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#1458774 - 06/18/10 10:20 AM Re: Bad initial results with stereo receiver sound [Re: JoeyIsFunny]
jazzonebyone Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/19/09
Posts: 69
Loc: sc
I know that this was mentioned earlier, but BE SURE that the receiver is set to the 2-channel mode - no surround.
The speakers can make all the difference - I use a pair (or occasionally 2 pair) of vintage Klipsch KG-4's. They are plenty loud and sound much more accurate than any PA speaker or "standard" home speaker that I have tried. And I've tried a few. I use no tone or eq adjustments on the amplifier, but I have tweaked the piano sound a bit.
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#1458775 - 06/18/10 10:21 AM Re: Bad initial results with stereo receiver sound [Re: JoeyIsFunny]
dewster Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/07/09
Posts: 3410
Loc: Northern NJ
Originally Posted By: JoeyIsFunny
Oh I forgot to mention an interesting point. I had to turn the bass eq on the receiver (it only has bass and treble) all the way down to 0 and the treble to 50% for it to sound decent. The curve on my separate EQ looks something like this. I still cant get a totally natural midrange sound, something sounds artificial. Ill keep working on it!

Wow, I think I'd work that thing into the trash.
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#1458783 - 06/18/10 10:30 AM Re: Bad initial results with stereo receiver sound [Re: dewster]
JoeyIsFunny Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/14/10
Posts: 178
Originally Posted By: dewster
Originally Posted By: JoeyIsFunny
Oh I forgot to mention an interesting point. I had to turn the bass eq on the receiver (it only has bass and treble) all the way down to 0 and the treble to 50% for it to sound decent. The curve on my separate EQ looks something like this. I still cant get a totally natural midrange sound, something sounds artificial. Ill keep working on it!

Wow, I think I'd work that thing into the trash.


I think you are on the right track! I really wish I had a few different receivers to compare this one to, Ill have to wait for sunday to be able to compare my girlfriends old ass receiver (it was her fathers).

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#1458799 - 06/18/10 10:58 AM Re: Bad initial results with stereo receiver sound [Re: MacMacMac]
ChrisA Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 3768
Loc: Redondo Beach, California
Quote:
contacted the craigslist seller who has the Polk R50s, and he would take no less than $100 for 2 of them.
ChrisA reports that you can get the Polks BRAND NEW for around $100. So if that seller wants $100 for a used pair, he must be smoking some funny weed. [/quote]

Normal street price is about $110 EACH. I was able to get them for $49 each but I doubt we will ever see that price again. Frys has them on sale right now at $99 EACH. So if you see them used in good condition for $100 a PAIR that is about right, 50% of retail for current model in-production gear is about right for used.

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#1459455 - 06/19/10 06:58 PM Re: Bad initial results with stereo receiver sound [Re: ChrisA]
JoeyIsFunny Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/14/10
Posts: 178
So I just went to see the man who was selling the polk speakers... he gave me the deal of the year!!! He initially wanted $200 for 4 R50s, but I told him I only needed 2 and I offered $80. He declined and said hed take $100 for 2. So I agreed to come look. When I got there he said "man I really need to get rid of all four of these speakers cause I just got a new system. How about $150 for all four." I grinned and said "hmm... I really just dont need 4, but thats a good deal... I really hadnt wanted to spend more than $100..." So we talked some more (this late 40's ex marine was at least 6'6" and 275 lbs... HUGE freaking guy) and he was playing some mind games jokingly and kept trying to get me to buy them. After some more talking we discovered we were both engineers from Georgia Tech and he seemed to like that alot so he said "aw hell just take them all for $100! Pass the good deal on to someone else in the future!" The dude scared the hell out of me, he seemed like he could be in the mafia or something, had a real odd devious air about him. So I accepted, gave him the money, grabbed the speakers and got the hell out of there! Thoughts of his sledgehammer sized hands (no exaggeration) punching a hole through my solar plexus and taking his speakers back crept into my head as I was packing up, but he turned out to just be drunk, not a killer. laugh

So, Im the proud owner of 4 cherry colored, like new, Polk R50s! FOR $100!!!!


Edited by JoeyIsFunny (06/19/10 06:58 PM)

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#1459470 - 06/19/10 07:43 PM Re: Bad initial results with stereo receiver sound [Re: JoeyIsFunny]
Bob M Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/02/09
Posts: 185
Loc: North Carolina
Joey, Your comment about turning the bassEQ all the way down, leads me to add my own observations. When I take the line out from a CD player to my CambridgeSoundwords 2.1 system, I add about 30% of the bass boast to listen to a piano CD. But when I connect my DP, I have to turn the bass all the way back, and it is still too much. I have observed this with my NP-30, and a couple of previous keyboards. My guess is that the small amps in these very portable instruments are EQ'd to give more bass (the illusion of bass that is) thru the very small, $2 built-in speakers, and that the headphone jack, which is used for a TSR out, is not adjusted back to flat. So "mud" is what you hear trying to go into a stereo receiver. And who knows what the "curve" of this output looks like in other ways? So I'm not surprised that you're getting closer with your 7-band EQ.

My Korg SP-170 headphone out seems to be flatter--I add a little boast to the bass of the same 2.1 system to make it sound good to my ear.

