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#1481246 - 07/25/10 04:03 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Jeff Kallberg]
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1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 12/26/07
Posts: 1274
Loc: the holographic universe
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It's real. The manuscript, for a long time held in a private collection, recently (25 November 2008) came up for auction by Christie's Paris; there it was identified as formerly in the collection of Minka Strauss. Can you imagine having the chance to invest in such a thing? This manuscript was even sort of affordable! The only trouble is that I would never sell it so I'd never realize any appreciation. I notice that on the Christie's page, the French translation of Chopin's description of Marquis, in a letter to his family, refers to his coat as "blond" rather than "blanc." I'll have to look on the site that has all his letters in the original languages and see what he wrote originally. At least it's nice to know that as bad as 1846 must have been at Nohant, there were still some bright spots for Marquis' friend. Elene
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#1481275 - 07/25/10 05:03 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Mark_C]
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Full Member
Registered: 09/11/09
Posts: 177
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Thank you, Dr. Jeff!!!
I was hoping you'd help us out on this, but didn't want to impose on you by addressing the post to you.
Can you tell us anything about the history or story of the piece? Like, why would the mature Chopin have written such a piece? Was it perhaps for some occasion?
By the way.....that blip of the manuscript enabled me to see whether the two slurs (present in the copy that I obtained online) are authentic. They're not (or at least the first one isn't.....the second passage doesn't appear on there, but I assume it's like the first). Dear Mark, I don't think anything concrete is known about the origins of the piece, so all we can do is speculate. Jeff Kallberg
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#1481459 - 07/25/10 10:23 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Jeff Kallberg]
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1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 12/26/07
Posts: 1274
Loc: the holographic universe
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BTW I can't remember if there were any pup puppets among the ones left at Nohant. I still have a postcard that shows some of them.
Elene
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#1484335 - 07/30/10 02:08 AM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Elene]
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1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 12/26/07
Posts: 1274
Loc: the holographic universe
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My daughter and I have our plane tickets for October, and we're booked at hotels in Warsaw and Paris (Hotel Chopin in Paris, where else). Now we just have to figure out everything in between.
Elene
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#1484475 - 07/30/10 09:18 AM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: ChopinAddict]
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2000 Post Club Member
Registered: 12/12/05
Posts: 2889
Loc: Florida
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Very lucky you!  Is Warsaw the only place you will be in Poland? You won't travel around Poland? at least to Zelazowa Wola? Wish I could go too.
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#1484494 - 07/30/10 09:48 AM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: LisztAddict]
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500 Post Club Member
Registered: 11/19/09
Posts: 953
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Not sure if this has posted but here's a recording I found on the net of Chopin's Nocturne 9/2 with added cadenza's: http://www.chopinproject.com/2009/06/02/nocturne-in-e-flat-op-9-no-2-wadditional-cadenzas/I like, especially the descending chromatic sixth's. (or thirds? someone correct me if I'm wrong) It would be fun exercise to add your own cadenzas to classics like these, and apparently this one was suggestion penciled in by Chopin on one of his pupil's scores.
Edited by Rui725 (07/30/10 09:57 AM)
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#1484652 - 07/30/10 01:27 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Rui725]
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1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 12/26/07
Posts: 1274
Loc: the holographic universe
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There's a Brazilian pianist, Ricardo Castro, who has also recorded 9/2 this way. I'm not sure, without going all through both, whether they're exactly the same. I like the idea of improvising on these pieces, which I am not really able to do, in addition to trying variations Chopin himself suggested. I think adding one's own creative thoughts is very much in the spirit of Chopin's work. It's just that so few of us have ideas that are as good... I sure don't....
LA, we will no doubt go to Zelazowa Wola. We plan to go to Krakow and Prague, then to Paris. The question now is, since we have to go across Germany, where we should stop in that country.
Elene
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#1484839 - 07/30/10 06:57 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Elene]
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Full Member
Registered: 07/29/10
Posts: 166
Loc: New Brunswick, Canada
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I'm going to see Valentina Lisista's first Chopin recital in Montreal on Monday, which is part of the Féstival de Lanaudière. She is to perform the Op. 73 Rondo in C major for two pianos with her husband, all of the Op. 10 and 25 études, Ballade Op. 38 no. 2 in F major, Fantasie Op. 49 in f minor, Scherzo Op. 54 no. 4 in E major and the Variations on "La cì darem la mano" Op. 2. I am bringing my copy of the Op. 10 and 25 études with me to follow along and, hopefully, to obtain an autograph.
