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#1465716 - 06/30/10 01:27 PM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: Ben Crosland]
keyboardklutz Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/21/07
Posts: 10856
Loc: London, UK (though if it's Aug...
Yeh, learning is fun! Thanks for passing that little nugget on.
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snobbyish, yet maybe helpful.
http://keyboardclass.blogspot.com/


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#1465767 - 06/30/10 02:47 PM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: Ben Crosland]
wavelength Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/23/07
Posts: 340
Loc: Vermont, USA
What you have described sounds more like "reasonable fluency" than "genius".

To those not accustomed to being around competent musicians, that kind of fluency seems like magic, and they'll use words like "genius". I know it seemed like magic to me once.

Fluent emotional expression through music is wonderful! And I have to agree that this aspect of music is under-nurtured in schools.

I don't mean to be discouraging, but from this and your other posts I have the feeling that you don't realize how good the really good musicians actually are. I'm not talking about the Mozarts and the Coltranes, but more like the run-of-the-mill working jazz musician in New York City. It's great that you can pick up a new instrument and find joy in it - that's my hobby too. But don't compare your abilities to the people who have been working on it for a couple years; measure them by the standards of the professionals in New York City, and you will be elevated.

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#1466071 - 06/30/10 11:56 PM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: wavelength]
hippymusicman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 150
Originally Posted By: wavelength
To those not accustomed to being around competent musicians, that kind of fluency seems like magic, and they'll use words like "genius". I know it seemed like magic to me once.

I don't mean to be discouraging, but from this and your other posts I have the feeling that you don't realize how good the really good musicians actually are. I'm not talking about the Mozarts and the Coltranes, but more like the run-of-the-mill working jazz musician in New York City. It's great that you can pick up a new instrument and find joy in it - that's my hobby too. But don't compare your abilities to the people who have been working on it for a couple years; measure them by the standards of the professionals in New York City, and you will be elevated.


Thanks for you post. I agree wholeheartedly!
And I am not easily discouraged, but thanks for your concern.

It's not that I don't understand there are people out there who are (as you said) "better" than me...

I just find the use of terms like "better musician" "great musician" "genius musician" are all terms we use to satisfy ourselves. If you believe you are "better" than someone else at music then that can satisfy something.. but that satisfaction is usually very shallow. I find that this kind of satisfaction gets further away as you get closer. I believe everyone is on a never ending quest to satisfy themselves.

I don't like to have a rating system. Because a rating system holds no purpose. In my mind, nobody is better than anybody. Everybody is as they are.

By the same token, I don't strive to be "better" or "great" I just love what I'm doing and that causes me to get "better" (whatever that means) .
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... such a vital organ

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#1466094 - 07/01/10 12:57 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: hippymusicman]
eweiss Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/28/09
Posts: 2393
Loc: Beautiful San Diego, CA
HM ... the more you write, the more I like you!
_________________________
Play New Age Piano
http://www.quiescencemusic.com

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#1466098 - 07/01/10 01:08 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: eweiss]
Elissa Milne Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 1337
Loc: Sydney, NSW, Australia
hippymusicman, this whole thread is dedicated to you explaining what makes you a better musician than other people!!! Unless I'm horribly mistaken your opening thread sought to explain what it is about you that makes other people call you a genius, and you were seeking to elucidate others as to how they also could attain the label of 'genius'. Am I horribly mistaken?!
_________________________
Teacher, Composer, Writer, Speaker
Working with Hal Leonard, Alfred, Faber, and Australian Music Examination Board
Music in syllabuses by ABRSM, AMEB, Trinity Guildhall, ANZCA, NZMEB, and more
www.elissamilne.wordpress.com

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#1466106 - 07/01/10 01:31 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: eweiss]
keyboardklutz Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/21/07
Posts: 10856
Loc: London, UK (though if it's Aug...
Originally Posted By: eweiss
HM ... the more you write, the more I like you!
Don't mistake ego incontinence for genius - you've done it before.
_________________________
snobbyish, yet maybe helpful.
http://keyboardclass.blogspot.com/


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#1466131 - 07/01/10 02:47 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: keyboardklutz]
Candywoman Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/14/03
Posts: 857
I think it is more important to know how to lose your inhibitions at the piano, at least the ones that impact performance negatively. I'm exploring this concept by performing for different people.

