HAHA that song has nothing to do with sex..

I was talking about some of his other songs, where he clearly and cleverly depicts orgasms and all that..

Actually, apparently Hitler's favorite opera was "The Merry Widow." It wasn't so much Wagner and Beethoven's music that he liked, but the fact that they happened to be German.

Well, I have to confess that I've never heard Mr. Cent, nor Mr. Inem.

lol

Mm, personally I'm inclined to think that rap's probably responsible for an awful lot of misogyny and as such has a detrimental effect on society.

Just think, if we only had jazz and classical exist, people would be so much different, I think.

So if I go from listening to Lady Gaga, then to Beethoven's Appassionata, then to Eminem's Kill You, to Liszt's Totentanz, to DJ Tiesto, what does that say about my soul?

That you are schizo?

Ooh. Schizophrenia is no good. I'd rather be bipolar.

(I'm not either, but just saying. haha)

You have a point, there.

Or maybe a scherzo.

Robert Schumann-
"How is gravity to clothe itself if jest goes about in dark veils?"

Angelina, 50 cent is a product. That's it. You don't go to McDonalds looking for good cuisine, do you?

I agree with you on the detrimental side of the message. But there 's a whole mainstream industry supporting that kind of rap. Anyway i think 90% of the people are now aware that rappers who rap about shooting people etc. are justmaking these stories up. I don't think Tupac was ever a relevant gangster. Nor was Biggie (Notorious B.I.G.).

Damon, so you're better than Xzibit and you've performed rap in front og huge audiences ...so you're Eminem now? Well if you really are an mc. i think it 's fair to say put up or shut up. Meaning, you said you can outrhyme Xzibit on that track ... talk is cheap, so let us hear that please.

Product or not, this whole (c)rap thing seems to suck. I don't get what's so cool about shooting people.

And I don't go to McDonalds..

I used to go to McDonalds a lot for breakfast. But then I realized it wouldn't go with my interest in classical music so I now go to....Dunkin Donuts for breakfast.

Cool or not, shooting people is often part of art.

Aren't you Ukrainian, Angelina? Have you ever heard of the great Ukrainian rapper Nicky VIce, who rapped the epic story of a certain Taras Boulba?

After the deep Russia, there must be some deep United Statesians who remember the country hit "El Paso" by Marty Robbins, about the amorous young cowboy who in a fit of jealousy kills a rival, steals a horse and escapes, only to come back to Rosa's cantina and die in his love's arms.

Shooting people in songs is as American as apple pie.

I'm not ukranian..

Oh, I thought I had read that in one of your posts, sometime ago. Sorry.

By Nicky V-Ice, I mean Nicholas Vassiliévitch Gogol.

I insist, though, the themes that you speak about as representative of rap make up part of the themes of many works of art, popular or great, from all periods of history and every country.

And they are as American as apple pie.

I have never heard a song or watched a video by Snoop Dog, but I believe that he is closely identified with the gangsta rap.

But I have seen Snoop Dog in a movie. There is a film, in my opinion a very good one, called Baby Boy, directed by John Singleton, in which Snoop Dog plays a supporting role.

His character is a violent, misogynous gangster-type, who gets out of prison and who in the most brutal fashion pushes his way into the apartment of his ex-grilfriend ... who is now the girlfriend of the leading character. He is dispicable, in this movie. A horrible creature.

But it is clear that in accepting this role he is not glorifying the brutality of a gangster, quite the contrary.

wait, what does dunkin donuts have to do with "classical" music?

If you want to see how despicable lyrics can get, check out Eminem's "Insane." I'd like to post theme here, but the post would be immediately deleted!

http://www.metrolyrics.com/insane-lyrics-eminem.html

Wow - that's definitely great art !!!

What I find comical is that you all seem to write these comments in serious.

Lan, even if they are elements of all art, I think rap in general tends to depict it in the worst possible way..

I have yet to listen to Eminem's new album. Apparently, it's his best work since 2000's Marshall Mathers LP. So I think I'll download the tracks when I get home.

No percentages, sorry, but yes, i think there is a lot more to rap than gangsta. Well, i know, anyway. Lots of labels, lots of artists uninterested in the gansta style. Like i said, no percentages though.

So Johnny Cash writes "Early one mornin' while makin' the rounds I took a shot of cocaine and I shot my woman down" and it's cool, but if it's an uneducated youth from the ghetto, it's detrimental to society. I am no moralist but i think gansta rap, the mysoginism, the glorifying of such negative values, comes from the fact that a lot of this people, the american underclass, or at least a part of it, has not much else to talk about. And i don't see much being done about it. Obviously these kids probably don't know who Gogol is, so it is no surprise that they rap about all that stuff. They probably don't know anything else.

