The following was posted in a recent Topic:

”Tuning stability is what really separates the Tooners from the Tuners!”

This got me to thinking about how the designation of “Tooner” is used, and what it may say about the person that uses it.

No need to post your answer if you do not care to, but I will post one that I am not even sure is what I really want to say on the matter.

A Tooner is someone that looks down on a customer. I think this is the prerequisite for doing poor work, or for even “protecting the customer from themselves” instead of giving full disclosure and letting the customer make their own decision. The results can run the spectrum from not tuning the top octave very well, if at all, because the customer only plays hymns, anyway; to selling an expensive, exacting regulation on a piano that the customer only plays hymns on, anyway.

Any others?

Hi Jeff,

I assume it just means incompetent.

Though I admit I'm not 100% sure as to the current definition, I'm pretty sure as to the derivation:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7GoppI0iV0

OK, Joe:

Leaving aside whether someone actually performs their duties competently, where would YOU draw the competence line between tuner and tooner?

I guess you're right Jeff...
There's more to it.

Maybe it's question of style?


Maybe a tooner is an incompetent in a grandiose, completely self-assured way.... A sort of "Inspector Clouseau" of piano tuners.

"That was a priceless Steinway!"
"Not anymore."

Joe:

I Love it! So then, a tooner is someone that knows that they are not a tooner?

"So then, a tooner is someone that knows that they are not a tooner?"


Maybe. We need to hear from folks that use the term.

"We need to hear from folks that use the term."

Ah, the wisdom of Solomon! Very good.

I have a gift for stating the obvious.

I love those movies! But, I would never hire a tooner teknishun who said something like that.

"I thought you said your dog does not bite!"

"That is not my dog."

Love that one!

"Do you have a vroom?"

"I don't know what a 'vroom' is."

*Looks hurriedly through dictionary*

"Zimmer"

"Oh, a room!"

"But, that was a priceless Steinway!"
"Not anymore."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ek44tW0Dqig


"Do you have a vroom?"
"Does your dog bite?"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXn2QVipK2o


Enjoy!

Since we are a bit OT anyway,

When my wife and I where newlyweds she once asked me at the dinner table, “Did you say vroom?” I told her I didn’t know. What did I say? Then she repeated herself, “Did you say vroom?” Deciding there was something she wanted from me that I did not understand I said, “OK. Vroom! Vroom! Vroom!” When she stopped laughing she said, “I made desert. Did you save room for it?” Just wait until we are both old and hard of hearing. It should be a riot.

Haha Jeff, good times ahead!

I think a "tooner" is someone who, when done with their tuning, did not give the customer their money's worth, either in the tuning quality or stability, or both. I suppose the term has also been used to refer to a tech that can tune so-so but really should not be messing with anything else on the piano because they lack the proper training, skill set or aptitude to do so properly.

A tuner is someone who spells "tuner" funny.

Actually, I don't use the term, so I'll leave the definition to others. Using a less than complimentary name for anybody is something that (although I probably fall short in this) I really try not to engage in.

That goes for clients too...I speak of all of mine respectfully...I think as professionals we're supposed to elevate the profession, so calling other techs, clients, or professionals something akin to a "hack" is just unwise, IMHO.

(no diss intended to those here who use the word "tooner" by way of humor or joke, btw)

RPD

Too funny, too funny!!!!

I was having similar thoughts last night. "Tooner" is used like the "N-word" by some and says more about the person using it than the person it is directed toward. And also like the "N-word", it can be used in humorous or familiar ways with no offense implied or taken.

Jeff and RPD, I've always felt the exact same way about it as you just described. I don't use the word either.

Darn, I doubt if anyone that does use the term will give their definition of it now! But imagine the reaction if someone said, “Anyone that uses an ETD is a Tooner.”

Comparing "Tooner" to the N word?? Are you guys out of your minds?

