Posted by GPM: On the contrary Emmery, as soon as I found out it was a mistake, thanks to Jerry Groot, I immediately was up front about it, posted the correction, and apologized. No "deliberate trick" here as you suggest. You can pm Jerry and ask him if that is true. How is that for transparency and honesty?

How much of the literature have you looked at?

I think it' time to let everyone know what will be happening July 1-4.

Bill Bremmer will be coming to my home following the PTG Las Vegas convention, along with Patrick Wingren (pppat), who will be at the PTG convention in Las Vegas as well. Joining Bill and Patrick, will be Gregg Punswick, an excellent pianist and friend of Bill's.

While I was out and about today, I stopped at the pullick liberry and looked up "fox-trot" in the Oxford English Dictionary. It lists when words first entered the printed record. Here is an abbreviated version, reformatted and with added punctuation for readability:

fox-trot , sb. 1. A pace with short steps, as in changing from trotting to walking.

1872 F. M. A. Roe, Army Lett., (1909), 70, "He has a fox trot, which is wonderfully easy."
1888 Century Mag. Oct. XXXVI, 897, "She heard a horse approaching at a *fox-trot."
1894 R. Kipling, Day's Work, (1898), 58, "Would you consider a fox-trot, an' single-foot, an' rack, an' pace, an' amble, disctinctions not worth distinguishin'?"
1946 M. C. Self, Horseman's Encycl. 134, "Fox trot, a slow, shuffling trot, the fox-trot is one of the gaits permitted in a five-gaited saddler as a 'slow-gait'."

2. A modern dance, of American origin, consisting chiefly of alternating measures of long and short steps; also, a piece of music suitable as an accompaniment for the fox-trot.

1915 Truth, 17 Mar., 1/5, "A new dance, the 'Fox-trot', a relation of..'Ragtime'."
1915 Victor Record Catal., May, "Dance records... Fox trots."
1917 S. B. Leacock, Frenzied Fiction, (1919), v. 70, "The others were dancing the fox-trot to the victrola on the piazza."
1919 G.D'Egville, How & What to Dance, (1922), 55, "The Fox-Trot is a dance of many steps, and to the casual observer everybody seems to have different ones."
1919 E. Scott, All about Latest Dances, 68, "The true basis of the American Fox-Trot is an alternation of four slow and four or eight quick movements, depending on the step chosen."
1923 ---A.B.C. of Dancing, 84, "The foxtrot is not a dance in the sense that the waltz and polka are dances because it has no distinctive rhythm and no characteristic step or figure."
1928 Melody Maker, Feb., 127/1, "You have just heard a fox-trot, 'I call her honey because she sticks to me'."
1946 R. Capell, Simiomata 11, 48, "Kirou remembers Macaskie singing foxtrots."

On a related note, there was a fox in our backyard twice this week, rare in an urban setting such as ours. It really did trot.

Funny how these things work, don't 'cha think?

Ralph, I truly believe we all respond to frequencies in deep and mysterious ways, that we are in tune with certain people and not in tune with others, that life is largely made up of cycles and rhythms, and that we need a new forum on Piano World called "Metaphysicians Corner." I once worked with someone who couldn't get near a computer without having it go haywire. LOVED your post!

--Andy Strong

Hi, Andy. Didn't know a whole lot about fox trot but this page clued me in:

http://www.centralhome.com/ballroomcountry/foxtrot.htm

Harry Fox, of course, of course. Mentions his debut of it was to ragtime music. Sounds like a Yes to me. Think he might have used Castle House Rag? Written the same year. And Ragtime Nightingale written the following year. James Reese Europe certainly knew Harry Fox and Joe Lamb probably did too.

Howard

I do not know what you would consider such a study. What literature have you read? Have you read Barbour, or Parch, for instance?

Ron,
True, true. Very true. And that is one distinguishing characteristic of the EBVT III temperament--key color!

But, as I understand it, the purpose of the "transposing test" is to put to rest the question of whether or not EBVT III works gracefully in all keys. So, let's take a familiar piece of music and run it through the mill.

WTC prelude no.1 in C, played in Db? Let's give it a whirl and see what happens!

--Andy Strong

This key signature thing...

I've always thought of the interaction between composers and the tuning of the time. Again, written evidence is weak, but it seems likely that if MOST tunings had some sort of circle of fifths based reference pre-1900, then the composers would have kept that in mind while creating. There's that whole Key color thing - certain keys were thought to have certain characteristics...(see www.rollingball.com) Consider the Well Tempered Clavier- the difference in the way the keyboard is used between Cmaj and C# major...

Kind of like racing tires and snow tires... Take those slicks out in the snow? Put the studded tires on in the summer? Those tires won't seem so good then. Use them how they were intended? Different story.