I also wonder, should I perform TO my audience or should I get wrapped up in my inner world and make them do the work of appreciating that?

One of my problems when performing is I'll think, "Gee, I really got that note perfectly" and then right after that my mind will go blank.

To the OP, what about music that isn't all that emotional by nature, for instance a Bach Sinfonia?

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#1466135 - 07/01/10 02:52 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: Candywoman]
AZNpiano Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/07/07
Posts: 5590
Loc: Orange County, CA
Originally Posted By: Candywoman
what about music that isn't all that emotional by nature, for instance a Bach Sinfonia?


???? Bach Sinfonia, not emotional ????

But I must admit, there are quite a few clunkers in that set.
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Private Piano Teacher and MTAC Member

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#1466149 - 07/01/10 03:30 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: AZNpiano]
Elissa Milne Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 1337
Loc: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Yeah, I must say, I find Bach Sinfonias to be the essence of emotion..... Hmmmm......

Further, please keep some of your inhibitions intact - clothes on, blaspheming to a minimum, that kind of thing.
_________________________
Teacher, Composer, Writer, Speaker
Working with Hal Leonard, Alfred, Faber, and Australian Music Examination Board
Music in syllabuses by ABRSM, AMEB, Trinity Guildhall, ANZCA, NZMEB, and more
www.elissamilne.wordpress.com

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#1467422 - 07/03/10 05:36 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: Elissa Milne]
hippymusicman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 150
Originally Posted By: Elissa Milne
hippymusicman, this whole thread is dedicated to you explaining what makes you a better musician than other people!!! Unless I'm horribly mistaken your opening thread sought to explain what it is about you that makes other people call you a genius, and you were seeking to elucidate others as to how they also could attain the label of 'genius'. Am I horribly mistaken?!


I want people to attempt to attain the label 'genius' so they can understand that the word really means nothing, labels mean nothing, ranking systems mean nothing. There is no need for any use of the phrases 'better' 'musical genius' 'great musicians' besides trying to fulfill something inside of you.

Labels do not fill the inner holes..
they fill the external holes for a moment, in the same way buying a new car fills external holes. The next week, the feeling is gone and suddenly your mind is on the next thing..
_________________________
... such a vital organ

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#1467423 - 07/03/10 05:43 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: Candywoman]
hippymusicman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 150
Originally Posted By: Candywoman
I think it is more important to know how to lose your inhibitions at the piano, at least the ones that impact performance negatively. I'm exploring this concept by performing for different people.

I also wonder, should I perform TO my audience or should I get wrapped up in my inner world and make them do the work of appreciating that?

One of my problems when performing is I'll think, "Gee, I really got that note perfectly" and then right after that my mind will go blank.

To the OP, what about music that isn't all that emotional by nature, for instance a Bach Sinfonia?


When I read this, my brain yelled in excitement. "YEEEEESSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS!"

GET WRAPPED UP IN YOUR PERFORMANCE!!! They enjoyment people get is from witnessing somebody expressing in the most pure and REAL way possible!

I think the ability to really get wrapped up in your playing.. is what so many people strive to copy.
LOSE YOURSELF IN THE MUSIC PLEEEEASE! GO BLANK!

When I see people doing this, I get the same feeling as watching a baby giggle or cry. REAL, BEAUTIFUL, EMOTION.

It's fantastic. I'm excited just thinking about you performing!
_________________________
... such a vital organ

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#1467430 - 07/03/10 06:06 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: keyboardklutz]
hippymusicman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 150
Originally Posted By: keyboardklutz
Originally Posted By: eweiss
HM ... the more you write, the more I like you!
Don't mistake ego incontinence for genius - you've done it before.


I believe the reason some people believe how I act is 'full of ego' is because something that I've said clashes with their beliefs, and their own ego wishes to 'prove wrong' my belief because it feels threatened. I assure you I do not feel different above or below anybody. I understand I have beliefs, you have beliefs. There is no 'right'.

The fact that you think I have an ego, suggests that you think I am acting 'above' you. Which suggests you are ranking my beliefs on a big value scale. My beliefs aren't above you or below you at all. Because my beliefs have nothing to do with you. They are just my belief. However, I believe the thing ranking me above or below you is your threatened ego.