You folks with the electronics/engineering minds, does this make any sense?
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#1459475 - 06/19/10 07:54 PM Re: Bad initial results with stereo receiver sound [Re: Bob M]
JoeyIsFunny Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/14/10
Posts: 178
Originally Posted By: Bob M
Joey, Your comment about turning the bassEQ all the way down, leads me to add my own observations. When I take the line out from a CD player to my CambridgeSoundwords 2.1 system, I add about 30% of the bass boast to listen to a piano CD. But when I connect my DP, I have to turn the bass all the way back, and it is still too much. I have observed this with my NP-30, and a couple of previous keyboards. My guess is that the small amps in these very portable instruments are EQ'd to give more bass (the illusion of bass that is) thru the very small, $2 built-in speakers, and that the headphone jack, which is used for a TSR out, is not adjusted back to flat. So "mud" is what you hear trying to go into a stereo receiver. And who knows what the "curve" of this output looks like in other ways? So I'm not surprised that you're getting closer with your 7-band EQ.

My Korg SP-170 headphone out seems to be flatter--I add a little boast to the bass of the same 2.1 system to make it sound good to my ear.

You folks with the electronics/engineering minds, does this make any sense?


I think you may be right, that does make sense. Although when I use my studio monitor headphones the EQ seems to be perfect. Either way, I just hooked up my R50s and ss-b1000s through the other receiver I just brought home and man, even without the EQ it sounds great. Again I turned the bass all the way down, but it hits the sweet spot there and sounds great. Im going to add an EQ just to play around with it, but MAN Im happy now! The R50s sound AMAZING. Thanks to ChrisA for pointing them out to me.

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#1459486 - 06/19/10 08:17 PM Re: Bad initial results with stereo receiver sound [Re: JoeyIsFunny]
MacMacMac Online   content
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/24/09
Posts: 2343
Loc: Florida
Originally Posted By: JoeyIsFunny
... He initially wanted $200 for 4 R50s ... ... so he said "aw hell just take them all for $100! ... So, I'm the proud owner of 4 cherry colored, like new, Polk R50s! For $100!
Great find! There are lots of great speaker deals out there, ripe for the grabbing at low, low prices.

I went that route, too, and I got a great deal. But I can't match your story about Mr. Big Guy. smile

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#1459551 - 06/19/10 10:29 PM Re: Bad initial results with stereo receiver sound [Re: MacMacMac]
JoeyIsFunny Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/14/10
Posts: 178
I added the EQ and it does sound better. Pretty close to right where I had hoped it would be sound wise. Theres still a little unpleasant "ringing" in the upper-bass/lower-mid range, but I think that has to do with the fact that Im sitting SO close to the speakers and am practically inbetween them. They are made to be at home theater distance, so Ill just deal with it. I tried turning them sideways facing left/right and also directly backwards, and both positions produced different sounds. Better in some ways, worse in others. So Im leaving them facing forward but slightly turned in for now.

Its definitely good overall though. Cant wait for my wooden stand and pedal bar to arrive monday, Ill post pics in the pic/setup thread once its all finished.

EDIT: I have some of that polyfill stuff that people use to stuff in their speakers cabinets. Its supposed to improve the bass response of speakers and remove "boomy" bass. Im thinking of trying this to see if it gets rid of that ringing bass I mentioned. Has anyone here ever tried this??


Edited by JoeyIsFunny (06/19/10 11:04 PM)

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#1459565 - 06/19/10 11:24 PM Re: Bad initial results with stereo receiver sound [Re: JoeyIsFunny]
dewster Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/07/09
Posts: 3410
Loc: Northern NJ
Originally Posted By: JoeyIsFunny
EDIT: I have some of that polyfill stuff that people use to stuff in their speakers cabinets. Its supposed to improve the bass response of speakers and remove "boomy" bass. Im thinking of trying this to see if it gets rid of that ringing bass I mentioned. Has anyone here ever tried this??[/color]

Polyfill changes the behaviour of the airspring in the enclosure go from "adiabatic" to "isothermal". Basically it makes the enclosure seem bigger than it really is. If the enclosure is too small for the woofer (common) then polyfill could help. The best way to tell is by plugging the woofer TS parameters into a calculator and measuring the internal volume of the enclosure.

If this is a ported enclosure than a different tuning might help.

Often the woofer and enclosure are both POS, and it's easier to do it right from scratch.
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#1459579 - 06/20/10 12:26 AM Re: Bad initial results with stereo receiver sound [Re: dewster]
JoeyIsFunny Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/14/10
Posts: 178
Originally Posted By: dewster
Originally Posted By: JoeyIsFunny
EDIT: I have some of that polyfill stuff that people use to stuff in their speakers cabinets. Its supposed to improve the bass response of speakers and remove "boomy" bass. Im thinking of trying this to see if it gets rid of that ringing bass I mentioned. Has anyone here ever tried this??[/color]

Polyfill changes the behaviour of the airspring in the enclosure go from "adiabatic" to "isothermal". Basically it makes the enclosure seem bigger than it really is. If the enclosure is too small for the woofer (common) then polyfill could help. The best way to tell is by plugging the woofer TS parameters into a calculator and measuring the internal volume of the enclosure.

If this is a ported enclosure than a different tuning might help.

Often the woofer and enclosure are both POS, and it's easier to do it right from scratch.


It is ported, and they arent POS speakers, but definitely not top end. Its a pretty big enclosure and has 2x6.5" woofers each + tweeter. Dont feel like messing with all that TS stuff, Ill just use the 1/2 lb per sq ft rule with polyfill and see what it does. I think Ill definitely do it with the small bookshelf speakers as I would probably notice the biggest change there.

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