C#, Db ... I could live with either choice. Bb would be fun, too.

It wouldn't really need to be "performed" per se. It could just be chorded out, then transposed.

Just a thought...

--Andy

Yes Ron, and this is why I like playing in the temperament and key more than transposing mechanically (digitally). The music comes out a bit differently, and it really feels different to the pianist!

Now, here's an important point that I think it would be a good thing to bring up after the discussion has shifted a bit towards the player-piano postings that GP (=Grandpianoman) made such a wonderful effort of sharing with us here.

When I recorded the Bach/Siloti and the Debussy on the same piano with different temperaments, all done inside 48 hrs, I was pretty baffled myself.

I knew from earlier experiences that two pianos could physically sound different with different temperaments. Not only the pitch, but the other factors - timbre, dynamics, pedalling, sustain - they really change!

And without being the least scientific, it might all be in the player's conception of the instrument. Which leads us to play differently - and this is mostly interesting.

To me, during the recording weekend, Equal Temperament (ET) was like a beautifully calibrated machine. I could bring ideas to it, and they where executed in orderly fashion. I can in no way complain on what the piano did with what I asked it for. It reproduced and gave tone to what I felt inside.

But, aah, the dialogue i experienced with the EBVT III Sometimes I pushed it and it refused, other times it happily went with me, even pushing me on. In one place I was going to do a rallentando, but It kicked me on forwards. Then, instead, it it seemed to be willing to stay on certain following resonant chords forever.

I've never been riding horses myself, but a few of my friends do. I finally start to get a grasp of what they are talking about in the constant communication giving a surprising result that often seems to exceed the abilities of either part.

My main point is that I hope that as many of you pianists as possible would get the chance to play a piano like this, because it really is something else

Harsh critic has been brought forward against non-equal temperaments, stating that they abandon the remote keys for the purity of the close keys.
Personally, I do not think this is more than a theoretical problem. If I can play "Clair de Lune" in D flat and both musicians and tuners have a hard time telling the temperaments apart, there shouln't be much doubt left that the EBVT III is a true 24-key alternative to todays industry standard ET.

And - in my personal opinion - this alternative is a much more interesting and pleasing one. But don't just take my word for it, challenge your tuners out there If they are of a curious nature and eager to take on new things, taking up the challenge they will be rewarded with greater sensitivity to music, and a deepened understanding of their standard tuning as well.

I am so grateful for Patrick's post above, because ever since I started playing in EBVT III, I've had this burning desire to get the word out to performers about it. But I'm just little old me, basically playing to anyone in the neighborhood who happens to be walking the dog by my open window when I'm practicing...

So, I just want to underscore what Patrick said. And what Nick said about it being "such an indulgence." Playing in EBVT III does things to you as you play. It causes you to hear things and feel things you've never heard or felt before. It brings out mysteries. It helps you shape phrases. It encourages you to strike chords in certain ways. It can help you develop a deeper appreciation for the genius of the composers you play.

When Patrick says, "but, ah, the dialogue I experienced with the EBVT III..." There is so much in that statement! Which is why I gave you the description of Michael Kaeshammer playing the temperament in concert. I really could see from his facial expressions the joy and surprise he encountered by playing on a piano that was "alive" with EBVT III. Plus, I could hear it with my own ears as he met it! I think that's why I was so thrilled with the performance.

I'm looking forward to hearing from Ryan ("Fog Audio"), when he gets some time, about his experience playing in the temperament. He is Nick's customer, and he posted some recordings to the "My Piano in EBVT III" thread (this links to page 19, with his first recording. Look for the corrected version, about half-way down the page.)

So, when Patrick says,



That's my hope and desire for all of you as well! Because not only will your tuner be rewarded with greater sensitivity-- You will, too!

--Andy Strong

Following the intermission, the tonalities were already well established in the hall. It felt like the program was casted in one piece, but the reason for that might be hard to point out for the uninitiated - the concert was put together of pieces in keys with flats, and that more or less automatically gives a full-bodied grasp of the aural space. An evident feeling of pithyness and drama resonated among the pillars in Ahlbäcksalen [the concert hall]. String instruments sound warmer and juicyer in keys with flats (something that, for example, Paganini was known to make good use of). The Allegretto in Bb major, WoO 39, provided a good example of this fact, with its flowing elegance and furtive glances upon unexpected chords. Still, this key phenomenon was even more clear in Beethoven's piano trio in Eb flat, op. 70/2, in which each of the three instruments were given virtuoso parts in which they could shine. Marko Ylönen's cello tone deserves to be especially noted, warm and rich in color. The melancholic beauty of the third movement, with its major-minor shifts, appealed to me most.