Hi all,
I'm Poon from Singapore and am new to this forum.
I've completed my grade 8 syllabus 10 years ago, but sadly have lost touch with piano since then. Recently, I am thinking of picking up piano again and start shopping around for pianos in Singapore.
I came to know about Hailun piano through a local dealer, Piano Master. He recommended a Hailun model for me:

Model: Hailun H-33P
Height: 133cm
Price: SGD 5600

I am totally new to the name of Hailun and I can't really get information from internet about this model. Anyone who has any experience with Hailun, especially this model, please feel free to leave your comments here.

Your help is much appreciated. Thanks.

Hi all,

It seems that H-33P is a new model from Hailun, which is not yet commonly sold.

To be honest, I am inexperienced in assessing pianos.

I have tried on H-33P twice on two different days, and I must admit I'm attracted to this piano. Generally, I am comfortable with the sound as a I prefer a melow one. I would not say that this is the best sounding piano, but with my budget of about SGD5-6k, this is a piano that I am contemplating to get one.

In terms of tone quality (putting budget aside), I tried to compare Hailun H-33P to Yamaha YUS5 (which costs about 14k). But I think the tone of Yamaha YUS5 belongs to the brighter side, as compared to Hailun H-33p which is more melow. To me, the bass for H-33P sounds a bit muffle and the treble is not bright enough. The dealer said that as time goes by, the treble may sound brighter (not sure how true is this). As for YUS5, I find it hard to express the dynamic range that I want. I have difficulties playing a powerful loud sound (not sure if it's because of the carpeted environment).

In terms of touch, I do not know if it's psychologic, I prefer the responsiveness of Yamaha. I find the the keys of Hailun are heavier. But I must admit, I have been playing Yamaha and Yamaha only since I was young, so maybe my fingers have been "yamahanized". haha...

Another thing that I am concerned of is the long-term quality of Hailun. I know we need to look at Chinese-made piano at a total different perspective from last time, but since Hailun is still considered new in this industry, I guess it is hard to evaluate the durability of the piano.

I think I'll go down to try Hailun again. Feel free to let me know if there are other things that I need to take note of when assessing a piano.

Thanks!

Hello Poon.

You guessed right. Unless this piano has a different model designation in the US, I don't think it's sold here. You could probably get more help on this thread. The regular contributors are all from Singapore and many are quite familiar with Hailun.

http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/1388906/

This must be the soon to be launched in the U.S. 52" HU-6, belonging to their new range op 'professional uprights' presented at the NAMM 2010, the HU-6 being designed by George Emmerson; from the Hailun US website (news section):



schwammerl.

Hi all,

Thanks for all your reply. I'll look into Hailun more.

The fact is that: I can't wait to get a piano! haha... i think i need to work harder now.

Hi Schwammerl,

Thanks for the info on HU-6. I doubt that HU-6 and H-33P are the same as H-33P does not come with a sostenuto pedal. The centre pedal is still muting pedal.

The H-33P is new. I liked the Hailun for its price. But also do try others - say Albert Webers and Kayserburg @ Cristofori, Wilhelm Tell @ Gramercy.

If you can pay a bit more the W Hoffmans and Bohemias are quite nice too.

As for what to try, ideally:-

a. Play chords, with and without pedals, to have a sense of the tone and how long notes linger and blend, at various ranges of the keyboard
b. Scales and arpeggios up and down the keyboard, with and without pedal, at different volumes, especially softly! Check also for consistency of tone throughout.
c. A fast trill to test repetition.

If you can, do play also passages from:

d. A classical work, e.g. Mozart for clarity. Variations on Twinkle Twinkle little star is good enough hehe.
e. A romantic work, e.g. Chopin.
f. A fugue, to hear how difficult it is to voice different notes.

Hi fj_s,

Thanks for your reply.

I realise most of the upright pianos sold are in the 120-125cm range. Am I having a misconception of thinking that a taller piano sounds better? I mean of course we have to take the actions etc. into consideration. But somehow I prefer a taller piano (at least 129cm).

Oh I left out the Perzinas at Singapore Shopping Centre, which are within your budget.

It's not always true that a taller piano sounds better, though they will in likelihood have a better bass. They will also tend to be more powerful and louder. But the scale design makes a bigger difference. The technical people on this forum will know much better.

I am in a similar situation, after having picked up again last year after stopping for 11 years.

Do you stay in an apartment, which is why you are looking for an upright? Otherwise, why not consider a small baby grand? Weaker bass, but the action makes up for it, and it is no louder than an upright (often softer, particularly for a baby grand.), and somehow I tend to like the sound more at the treble.

Hi fj_s,

These info are really useful to me. Ya, I have space constraint. I think i'll go down and look at the few pianos that you mentioned.

So how was your piano picking up going? Are you doing self-learning?

Yes I am just playing for fun on my own. Progress is not so good as I don't have a teacher.

While I don't have problems learning the notes, I don't think I have the discipline to polish a piece to any degree at this juncture, given my relative lack of musical knowledge and busy schedule. (Indeed, that was mostly what my teacher was for in the past.) Thus, tone, polish and interpretation is terrible.

I think it would be very difficult to get back to the same standard I was at 11 years ago. I simply cannot devote as much time to practice.