But none the less, I don't mind if someone wants to think that about me, I just don't believe it to be true.
_________________________
... such a vital organ

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#1467438 - 07/03/10 06:29 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: hippymusicman]
Elissa Milne Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 1337
Loc: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Originally Posted By: hippymusicman
Originally Posted By: Elissa Milne
hippymusicman, this whole thread is dedicated to you explaining what makes you a better musician than other people!!! Unless I'm horribly mistaken your opening thread sought to explain what it is about you that makes other people call you a genius, and you were seeking to elucidate others as to how they also could attain the label of 'genius'. Am I horribly mistaken?!


I want people to attempt to attain the label 'genius' so they can understand that the word really means nothing, labels mean nothing, ranking systems mean nothing. There is no need for any use of the phrases 'better' 'musical genius' 'great musicians' besides trying to fulfill something inside of you.

Labels do not fill the inner holes..
they fill the external holes for a moment, in the same way buying a new car fills external holes. The next week, the feeling is gone and suddenly your mind is on the next thing..
Mmm, that's a big ask. Do you genuinely request that 'people attempt to attain the label 'genius' so they can understand that the word really means nothing'??? There really are easier ways for people to come by this knowledge, and I suspect that exhorting the readers of *this* forum to attempt to become musical geniuses for the purpose of revealing to themselves the futility of the label is a wildly misguided effort: not many people here think too much of such labels IN THE FIRST PLACE!!! Teachers see students with crazy-inflated ideas of their genius year-in, year-out! Or more accurately, teachers see parents with crazy-inflated ideas of their children's genius year-in, year-out!!!

Teachers are already over the idea of genius well and truly and put no faith in such labels. As you will have already noted, many people in this forum and in the Pianist's Corner forum made mention of the fact that someone calling you a genius says more about their ignorance than about your expertise.

This [Piano Teachers Forum] is a demographic who don't need saving from this linguistic misconception.
_________________________
Teacher, Composer, Writer, Speaker
Working with Hal Leonard, Alfred, Faber, and Australian Music Examination Board
Music in syllabuses by ABRSM, AMEB, Trinity Guildhall, ANZCA, NZMEB, and more
www.elissamilne.wordpress.com

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#1467454 - 07/03/10 07:14 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: hippymusicman]
Elissa Milne Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/11/10
Posts: 1337
Loc: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Originally Posted By: hippymusicman
Originally Posted By: keyboardklutz
Originally Posted By: eweiss
HM ... the more you write, the more I like you!
Don't mistake ego incontinence for genius - you've done it before.


I believe the reason some people believe how I act is 'full of ego' is because something that I've said clashes with their beliefs, and their own ego wishes to 'prove wrong' my belief because it feels threatened. I assure you I do not feel different above or below anybody. I understand I have beliefs, you have beliefs. There is no 'right'.

The fact that you think I have an ego, suggests that you think I am acting 'above' you. Which suggests you are ranking my beliefs on a big value scale. My beliefs aren't above you or below you at all. Because my beliefs have nothing to do with you. They are just my belief. However, I believe the thing ranking me above or below you is your threatened ego.

But none the less, I don't mind if someone wants to think that about me, I just don't believe it to be true.
hippymusicman, I entirely agree that your post is not about 'ego', but from my 42-year-old perspective I think your post is a lot about being 22 [Gen Y, whatever]!!! It's also a little bit to do with not having a wide-enough view of what it means when people tell you that you are a genius - they are trying to pay you a big compliment! They are not trying to say you should join MENSA, they simply want to let you know they are totally impressed with what you can do. It's not something to have an existential crisis about.
_________________________
Teacher, Composer, Writer, Speaker
Working with Hal Leonard, Alfred, Faber, and Australian Music Examination Board
Music in syllabuses by ABRSM, AMEB, Trinity Guildhall, ANZCA, NZMEB, and more
www.elissamilne.wordpress.com

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#1467530 - 07/03/10 11:20 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: Elissa Milne]
hippymusicman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 150
Originally Posted By: Elissa Milne
hippymusicman, I entirely agree that your post is not about 'ego', but from my 42-year-old perspective I think your post is a lot about being 22 [Gen Y, whatever]!!! It's also a little bit to do with not having a wide-enough view of what it means when people tell you that you are a genius - they are trying to pay you a big compliment! They are not trying to say you should join MENSA, they simply want to let you know they are totally impressed with what you can do. It's not something to have an existential crisis about.