People go crazy against rap , saying how sad it is that kids enjoy records about shooting, killing, trafficking, pimping, and all that.
Yet it is the mainstream, the big companies, that embraced gangsta rap and pushed it more than any other hip hop style. Independent artists like Aesop Rock, Sage Francis, Shapeshifters, 2mex ... Mos Def only did after becoming a Hollywood star ...these guys who de not rap about the "detrimental" stuff, these guys never get deals with the big labels. So it is actually those who are scandalized by the profanity and the verbal violence who have no problem in milking the cow.

interesting video using "Fur Elise"; the rap "song" is quite mature, it is definitely a good example of the more positive qualities of rap .

lyrics:

Nas - I Can


[Kids]
I know I can (I know I can)
Be what I wanna be (be what I wanna be)
If I work hard at it (If I work hard it)
I'll be where I wanna be (I'll be where I wanna be)

[Nas]
Be, B-Boys and girls, listen up
You can be anything in the world, in God we trust
An architect, doctor, maybe an actress
But nothing comes easy it takes much practice
Like, I met a woman who's becoming a star
She was very beautiful, leaving people in awe
Singing songs, Lina Horn, but the younger version
Hung with the wrong person
Gotta astrung when I heard when
Cocaine, sniffing up drugs, all in her nose
Coulda died, so young, no looks ugly and old
No fun cause when she reaches for hugs people hold they breath
Cause she smells of corrosion and death
Watch the company you keep and the crowd you bring
Cause they came to do drugs and you came to sing
So if you gonna be the best, I'ma tell you how

[Chorus - 2x (Nas and Kids)]
I know I can (I know I can)
Be what I wanna be (be what I wanna be)
If I work hard at it (If I work hard it)
I'll be where I wanna be (I'll be where I wanna be)

[Nas]
Be, B-Boys and girls, listen again
This is for grown looking girls who's only ten
The ones who watch videos and do what they see
As cute as can be, up in the club with fake ID
Careful, 'fore you meet a man with HIV
You can host the TV like Oprah Winfrey
Whatever you decide, be careful, some men be
Rapists, so act your age, don't pretend to be
Older than you are, give yourself time to grow
You thinking he can give you wealth, but so
Young boys, you can use a lot of help, you know
You thinkin life's all about smokin weed and ice
You don't wanna be my age and can't read and right
Begging different women for a place to sleep at night
Smart boys turn to men and do whatever they wish
If you believe you can achieve, then say it like this

[Chorus]

Save the music y'all, save the music y'all
Save the music y'all, save the music y'all
Save the music

[Nas]
Be, be, 'fore we came to this country
We were kings and queens, never porch monkeys
It was empires in Africa called Kush
Timbuktu, where every race came to get books
To learn from black teachers who taught Greeks and Romans
Asian Arabs and gave them gold when
Gold was converted to money it all changed
Money then became empowerment for Europeans
The Persian military invaded
They learned about the gold, the teachings and everything sacred
Africa was almost robbed naked
Slavery was money, so they began making slave ships
Egypt was the place that Alexander the Great went
He was so shocked at the mountains with black faces
Shot up they nose to impose what basically
Still goes on today, you see?
If the truth is told, the youth can grow
They learn to survive until they gain control
Nobody says you have to be gangstas, hoes
Read more learn more, change the globe
Ghetto children, do your thing
Hold your head up, little man, you're a king
Young Prince thats when you get your wedding ring
Your man is saying "She's my queen"

[Chorus]

I am not so sure that those "milking the cow" actually do act scandalized about it. I doubt many here at PW who are unhappy with it are reaping much financial benefit from promoting gangsta rappers. At least in not any direct way that they can control.

On a different tangent, I was thinking about how American television is saturated with violence (and on the cable channels, with profanity as well), and yet people who happily watch all sorts of bloody mayhem and bad language as entertainment still complain about rap lyrics. Because of that, I don't think the issue is really the words in rap, as much as feeling threatened by some urban blacks acting like thugs, and that rap is supporting that kind of thuggery. And, American society being what it is, I think that feeling of threat is based in some realities that those living outside of it may not quite understand. On the other hand, I think that some people who are living in it exaggerate it quite a bit, and I don't doubt that sometimes that exaggeration is because of racism. But not always.

Ah, yes - I agree that racism has something to do with it with some people. There are many reasons why a society will choose to reject one art-form because it represents everything they wish expurgated from their society. Many fine, upstanding citizens react very badly to seeing their children adopting the ways and customs of an ethnic class entirely foreign to them - it's been a common theme in history, and shouldn't be too surprising. Rome, itself, is said to have started it's long decline from foreign influences and a change in the social values of the upper-classes, which might have also been a result of that - there are many, many analogies to our times. Besides Rome, the list goes on and on.

In the end, simple racism may play an important role in preserving one's cultural heritage and way of life. Many people are accustomed to the recent idea that America is a "many-colored face" or use the term "the changing face of America" to show the continuing diversity of it's citizens, but many people still wish to hold on to their culture and do not wish to be subsumed into a big melting pot, where all cultural differences are blended together into a blah of greyness.

Some of them also fear the adoption of one foreign cultural influence over other older traditions, such as the danger they perceive from Rap Music. This is the fear parents feel when their children start listening to rap, when they are from an entirely different ethnic background.

It's a touchy subject, that's for sure.

It is. But i think hip hop is beyond black now. Both audience and artist base wise.

Anyway, take Tarantino. What is there in Reservoir dogs that is different from a gangsta rap story? I don't see anything there but violence (and good acting, true). But we're talking about a guy who has made violence the leit motiv of most of his art. Glorifies it. When i watch The Wire, i feel like im reading one of those "great american novels". yes there´s violence , but it is justified, it's so part of the story, and , there is so much more in the show than just visual violence. That i do not perceive with Tarantino. Yet he goes down in history as a movie maker, as a true artist, people excuse him the bloodbaths and chopped ears in his "art".

2pac, though, is, for a lot of people who are not into hip hop, that black rapper that got shot over some bs. In spite of the huge amount of music he made during his life and the huge amount of it that he left written before he passed. Then people listen to his cd s(i think he s the rapper that actually used "real" music the most in his records)and go "hey, this is actually good MUSIC".