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First takes are best. This is not the thread for finished products...

Sick! Here's another mind boggling version:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=3W_bRtc75GA

No way I"m tackling GS, have fun guys!

Sissy!

Argh you've gotten me to compulsively play along with this track now, not sure I even like this tune.=p

No. I don't use playalongs...(you've just proved to me why).

Everybody should be able to play this. The question is just what tempo.

This was just a snippet of a practice session. This is what I sound like -- sped up

For some reason, the Yammie P-155 converted the recording to some unbelievable speed here (sounds like 300 at least). I actually recorded at 200. So the notes are me but the speed isn't. So now I won't be intimidated by all of your fast fingers...LOL.

Giant Steps Superspeed
http://www.box.net/shared/6rxavp1vss

Next time I post it will be super slow.

Interesting, it shows how your lines would be if your fingers and brain worked faster, and they would be pretty interesting.
I have often thought that the great players are just like the rest of us but their brains just run faster.

jazzwee I like the flow of your lines, sounds organic, which I think is tough with this tune due to the stressing harmonic rythm, especially at a fast tempo.

Hey JW,

I listened to your snippet. I thought it was really nice. Especially the 1st half. The lines were long and melodic, the way I like them.

http://www.divshare.com/download/11557528-d23 Aaalmost there, you may find a few repeated ideas in there, lol. It's two merged tracks that both turned out pretty decent.

Hey KK, well done with your Giant steps. You are making the changes there and with some good lines. Very fluent as well at that fast tempo.

Klink, your technique at that tempo is amazing. You are still maintaining incredible legato. Even when I recorded at 200, I was already losing control technically.

You certainly made the changes and I liked your lines. Yeah you repeated. So what? LOL! Coltrane repeated too.

That tempo is beyond me so I can just admire the rest of you that can play that fast (and even more incredible -- to maintain ideas at that tempo).

Thanks for the comments guys.

I asked my teacher a question on playing at really fast tempos and the answer he gave was pretty much what Beeboss noted.



He did a little solo at some slower tempo, to give me a feel of what it sounds like. Then he played it at 300 or so and demonstrated that he's playing the same kind of lines. His point is that he can just think of the notes faster and that at no time was he resorting to patterns or licks or memory.

So the point of the lesson was to demonstrate to me that I have to do the same thing and practice the same way and that it would work out.

Out of curiousity, I actually tried matching the speed of the sped-up recording to see if my brain could handle it. It looks like it can since I can keep up in bursts. The flaw seems to be technique related. I could probably do 250 but with an uneven touch. It's something I can specifically work on and it's a discussion like this that reveals my weaknesses.

I'm just enjoying this interaction guys!

I think I know what you mean but any combination of notes is a pattern, every chord shape and every melodic fragment. Memory operates at many levels, and there are all manner of things that need to be remembered while soloing, many of which we are not even aware of consciously. It is not possible to solo well at a high speed without having memorized many many combinations of notes. Of course the idea is for them to come out effortlessly but that is going to take a long long time to develop for anybodys. Knowing as many patterns as possible should aid melodic playing not hinder it.

Beeboss, I'm just saying what he said. So I'm not trying to interpret what he says (maybe he didn't say it well).

I'll make this observation though. When he plays for me in a lesson, I get a sense of repeated melodic constructs in what he plays. I'll see recognizable snippets.

When he plays in a real gig, or in his recordings, everything is unique sounding to my ears. So it seems he can call upon memory/patterns/shapes when he doesn't want to make the effort (like in teaching). But he is able to get into a zone of creation where the music is seamlessly connected to him and it is flowing with a purpose.

I get your point though since there's no way to separate known shapes from one's memory. Even chords and intervals are all familiar and automatic. But I think the different is in mindless streaming of notes vs. a musical idea. Maybe in a literature analogy, much like reading a dictionary vs. reading poetry.

When I was playing GS, I was striving to make melodic connections and it was very hard to concentrate at 200bpm. Much easier at 150bpm. If my mind wanders off a bit, I end up going through some automatic motions. Perhaps that's what it's all about. The concentration to take the robot out of the playing mechanism.

Haha! I'm learning Shorter's Ana Maria right now. If you thought Nef was tough... just beautiful harmonic changes.

Kenny Kirkland covered it on his self-titled album, it has got to be one of the best improvs I've ever heard bar none. Find it if you can, (or ask and I'll send it to you.)

Kurt Rosenwinkle did it too on his standards album, I'm not as keen for it on guitar, and Kurt doesn't do it for me, but you may also like that one.

btw, of all people playing Giant Steps, here's STEVIE WONDER:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYoadikm1sI

Killer!

That is one great tune. I love that Shorter album 'Native Dancer'. I have never dared to play it though.

That makes perfect sense. The phrases need to work together to complement each other and not just be thrown out randomly, ideally at least. To do this at a fast tempo is just very difficult which is why I always try to play a few fast things to get the old brain working in that way. Better to do it on something very easy before trying it with giant steps though.

I'm just listening to it now. I don't know it and it's a beautiful tune. I would be happy to learn this someday.

To my ears though it doesn't seem difficult to grasp. I don't know why that is. Perhaps a tune that stays in a tonality long enough and you can adjust to the change.

Compared to VE and GS, these two tunes can be rather abrubt. Just as my ear starts to expect a particular harmony it shifts suddenly. Throws me off and then it's hard to resume or connect an idea.

I don't have a problem with even the most frequent key changes in most standards, as long as they linger for a bar or two.

And I just realized something about VE and GS, even when there is a ii-V or V-I, the form is off center in both, meaning the ii-V or V-I is split between two bars. Maybe that's why it's disconcerting to many, including myself.

When a tune follows a more regular form, and ii-V's occur in a single bar (or 2), maybe that's what makes it easier to follow.