I don't mean to come across as someone who is trying to 'save' you. But I do wish to share my beliefs because most responses to my beliefs helps to change or solidify them.

Your responses in particular I have found to be very stimulating.

I believe the ego is speaking when there is any intent to separate one being from another. This is not an attack, but I believe your post did this. It is not an existential crisis. It happens all the time with just about everyone.

I believe the reason your ego spoke is because our beliefs clash.. The interesting thing is watching the ego tactics on how it will try to dismiss the opposing belief. It doesn't want to even accept the possibility that my belief may be agreeable and because of that we have lost normal discussion on it. Your post was not in the mood to discuss. It was stamping your belief with back up from your ego. In this case the ego's tactic was 'age'.

What if I now told you right now that I was lying about my age and I was actually 60.. Or what if I never told you my age in the first place... would we be discussing it properly then? my point is age shouldn't change anything. It's an instinctive ego defense tactic. Once again, this happens all the time with just about everyone.

If there's no more separation, then we can continue to discuss my proposed idea and learn something from it. Even if the thing we learn is that my idea is absolute rubbish. The only way to learn that is to discuss it, not stamp it out.

I do understand that when someone says I'm a genius they are trying to pay me a big compliment, which is an attempt to make me feel good. This compliment does not make me feel any better than I already feel. Because A) I feel fine.. B) I consider the label meaningless and would simply ask for a definition.. and C) The reason they are giving a compliment is to be 'nice'. It is external and in a sense 'shallow'.

Imagine telling a blind person they look beautiful. The response might be "what makes a person say such things?" That is how I feel when someone calls me names like 'genius'.. Or 'attractive' for that matter. "that's not needed here because I don't feel down about it in the first place... but I'm curious as to why you want to say it"
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... such a vital organ

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#1467534 - 07/03/10 11:28 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: hippymusicman]
Wizard of Oz Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/12/09
Posts: 873
hippy, forget all this ego talk. What do you want to do musically? Ask yourself that, find musicians who you want to emulate and learn from, and start practicing.

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#1467536 - 07/03/10 11:33 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: Elissa Milne]
hippymusicman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 150
Originally Posted By: Elissa Milne
Teachers are already over the idea of genius well and truly and put no faith in such labels. As you will have already noted, many people in this forum and in the Pianist's Corner forum made mention of the fact that someone calling you a genius says more about their ignorance than about your expertise.

This [Piano Teachers Forum] is a demographic who don't need saving from this linguistic misconception.


Sorry that was so long, but here's one more topic I think you can help me with.

Most people on piano world, I've noticed have many labels in their 'signature'. Songs they can play job title etc.

I'd like to understand more clearly why people feel the need to use these labels, while steering clear of other labels like 'genius'.
_________________________
... such a vital organ

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#1467537 - 07/03/10 11:36 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: Wizard of Oz]
hippymusicman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 150
Originally Posted By: Wizard of Oz
hippy, forget all this ego talk. What do you want to do musically? Ask yourself that, find musicians who you want to emulate and learn from, and start practicing.


I don't want anything more than what I have.
I'm done!
The need to get things from music has vanished.
I now want to give things to music.
_________________________
... such a vital organ

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#1467538 - 07/03/10 11:43 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: hippymusicman]
Wizard of Oz Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/12/09
Posts: 873
hippy, to call yourself a genius in music or anything would show just how egotistical you are.

Keith Jarrett, who is one I would actually put the label "genius" or "master" is a pompous, arrogant self-deluded person. Witness this, his insults to his own paying audience:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BB9mMABRM0c&translated=1

Chick Corea or Herbie Hancock, 2 other true "geniuses" show no such attitude. They are much more humble.

Shows that being a "genius" isn't the only thing that matters.


Why are you so concerned about "ego" and such. Just play the music.

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#1467542 - 07/03/10 11:47 AM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: Wizard of Oz]
Wizard of Oz Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/12/09
Posts: 873
hippy...aka the "musical genius"...you are hilarious!! you're a pretty funny kid, given me lots of laughs. I don't think I've learned a shred of musical knowledge from your posts, but keep it up man.