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#1485560 - 07/31/10 11:34 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Steve712]
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2000 Post Club Member
Registered: 12/12/05
Posts: 2889
Loc: Florida
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#1486052 - 08/01/10 05:33 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Rui725]
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Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 14773
Loc: New York
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....It would be fun exercise to add your own cadenzas to classics like these.... I did that with this piece.  I had gotten a little tired of the piece 'as is' so I started fooling around with it. And then I played it as an encore at a recital, making a little joke out of it. I brought an empty Perrier bottle with a music score inside, signed by "Fred" (I showed it to the audience). I said it had washed up on the shore of the Hudson River that morning and I would now play the premiere of this newly-discovered version.  People liked the cadenzas but I think they liked the joke more. 
_________________________
"Everything I say is my opinion, including the facts." :-)
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#1486340 - 08/02/10 03:18 AM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Mark_C]
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1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 12/26/07
Posts: 1274
Loc: the holographic universe
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Mark, was that 9/2 you "fooled around with" too?
(He was Fryc, not Fred, of course....)
LA, is that the room where they did that week-long broadcast in February-March?
Elene
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#1486423 - 08/02/10 08:31 AM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Elene]
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5000 Post Club Member
Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5310
Loc: SC Mountains
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That's the room in the Polish embassy in DC where they had a rather lackluster catered Chinese buffet after the performance of Monsieur Chopin that Kathleen and I were lucky enough to attend. The performance (and Paderewski's sad old piano) were in an adjoining room.
_________________________
Slow down and do it right.
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#1486547 - 08/02/10 12:02 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: -Frycek]
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1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 12/26/07
Posts: 1274
Loc: the holographic universe
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I'll be darned. How did you end up playing in the Polish embassy, LA?
I haven't been there, but as I mentioned before, I did run into the members of the Polish Chamber of Commerce at the Biblioteka Polska in Paris. They were having some kind of reception when my husband and I visited.
(I hope they are better than the US Chamber of Commerce, which is becoming more and more of a loony fringe group, climate-change deniers and so forth. But that's a whole other subject.)
A Chinese buffet-- interesting. Perhaps the favorite of someone in charge, or the caterer was someone's friend or relative, or everyone was sick of pierogi?
And I wonder if the Paderewski piano was the one (a small upright) that has toured with the famous Steinways (Horowitz's and Cliburn's). If so, I've played it.
Funny how we get these various vague connections.
Elene
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#1486576 - 08/02/10 12:42 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: LisztAddict]
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5000 Post Club Member
Registered: 08/06/05
Posts: 5310
Loc: SC Mountains
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Yes, how did you end up there????? We want ALL the details.
I'm very glad the piano has been worked on. When I got to try it after Monsieur Chopin the action was very wobbly and sluggish.
_________________________
Slow down and do it right.
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#1486895 - 08/02/10 08:59 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Elene]
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4000 Post Club Member
Registered: 08/29/09
Posts: 4707
Loc: Land of the never-ending music
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Mark, was that 9/2 you "fooled around with" too?
(He was Fryc, not Fred, of course....)
Elene Ah, but I did call my piano Fred in honour of Fryc...
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#1488408 - 08/04/10 11:32 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: -Frycek]
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Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member
Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 14773
Loc: New York
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We were wondering on Pianist Corner if any of y'all know about this! (about Chopin's voice)
_________________________
"Everything I say is my opinion, including the facts." :-)
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#1490680 - 08/08/10 03:37 AM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Mark_C]
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1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 12/26/07
Posts: 1274
Loc: the holographic universe
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http://www.newyorker.com/arts/critics/musical/2010/08/09/100809crmu_music_ross?currentPage=1Someone alerted me to this NY Times article about new recordings of Chopin, Larcher, and Bach. The reviewer says some cogent stuff about how challenging it is to make a piano sound like it's singing, and says that Stephen Hough manages this particularly well in the album "Chopin: Late Masterpieces." He is much less impressed with Yundi on the Nocturnes. I haven't heard either yet so I know nothing. Elene
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#1498282 - 08/17/10 11:37 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Elene]
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1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 12/26/07
Posts: 1274
Loc: the holographic universe
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Here is my just-finished recording of the song "Melodia." It will have to be OK. http://www.box.net/shared/uod1se0agrElene
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#1498784 - 08/18/10 05:05 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Elene]
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4000 Post Club Member
Registered: 08/29/09
Posts: 4707
Loc: Land of the never-ending music
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Ever heard of this ? I searched here, but couldn't find it mentioned. (Sorry if it has already been mentioned...)
