cheap and saved yourself a few bucks...is not a bargain.

You will play it far less often than a more suitable instrument.

There is nothing more disheartening, after a few days with your bargain baby, than thinking the words..."I should have waited and got the [insert brand name and model here]"

It might mean the difference between sticking with learning the piano and giving up, because you've made a wrong choice that may not be easily rectified (especially financially), and you can't possibly enjoy playing the instrument.

I knew a guy who owned a keyboard he hated so much, he didn't want to sell it because he didn't want to meet the person who would buy such a thing. wink

Don't rush into buying...listen to the ones who have made the mistake of impulsive buying (me, for one) and learn from them.

Snazzy


_________________________
Semper Gumby: Always flexible \:^)

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#1315851 - 12/01/09 12:15 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: Lhowatt]
FormerFF Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/26/08
Posts: 476
Loc: Roswell, GA, USA
Originally Posted By: Lhowatt


Yamaha does make a couple of keyboards with weighted actions, in the U. S. the YPG-635 is the most commonly seen. If you're attracted to the keyboard sounds and functions, that might be a good choice, but it is considerably more money than you are currently looking at spending.
_________________________
Piano self teaching on and off from 2002-2008. Took piano instruction from Nov 2008- Feb 2011. Took guitar instruction Feb 2011-Jul 2013. Can't play either. Living, breathing proof some people aren't cut out to make music.

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#1315862 - 12/01/09 12:29 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: snazzyplayer]
AdventCloud Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 25
Originally Posted By: snazzyplayer
A poor sounding instrument, that feels bad to your fingers, that you got on the cheap and saved yourself a few bucks...is not a bargain.

You will play it far less often than a more suitable instrument.

There is nothing more disheartening, after a few days with your bargain baby, than thinking the words..."I should have waited and got the [insert brand name and model here]"

It might mean the difference between sticking with learning the piano and giving up, because you've made a wrong choice that may not be easily rectified (especially financially), and you can't possibly enjoy playing the instrument.

I knew a guy who owned a keyboard he hated so much, he didn't want to sell it because he didn't want to meet the person who would buy such a thing. wink

Don't rush into buying...listen to the ones who have made the mistake of impulsive buying (me, for one) and learn from them.

Snazzy




Are you talking about the CDP-100 here? Im just interested in learning a few songs and the basics of a piano. Ill probably go nonstop for a month and see if I learn alot and if the piano is for me and if I dont like it ill return it before 30 days. I cant afford much else and so far the CDP-100 has gotten alot of good reviews and Ive watched some videos of songs being played on it and it sounds decent.

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#1315875 - 12/01/09 12:46 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: AdventCloud]
snazzyplayer Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/26/09
Posts: 983
Loc: Earth
I'm talking about any poor sounding instrument, that feels bad to your fingers...not necessarily the CDP-100.

You have to decide if it's worth a short term investment...are you able to spend some time with it?

Snazzy
_________________________
Semper Gumby: Always flexible \:^)

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#1315876 - 12/01/09 12:46 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: Lhowatt]
Gyro Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 04/24/05
Posts: 4533
If cost is a major issue right
now, I would recommend an
inexpensive, 61-key portable
keyboard. These can be
had for $150 or less. When
you get one, make sure it comes
with the factory AC adaptor
included in the box, because
some don't come with one, and
finding an adaptor can be almost
impossible. If you buy it
in a store, and they try to
throw in an aftermarket adaptor,
make them open everything up
right there and prove the
adaptor fits, because chances
are it won't.

People sneer at these, but
they are serious, sophisticated
instruments in their own right,
real pianos, in a sense. The
clunky piano J. S. Bach used had
only 49 keys and nothing like
the grand piano voice of
a modern 61-key portable.
It is no uncommon for students
to take several yrs. of classical
lessons using a 61-key portable
to practice on. They have
little trouble adapting to
the acoustic piano in the
teacher's studio.