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#1467553 - 07/03/10 12:02 PM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: Wizard of Oz]
hippymusicman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 150
Originally Posted By: Wizard of Oz
hippy...aka the "musical genius"...you are hilarious!! you're a pretty funny kid, given me lots of laughs. I don't think I've learned a shred of musical knowledge from your posts, but keep it up man.


Thanks! So long as there's laughter, I'll be smiling. grin

I'm sorry you haven't learned anything from my posts.

I can share my beliefs on your situation if you want to tell me your situation. That doesn't guarantee any learning, but since you seem keen to learn, I will try for you.
_________________________
... such a vital organ

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#1467555 - 07/03/10 12:07 PM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: Wizard of Oz]
hippymusicman Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 150
Originally Posted By: Wizard of Oz
hippy, to call yourself a genius in music or anything would show just how egotistical you are.


I 'll explain again. "Musical genius" is a label that means nothing. e.g. A baby can call me a musical genius. It therefor has no merit. Musical genius = not important/nothing.
_________________________
... such a vital organ

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#1467559 - 07/03/10 12:16 PM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: hippymusicman]
Wizard of Oz Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/12/09
Posts: 873
If it's not important then why did you put that label on your signature. Kind of contradicts what you are talking about. Unless of course you want people to perceive you as a "musical genius".

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#1467560 - 07/03/10 12:17 PM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: hippymusicman]
Wizard of Oz Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/12/09
Posts: 873
Originally Posted By: hippymusicman


I can share my beliefs on your situation if you want to tell me your situation. That doesn't guarantee any learning, but since you seem keen to learn, I will try for you.


Share your beliefs on my situation? What in God's name are you talking about? Man, you are a weird one.

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#1467569 - 07/03/10 12:24 PM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: hippymusicman]
rocket88 Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/04/06
Posts: 3189
Originally Posted By: hippymusicman

I 'll explain again. "Musical genius" is a label that means nothing.


Thanks for this info...Silly me, I always thought that words actually do describe and indicate things.
_________________________
Music teacher and piano player.

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#1467590 - 07/03/10 01:05 PM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: hippymusicman]
keystring Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/07
Posts: 11848
Loc: Canada
There is so much here. Going from one thing to the next:

Quote:
I want people to attempt to attain the label 'genius' so they can understand that the word really means nothing, labels mean nothing, ranking systems mean nothing.


Food for thought:
In a forum (PW) where people gather because they are serious about music, it is likely that some of those people have a calling to music and also a certain natural talent. In the teacher forum, certainly there will be people calling themselves teachers who maybe should wait to be doing so or ought to pursue something else. But there will definitely be people who had a great deal of natural talent and that this calling brought them to where they are today. What I am saying is that at least some of those here have at one time or another been called geniuses or similar, and the average person has been in awe of them. That is the (*mixed*) audience that you are addressing.

You have encountered a certain world in the high school where you are teaching. There are sad attitudes that kill music. They actually cut students off from music; they create a disconnection and barrier. The kids are taught stiff things. They are also induced to study through prizes (grades) and competition with one another - all of which rightly appalls you - and that again shuts them off. If you are studying for grades you are no longer interested in the subject. You, having a natural connection to music, can see that there is more and want to change things. That would explain what you have posted, in part.

This world that you have encountered is not the whole world. Not everyone thinks that way. Those who are teachers here probably have a wider vision - You must make room in your mind that there are a great many ways that people relate to music and think about music. Some of the men and women in this forum have spent 30 or 40 years pursuing it, and we also don't know what those who teach are doing with their students. At least some of those people may have been where you are now, and gone further. Others may be merely mechanics who memorized some physical principles and intellectual facts that will produce some kind of results.

For the kids in high school that you are teaching, it is good that they are being brought past that bland non-vision one sees. If they can form that connection to music and what is in them, at least some of them will go on to learn who knows what, who knows where - at least there has been a start. The worst thing that I saw were some neighbourhood kids, age 7, from the school's "music" program, playing a memorized sequence of finger numbers or recorder so that their parents could recognize a "song" --- if that music-killer can be avoided, all the better!