There's a famous Tooner in the Seattle area. One of his hallmarks is to spray the plate of grand pianos with gold spray paint. It gets all over the strings and even on the hammers (maybe its to achieve that sought after "Golden Tone". He installs hammers on grands right out of the box with no regard to geometry or weight so the pianos play like an old pickkup. He offers to buy back the pianos if people aren't happy (I saw one of these "Warranties" it was scrawled on what appeared to be a piece of scrap paper.) One lady I knew who bought a "restored" Baldwin R pestered him for a year and never got her money. He will put universal bass strings in pianos and not trim them so the winding goes right over the bridge. etc, etc...

Tooner is a hilarious word. When I said earlier that tuning stability separates the Tooners from the Tuners, it simply means if you can't tune a reasonable stable piano your not a real tuner.

I'm sure other fields like plumbing have their own terms for poorly trained non-professionals who try to pawn themselves off on the public as the real deal. There are also incompetents who may mean well but leave a swath of destruction and mayhem behind them.

LOL!!! Thanks for posting that.

0:49 and 4:57 will be of special interest to tooners in training.
But the whole thing is a riot.

Ryan:

Of course the word “Tooner” can be used in the same way as the N-word. The words “Lawyer”, “Politician” and “Arab” have been used in the same way as the N-word, why not “Tooner.” I have seen it used in what I believe to be that way right here on this Forum.

But let’s look at how YOU are using it, and please correct me if I read you wrong:

A Tooner:

1. Does not stand by his work.
2. Can't tune a reasonably stable piano.
3. May mean well but leaves a swath of destruction and mayhem behind.

OK, number one is pretty clear. Number two is pretty vague, could you be more specific, like how far can unisons drift in a certain length of time? Number three I take it means that more harm than good is done.

Rysowers wrote:

"...He will put universal bass strings in pianos and not trim them so the winding goes right over the bridge..."

You have got to be kidding Ryan, if not, there has got to be a term more descriptive of this than "tooner". How does a tooner like this still stay in business?

Put me in the "use of that word is counterproductive" catagory.

But, I think Jeff got pretty close in the OP. While it may be interesting to talk about what a "tooner" does, it's even more interesting to consider WHY. And that has to come down to not having enough respect for the client, or him/herself, to advance in knowledge and proficiency of the job.

And THAT, in ANY business, is shameful.

The tuner that tune pianos all day long without any care for their future.

Not even the most basic maintenance, as tightening action screws, or keeping the parts at their original place.

Tune the darn thing as long as he can tune a little.

Never say a word on care, dont have the tools to regulate, and dont allow other technicians to approach the instrument, letting the customer believe that everything is in order.
When the customer say something look unusual (as key board unresponsive) that is because this model of piano is like this, and nothing can be done about it.

Sometime he even did not notice himself the poor condition of the piano.

The Tooner is 50% responsive for the highly damaged condition of most second hand pianos.

Some tooners provide reasonable tunings, (even if pitched too low ) but most have no idea on what is a good sounding/working piano, that is then comfortable to them to produce their 6-7 tunings a day and earn good money while providing half of the service to their customers.

They also have a lot of funny stories to tell so to avoid the real technical aspects of the work !

Probably have no much respect for the customer, but they like to be considered as knowing a secret and artistic trade !

I am ill from laughing too much viewing the videos ... thanks for sharing those on that relatively sad subject thread.

4.10 shows where Lady Gaga got her idea :-)

Maybe defining "Tooner" is like defining pornography. You know it when you see it. (Uh, hand that magazine back to me. I haven’t quite decided if the girl on page 5 is “art” or not. This may take a while.)

This particular guy has been in business for around 30 years or more! I think being in a large metropolitan area creates a new crop of unwary clients on a regular basis.

He's also a super nice guy! He comes across as a genuinely sweet, good-hearted individual whose mission in life is to "rescue" these old pianos. His song and dance can be pretty convincing if you don't know better!

I visited his shop several years ago - a hall of horrors!

I don't know if he's a con-artist, or just completely off his rocker capstan!

Hmmm, maybe what his customers are buying is the feeling that they are adopting abandoned works of art. But since he does not honor his return policy I cannot believe that he is sincere.