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#1316153 - 12/01/09 06:33 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: Gyro]
Lhowatt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 13
Loc: Ohio, United States
So as someone who has a tight budget and is not so sure about playing the piano a cheaper 61 key keyboard would be a good idea? I plan on buying an acoustic piano in the far future if i turn out to be very interested in playing. How hard would the transition be from non weighted to weighted keys? Are there any 61 key keyboards with weighted keys?
_________________________
~T

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#1316167 - 12/01/09 06:47 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: Lhowatt]
LesCharles73 Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/24/07
Posts: 739
Loc: Denton Texas
Originally Posted By: Lhowatt
So as someone who has a tight budget and is not so sure about playing the piano a cheaper 61 key keyboard would be a good idea? I plan on buying an acoustic piano in the far future if i turn out to be very interested in playing. How hard would the transition be from non weighted to weighted keys? Are there any 61 key keyboards with weighted keys?


I wouldn't say it's a "good idea". I mean you gotta do what you gotta do, but as I've heard others say, "If you want to master the clarinet, don't buy a kazoo". There are no 61 key 'boards with weighted keyboards to my knowledge. There are very few 76 key's out there with even semi-weighted actions.

Right now you can get a Casio CDP-100 for around $299. Not a perfect piano, but leaps and bounds above anything unweighted.

The unweighted - weighted transition isn't as hard as you might think, but at first you will think it is too much work. Then you will wonder how you ever lived without it. The thing I'm afraid of, is if you start on an unweighted board, you are unlikely to get as much enjoyment out of playing and then you will give up. When you play an unweighted keyboard you are missing out on at least 50% of the essence of playing a piano, so don't let the 'feel' of it sway your decision as to whether or not you want to continue.


Edited by LesCharles73 (12/01/09 06:50 PM)
_________________________
Les C Deal





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#1316169 - 12/01/09 06:50 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: LesCharles73]
Lhowatt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 13
Loc: Ohio, United States
Alright it looks like the casio CDP-100 is my best choice.


~Thanks guys laugh
_________________________
~T

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#1316172 - 12/01/09 06:58 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: Lhowatt]
snazzyplayer Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/26/09
Posts: 983
Loc: Earth
You could start with a 61 unweighted velocity sensitive keyboard, but it would take a bit of time to retrain your fingers to weighted keys.

Sort of like going from a car with power steering to one without, or from an electric guitar to an acoustic.

You could learn the very basics on a 61 note instrument, and there are 61 note touch sensitive pianos available second hand, made by Yamaha and Roland, but just about any 61 note with velocity will do, so you could include some arranger keyboards as well...the latter are fairly plentiful.

I would encourage you to switch to weighted keys as soon as possible, once you've determined your direction.

Snazzy
_________________________
Semper Gumby: Always flexible \:^)

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#1316177 - 12/01/09 07:05 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: Lhowatt]
ChrisA Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 3841
Loc: Redondo Beach, California
Originally Posted By: Lhowatt
So as someone who has a tight budget and is not so sure about playing the piano a cheaper 61 key keyboard would be a good idea? I plan on buying an acoustic piano in the far future if i turn out to be very interested in playing. How hard would the transition be from non weighted to weighted keys? Are there any 61 key keyboards with weighted keys?


I've been playing on an unweighted keyboard, A quality one (It sold new or $1,600) but still an unweighted one. You can learn a lot on one. but you can't learn to control dynamics so well. But really if you are a beginner you can lean for months and months on a cheap keyboard. But at some point you will want to upgrade.

The big thing is to stop stalling and get started. Everything else is "just details" compared the starting.

There is actually an advantage to buying something cheap to start. because later when you do buy the more expensive DP you will know enough to make in informed decision. You will have had the experiance of playing a teacher's piano. Buy it now and you are depending on luck and guesses and the advice from people like me (which is worth maybe only what you are paying for it.)

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#1316184 - 12/01/09 07:17 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: ChrisA]
Lhowatt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 11/30/09
Posts: 13
Loc: Ohio, United States
Originally Posted By: ChrisA
Originally Posted By: Lhowatt
So as someone who has a tight budget and is not so sure about playing the piano a cheaper 61 key keyboard would be a good idea? I plan on buying an acoustic piano in the far future if i turn out to be very interested in playing. How hard would the transition be from non weighted to weighted keys? Are there any 61 key keyboards with weighted keys?


I've been playing on an unweighted keyboard, A quality one (It sold new or $1,600) but still an unweighted one. You can learn a lot on one. but you can't learn to control dynamics so well. But really if you are a beginner you can lean for months and months on a cheap keyboard. But at some point you will want to upgrade.

The big thing is to stop stalling and get started. Everything else is "just details" compared the starting.

