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#1465302 - 06/29/10 09:08 PM Quality of Kurtzman
Joshua Sweeny Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/19/10
Posts: 15
Loc: Pittsburgh
I am wondering where this piano stands as far as quality. It is a 5' Kurtzman sn# 97690 and I do not know how to find out about this kind of stuff even though I have the serial number. From what I am told it is from the 30's i believe 34 or maybe 36? Where would I find info like this. I know it isn't a Steinway but is this a cheap piano or a good one? I posted this a few hours ago and I forgot to post the brand cause I am an air head. Thanks for your time.

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#1465329 - 06/29/10 10:09 PM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: Joshua Sweeny]
Eric Gloo Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/28/01
Posts: 1298
Loc: Richfield Springs, New York
The Pierce Piano Atlas puts the year of manufacture at either 1934 or 1935. This is interesting, because Wurlitzer used the Kurtzmann name from 1935 to 1938. So, you may have a Wurtlizer grand, not a Kurtzmann grand.

The grands I've seen from Kurtzmann have been well built. The Wurlitzer grands...not so great. At 5', my guess is it's a Wurlitzer. The only way to be sure is to have a technician check it for you...or post some photos here of the case and plate...that might help, too.


Edited by Eric Gloo (06/29/10 10:12 PM)
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Eric Gloo
Piano Technician
Certified Dampp-Chaser Installer
Richfield Springs, New York

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#1465358 - 06/29/10 11:06 PM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: Eric Gloo]
Joshua Sweeny Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/19/10
Posts: 15
Loc: Pittsburgh
Everything says Kurtzman. The metal plate inside says C Kurtzman co est 1848 and then another part of the metal says 'Kurtzman improved capo d'astro bar' if that helps?

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#1465364 - 06/29/10 11:21 PM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: Joshua Sweeny]
Joshua Sweeny Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/19/10
Posts: 15
Loc: Pittsburgh
how does one upload pics to this forum?

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#1465366 - 06/29/10 11:23 PM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: Joshua Sweeny]
pianobroker Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 4309
Loc: North Hollywood CA.
The original C. Kurtzman baby grand was a cosmetic copy of the Steinway S (5'1"). They also made a copy of the Steinway M and O. Structurally it was a better than average vintage American piano though a high comprehensive,high end,high $ dollar restoration would probably exceed it's realistic appraised or fair martket value.
"If you pay for the restoration I'll give you the piano free of charge". wink


Edited by pianobroker (06/29/10 11:23 PM)
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#1465376 - 06/29/10 11:32 PM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: pianobroker]
BDB Offline
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 22706
Loc: Oakland
This could not be a copy of a Steinway S, because they were not made until 1935.
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#1465404 - 06/30/10 12:10 AM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: BDB]
Joshua Sweeny Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/19/10
Posts: 15
Loc: Pittsburgh
Here are the pictures. it is very dirty and the cabinet needs to be refinished but that is for another day. The sound board is in good condition and the tuning pins all stable. http://gallery.me.com/sudarshana1#100153

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#1465407 - 06/30/10 12:14 AM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: Joshua Sweeny]
Nate Smith Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/08/10
Posts: 34
Loc: Dallas, Texas, North Oak Cliff
Originally Posted By: Joshua Sweeny
how does one upload pics to this forum?


Just go to imageshack.us & upload images there. Then post the links to those images here.
_________________________
Nate Smith
Smith Piano Servicing
Certified Dampp-Chaser Life Saver Installer

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#1465412 - 06/30/10 12:29 AM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: Nate Smith]
Joshua Sweeny Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/19/10
Posts: 15
Loc: Pittsburgh
I already uploaded, see my last post! I am just tired today and being stupid.


Edited by Joshua Sweeny (06/30/10 12:29 AM)

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#1465457 - 06/30/10 02:50 AM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: BDB]
pianobroker Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/14/07
Posts: 4309
Loc: North Hollywood CA.
Oh thats right! The Steinway S was a copy of the Kurtzman! grin The case design of the Kurtzman was the same as a Steinway M which came about in 1912. The Steinway S was identical case wise as a Steinway M except 5'1" so... technically it was a copy of the Steinway S even though the S didn't exist yet. Now if one wants to get technical the Steinway S was modeled after the Steinert baby grand which were (Steinert) the most notable copys of Steinway.
_________________________
www.pastperfectpiano.com
Largest selection in the USA
100+Steinway and M&H grands
Warehouse showroom Onsite Restoration
Preowned & Restored
Hailun dlr.818-255-3145
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_z8RvhXGKzY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Voo0zumHGgE

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#1465613 - 06/30/10 10:58 AM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: pianobroker]
Joshua Sweeny Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/19/10
Posts: 15
Loc: Pittsburgh
So back to the original topic. Is this a good quality piano. I posted pics of the inside. The piano is dirty but plays wonderfully. The action is all very well intact. Serial Number 97690 C. Kurtzman Co and here is the link for pics http://gallery.me.com/sudarshana1#100153 I am very intersted to know if this is something I should invest in. My cousin is a carpenter who does some beautiful work and has owned his high shop in pittsburgh for over a decade. He has never refinished a piano but said he did some research and if I take the action out he can refinish the cabinet for $1000 if I help him out with some photography..... so is this a good deal. Other quotes I received for refinishing the cabinet were around 5k. I want to know where this brand stands as far as quality? I know that 1k$ is not much for refinishing but it is a lot for me and I do not want to invest anything in it if it is a cheap model!!!
thanks again for your time.