Do not stop your own growth and your own seeking. You are only at the beginning. You have already seen the edge of something else: people who hear the music they read (or write) with written notation. Keep your eye & ear open for people with knowledge & experience who also seem musically connected, from whom you can learn things, and be open minded toward what they might reveal, and how they reveal them. It can be from angles you do not expect.

I am an adult student. I've experienced things similar to that label, and like you, music, different instruments, etc. come easily to me. I wasted decades doing only what I could find and do myself. Life happens, and sometimes you don't know there is a road in order to embark on it. What is out there, and what some people know and are connected to, is humbling. That is why you don't see the strong musicians brag much; they have seen just how big it is, and how little they know, even though what they know is incredibly much.

As you learn more from here and there, you will probably find that formal things you learn are connected to what you already have inside you as an instinctive knowledge. It fleshes it out, adds to it - gives 'aha's'. You will probably also find that dry meaningless things in "theory" actually refer to something richer that you can dig out. That knowledge is not only in classical music; by ear players also have a ton of theory behind what they do.

What I have found in my own journey of these few years is that there are sides to music I had not been aware of. You are deaf until you become aware of a thing and start listening for it, and then you hear it everywhere! The trouble is that there are also 'experts' using big words --- they do know a lot (of facts) --- who just offer empty or confusing things. But there is a lot to discover, and everything you discover will go back to what you can put into your playing and your composing, and what you teach.

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#1467599 - 07/03/10 01:17 PM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: keystring]
Ejay Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/24/09
Posts: 216
Loc: U.K.
Ruben your posts get more and more entertaining.
Are you studying psychology ?

The label thing in my signature.
Well in some ways it can be embarrassing. While completing Alfred's Adult book 1 is an achievement for me, it must seem rather silly to the pianists and teachers here, but it is a marker for me.
The same with the pieces I am working on; they are there to mark where I am, and an incentive to keep practising or people will notice if the signature never changes.

So it is making me accountable for my practice.
_________________________
Music was my refuge. I could crawl into the space between the notes and curl my back to loneliness.
Maya Angelou


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#1467617 - 07/03/10 01:42 PM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: Wizard of Oz]
danshure Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/29/10
Posts: 347
Loc: Massachusetts
Originally Posted By: Wizard of Oz
hippy, to call yourself a genius in music or anything would show just how egotistical you are.

Keith Jarrett, who is one I would actually put the label "genius" or "master" is a pompous, arrogant self-deluded person.

Chick Corea or Herbie Hancock, 2 other true "geniuses" show no such attitude. They are much more humble.

Keith Jarrett is not egotistical, he is misunderstood and taken out of context.

Chick and Herbie are great but not anywhere near the level of Keith.


Edited by danshure (07/03/10 01:43 PM)
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#1467634 - 07/03/10 02:27 PM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: danshure]
Wizard of Oz Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/12/09
Posts: 873
Originally Posted By: danshure

Keith Jarrett is not egotistical, he is misunderstood and taken out of context.

Chick and Herbie are great but not anywhere near the level of Keith.



Jarrett is an egomaniac of the highest sort. Have you ever been to his concert where he admonishes the audience for coughing, or stops playing mid-song to wait for people to be quiet.

Chick and Herbie are both as good as Keith, yet their styles are totally different from his.

Perhaps it's your preference to a certain jazz that leans your bias towards KJ.

Jarrett is the master of ballads and solo improv ala Koln. But try getting him to play Herbie's Maiden Voyage or Dolphin Dance, or Chick's Spain.

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#1467672 - 07/03/10 03:40 PM Re: Musical Genius - HOW TO BE ONE [Re: keystring]
Ben Crosland Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/11/10
Posts: 421
Loc: Worcester, UK
Originally Posted By: keystring
They are also induced to study through prizes (grades) and competition with one another - all of which rightly appalls you - and that again shuts them off. If you are studying for grades you are no longer interested in the subject. You, having a natural connection to music, can see that there is more and want to change things.


The thing is, as anyone who has taught more than a handful of students will know, this kind of statement should really come with a "for some of the people" disclaimer. Some students thrive outside of the grading system, whereas others are really motivated by it. All students are individuals, and one of the most important skills a teacher can learn is how to develop the necessary flexibility to be able to inspire as wide a range of personalities and abilities as possible.
_________________________
Teacher, Composer, Sound Designer

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