There is actually an advantage to buying something cheap to start. because later when you do buy the more expensive DP you will know enough to make in informed decision. You will have had the experiance of playing a teacher's piano. Buy it now and you are depending on luck and guesses and the advice from people like me (which is worth maybe only what you are paying for it.)




You make some good points.

Does anyone recommend a certain unweighted keyboard for a beginner?
_________________________
~T

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#1316196 - 12/01/09 07:38 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: Lhowatt]
snazzyplayer Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/26/09
Posts: 983
Loc: Earth
Yamaha PSR-E413

Yamaha PSR-E223

Casio CTK-2100

Casio CTK-4000

Casio CTK-3000

Casio CTK-5000
_________________________
Semper Gumby: Always flexible \:^)

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#1316204 - 12/01/09 07:54 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: snazzyplayer]
DragonPianoPlayer Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/12/06
Posts: 2368
Loc: Denver, CO
Lhowatt,

I'm torn what I should advise.

A Casio CDP100 will probably be a good piano for you for several years.

The keyboards snazzyplayer are suggesting will start you out learning to play very well, albeit without as much control as you would have from a weighted digital piano.

If you are interested in more popular styles, this may work just fine for you for a long time, a lot of popular piano players only play keyboards.

If you are interested in classical music, then you really want the weighted keys.

No matter what you decide, I think it is important to just get started.

Rich
_________________________

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#1316205 - 12/01/09 07:56 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: Lhowatt]
ChrisA Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 3841
Loc: Redondo Beach, California

[/quote]

You make some good points.

Does anyone recommend a certain unweighted keyboard for a beginner? [/quote]

If the CDP is to much money, then seriously, just look on Crieg's List and buy whatever someone is selling for for $50 or less. Guitar Center and even Best Buy has new 61 key keyboards for under $100. At the under $100 price point you will get a keyboard that works and you can learn all the beginner material. Then sell it in four months for 1/2 what you paid and you are out $50 max.

Buy a book too while you are there.

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#1316254 - 12/01/09 09:12 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: Lhowatt]
FormerFF Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/26/08
Posts: 476
Loc: Roswell, GA, USA
Originally Posted By: Lhowatt
So as someone who has a tight budget and is not so sure about playing the piano a cheaper 61 key keyboard would be a good idea? I plan on buying an acoustic piano in the far future if i turn out to be very interested in playing. How hard would the transition be from non weighted to weighted keys? Are there any 61 key keyboards with weighted keys?


I started on one. The transition for me was a couple of months, but I'm not very talented and don't get a lot of practice time. You can find a touch sensitive keyboard for $150 new. There are a ton of them on Craigslist, you should be able to get one complete with a stand and a bench for less than $100. If you just want to dip your toe into the water, it's fine for that. Just make sure that the one you get is touch sensitive, so you can get learn dynamics. I have an old Yamaha PSR-280, and still sometimes use it when I'm learning a new song. We have some kind of crummy DPs at the studio where I take lessons, and I swear that the PSR's touch sensitivity is more useful than is the Williams DP's is.
_________________________
Piano self teaching on and off from 2002-2008. Took piano instruction from Nov 2008- Feb 2011. Took guitar instruction Feb 2011-Jul 2013. Can't play either. Living, breathing proof some people aren't cut out to make music.

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#1316287 - 12/01/09 09:53 PM Re: Keyboard for first timer. [Re: FormerFF]
snazzyplayer Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/26/09
Posts: 983
Loc: Earth
Originally Posted By: FormerFF
[quote=Lhowatt] We have some kind of crummy DPs at the studio where I take lessons, and I swear that the PSR's touch sensitivity is more useful than is the Williams DP's is.


Ahhhhh, so we have someone else besides Gyro who is familiar with the Williams. My good buddy, Zeke, is tracking down one at a music store and we're going to test it out, but in the mean time, perhaps Mr. FormerFF can elaborate on this instrument.

Why did you not like the William's action?

What about the sound...the piano okay?

Alternate sounds okay?

Considering the instrument in question costs about $700, do you consider it a good beginner piano to use for several months until you trade it in on something, shall we say, better?

A short review, Mr.FormerFF, if you please, if it is not too much trouble?

Snazzy
_________________________
Semper Gumby: Always flexible \:^)

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