Edited by Joshua Sweeny (06/30/10 10:59 AM)

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#1465642 - 06/30/10 11:37 AM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: Joshua Sweeny]
Silverwood Pianos Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 4263
Loc: Vancouver B. C. Canada
Originally Posted By: Joshua Sweeny
I am very interested to know if this is something I should invest in. My cousin is a carpenter who does some beautiful work and has owned his high shop in Pittsburgh for over a decade. He has never refinished a piano but said he did some research and if I take the action out he can refinish the cabinet for $1000 if I help him out with some photography..... so is this a good deal. Other quotes I received for refinishing the cabinet were around 5k.


While 1000 dollars is a very good price for doing a solid colour finish, after viewing the photos supplied, the cabinet is not where I would be dropping that kind of funding.
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www.silverwoodpianos.com
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"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."

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#1465651 - 06/30/10 11:44 AM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: Silverwood Pianos]
Joshua Sweeny Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/19/10
Posts: 15
Loc: Pittsburgh
where would you be dropping the funding then. The photos aren't really good since they were taken at night and the inside of the piano is covered by a layer of dust that I will be removing this evening.

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#1465667 - 06/30/10 12:18 PM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: Joshua Sweeny]
Silverwood Pianos Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/10/08
Posts: 4263
Loc: Vancouver B. C. Canada


Originally Posted By: Joshua Sweeny
where would you be dropping the funding then. The photos aren't really good since they were taken at night and the inside of the piano is covered by a layer of dust that I will be removing this evening.


The photos are fine. They show enough of the inside of the instrument. Now if you can view all of the dirt and dust on top of the plate and strings, it is a sure bet that the interior of the action/keyboard will look much the same. Once you have cleaned off the plate and string area, you will be able to see better what you have.

Same goes for the action/keyboard, which you will most likely have to contract someone to dismantle, clean out, and set up, either with new paper and felt, or with the original parts.

Similar to restoring vintage cars, the paint job is the last thing dealt with. The mechanics of making it function properly is where you start.
_________________________
Dan Silverwood
www.silverwoodpianos.com
http://silverwoodpianos.blogspot.com/
http://www.facebook.com/SilverwoodPianosDotCom
"If you think it's expensive to hire a professional to do the job, wait until you hire an amateur."

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#1465678 - 06/30/10 12:36 PM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: Silverwood Pianos]
Joshua Sweeny Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/19/10
Posts: 15
Loc: Pittsburgh
Cool, thanks. I am gonna clean it myself. I work with a guy who is the accompanist at my restaurant. He has played there for over 25 years and said he will come by to help me pull out the action and clean it and he will look it over to see if it is in good shape. I am assuming it is though since all the keys have the same weight to them and everything functions correctly. Then again, this could be me just not knowing what things should be doing if they are in proper working order!

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#1465699 - 06/30/10 01:04 PM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: Joshua Sweeny]
charleslang Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/13/08
Posts: 2084
I would think this would be a good grand for a hobbyist to learn something about restoring pianos and have some fun. There are lots of worse old pianos out there; this one is a good brand and the keytops even look to be in good shape. You might be able to get some fun and even some musicality out of it without doing a full restoration.
_________________________
Charles Lang

Baldwin Model R; Hardman 5'9" grand; Rieger-Kloss vertical

Jazz, pop and classical

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#1465714 - 06/30/10 01:23 PM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: charleslang]
Joshua Sweeny Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 05/19/10
Posts: 15
Loc: Pittsburgh
The key tops are actually in perfect shape. I cleaned them with milk and they came alive. They were unreasonable dirty and now they show only the slightest yellow tint which is nice. Someone told me to try using toothpaste to brighten them but I think that sounds dangerous!?! I was told to put toothpaste on zits when I was 15 and that was just stupid.... I am assuming it is the same line of thought.

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#1466130 - 07/01/10 02:45 AM Re: Quality of Kurtzman [Re: Joshua Sweeny]
Nate Smith Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/08/10
Posts: 34
Loc: Dallas, Texas, North Oak Cliff
Joshua -

Try using some ivory dishsoap solution with water on a washrag to clean your white keys. Make sure it's a pretty watery solution - more water than soap.

Nathan
_________________________
Nate Smith
Smith Piano Servicing
Certified Dampp-Chaser Life Saver Installer

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