That being said, do not be discouraged. I have found it possible to get back to 80% with relatively little effort. In other words, you can get pieces that are around 80% of the max difficulty you could handle in the past polished, or you could get pieces of the max difficulty you could handle in the past 80% ready. Beyond that, you may need a teacher to get back on track, coupled with more hours of practice.

But since I'm never going to become a professional anyway, it's probably not worth hiring a teacher until I have the enough $$$ to spare. Further, the quality of most teachers in Singapore is suspect (a good chunk play worse than I do), and I have lost touch with my previous teacher since I was overseas for half of those 11 years.

As an aside, I currently have a rather bright piano with relatively little dynamic range, the downsides of which I become very aware of once I tried other pianos, especially high end grands. Hopefully the new U3-silent that I bought will help somewhat.

One final word of advice - buy the piano you like the most. It lasts for a long time, and you are old enough to know whether you will like something for the long haul.

Hi all,

I have shorlisted two pianos after looking around for a few more piano shops.

Model: Hailun H-33P
Height: 133cm
Price: SGD 5600

Model: Gebr Perzina GP-129
Height: 129cm
Price: SGD 7300

GP-129 has a strong and growling bass, and the treble belongs to the brighter side. Generally, I think this piano sings. Based on my first impression, I prefer GP-129 than Hailun H-33P. But, the price is a bit out of my budget, which is below SGD 6000.

Anyway, I'll try out these two pianos again. Will keep you updated with my decision.

p/s: thanks fj_s for your recommendation on the piano shops.

By the way, I'm also wondering the big difference in warranty between the two pianos I have shortlisted. Hailun offers 10 years, while Perzina offers 5 years of warranty.

And also, how does purchasing a piano work? I mean do we purchase the exact piano that we play in the showroom? Or do we just place an order and the dealer would send us a new piano from the warehouse of the same model?

Cheers.

Poon,

The standard recommended practice for purchasing a piano is having that pzrticular (wright down serial number and get it written down on your order sheet) piano deliverd that you liked at the showroom as no two pianos of the same model/brand are identical. Also you are entitled to expect the dealer preps the piano before delivery. Should you get him order a different one and deliver to your home that might not happen.

As to the difference in warranties this is often meaningless and has more marketing value than real value. It highly depends on what the warranty does cover and what it does not; those issues that are due to the use of the instrument are not covered anyhow, like e.g. if the hammers are worn after 8 years this will not be covered by a 10 years warranty formula. Those things that are covered (parts & labour) like soundboard or plate seldomly go broke neither after 5 nor after 10 years and even then you will have to make sure you could prove the piano was well maintened during these years and that e.g. a crack in the soundboard was not due to a lack of care for humidity situations.

schwammerl.

Hi Schwammerl,

What kind of preps are we expecting from the dealer? Some of them told me they'll clean the internal parts of the piano before delivery (basically just like what they display in the showroom) and thats' all they do. Tuning comes in later.

Poon

Hello Poon,

Below is just an example od dealer prepping of a new piano from another forum, written (2nd post) by Chris Venables (also a member here):

dealer prepping of new piano

Even if tuning comes last any piano will benefit form multiple tunings at the dealer before delivery as to get it as stable as possible for a new instrument.

schwammerl.

Hi Schwammerl,
Just wondering, what happens if the piano has been displayed for a long time?

Hi Poon,

It depends on what you mean by a LONG time.

If it is sitting in the showroom of a reputable dealer it can onwly grow better: should be played regularly but mostly lighly in the showroom (supposed it is never rented for concerts) and thus regularly tuned and kept in the best possible shape; the end-result would be the piano 'matured' well and is settled in.

schwammerl.

Hi Poon
Schwammerrel gave you excellent advice and information.

The US warranty is ten years for the Gebr. Perzina. The distributors elsewhere are independent and they set their terms as they see fit. I'm not familiar with your distributor but I would ask them to match the US warranty. My understanding is that they are built exactly the same for all distributors, so I would be confident that they would be able to meet the same warranty if you will ask. Good luck!
Regards
Mike

Hi all,

I understand from the Hailun dealer that I'll be getting a new piano instead of the one I play at the showroom if I were to purchase the piano. He mentioned that the quality of Hailun is pretty consistent, about 90%. I'm not sure what kind of risks I'm facing, but this seems to be the way this dealer works. He mentioned that he'll check the piano before delivery.

I think our local Yamaha works this way as well. Of course, there are some other dealers who sell the particular piano at the showroom directly to the buyer, like what Schwammerl mentioned.

Poon

Actually in Singapore, they usually give a small discount for the showroom piano.

So you could try that.

Poon it's not just a matter of is it a "new" piano. You want to make sure that the piano you play and hear and like is the piano delivered, not a different one out of a box. Every piano sounds different. They are an instrument not a piece of furniture. You may play a Steinway that is fabulous and have the same model but different Steinway delivered and you hate it because it doesn't have the sound and feel of the one you played. Do you like the way the Hailun plays and sounds better than the Perzina? Or do you like the way the Perzina sounds and plays better? Which ever you like better than look at the warrenty and make sure you get the piano you played.

Poon
She gave good advice.
Regards
Mike

Hi all,

Thanks for your valuable advice. I'll try to talk to the dealer again and see how we can sort things out.

Cheers,
Poon

Poon,
have you bought the Gebr Perzina GP-129?