_________________________
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#1499260 - 08/19/10 01:05 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: loveschopintoomuch]
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Full Member
Registered: 04/17/08
Posts: 32
Loc: Canada
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Wow...You are terrific. I am going to go through these links one by one.
Janet
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#1499395 - 08/19/10 05:01 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: keyboardklutz]
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Full Member
Registered: 09/11/09
Posts: 177
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Folks, anybody seen the autograph of op 69 no 1? I'm interested in knowing if there's any pedaling. The Alfred (Willard A. Palmer) edition says it's from the manuscript - anybody got that? Or any other authoritative version that would indicate what pedalings the manuscript contains? keyboardklutz: As is often the case with the waltzes, there are three extant manuscripts of the A-flat major Waltz (op 69 no 1 in Fontana's numbering - a numbering, btw, that recent editors seem to want to stop using). Moreover, there are 5 manuscript copies of the piece, by different people, careful study of which suggests that there must have been at least one more autograph manuscript in existence at some point. The pedaling varies from manuscript to manuscript. Without question the best edition to see the various pedalings (as well as the very many melodic and harmonic variants) is the recent edition by Christophe Grabowski, which is a volume in The Complete Chopin, published in 2006 by Peters London (not Peters Leipzig). Jeff Kallberg
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#1499882 - 08/20/10 12:35 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: -Frycek]
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1000 Post Club Member
Registered: 12/26/07
Posts: 1274
Loc: the holographic universe
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Cholera jasna, we have his heart and his hair and now maybe his teeth?? I did get to go through ChopinAddicts link a little bit, but there is so much more at that site, which no, I hadn't seen before. One of the items there is this blog post: http://justlistentoit.com/2010/08/18/chopin-and-the-sins-i-had-not-committed/which contains gems of writing such as: "My parents brought me up with typical British reserve; wearing your heart on your sleeve or even carrying it anywhere about your person really wasn’t the done thing." and "If a heart does have strings, mine aren’t plucked but are attached to hammers, keys, pedals and a steel frame," which might have been exactly what Chopin would have said if he had thought of it (and if he'd been fluent in English at the time). Elene
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#1505547 - 08/29/10 08:37 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: Elene]
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Full Member
Registered: 03/29/10
Posts: 67
Loc: southeastern USA
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A friend, knowing how much I love Chopin, sent me the link to this article where David Dubal interprets the 24 Preludes. Not much interpretation, actually. But he ends with this: "Probably more people have come to great music through Chopin than from any other composer. In my case, growing up in Cleveland, I used to listen to a radio show whose theme music entranced me at first hearing but was never identified by the host. Although the show aired much past my usual bedtime, I would occasionally sneak down the stairs, turn the radio on at low volume and drink in the strains of this music, over so quickly that I listened with all my might. It was not until somewhat later, when I was taking piano lessons, that I found out that it was No. 7, the Prelude in A Major. Not too long after that I could play it myself, which was bliss! Only later did I find out that there were 23 more Preludes that I would love equally, and in later years would come to study and teach." "Chopin's Small Miracles" http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703447004575449732019362448.html
_________________________
"That nice good-natured Chopin played for us a while. What a charming genius!" Delacroix
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#1507838 - 09/02/10 02:07 PM
Re: Just for those totally devoted to Chopin
[Re: loveschopintoomuch]
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4000 Post Club Member
Registered: 04/05/06
Posts: 4668
Loc: Illinois
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Hello Everyone! I have been away much too long, and I apologize. I've felt that I had nothing to contribute that could compare to what you all have been posting. Thank you so much for keeping our "hero" just where he belongs...front and center.
Last night I recorded a brief documentary of the Cliburn competition of 2009. There was a tie for first place. One of the winners of the gold was a young man from Japan, who was blind. As so many have said, he is truly a miracle. But, as magnificiently as he could play, not withstanding his lack of sight, I believe it was his interpretation of Chopin's Concerto in E m that brought him the prize. And I think he chose that concerto to prove to the world that one doesn't have to hammer away at a Rachmaninoff concerto to show true talent and genius at the piano. Even one of the judges confessed that he had to control himself not to sob openly during Nobuyuki's performance. So many in the audience (myself included by just watching) thought our hearts would break by his absolute tenderness and sensitivity, especially during the second movement.
When Gold Medalist Nobuyuki Tsujii rose from the piano having completed his final performance at the Thirteenth Van Cliburn International Piano Competition, audience members leapt to their feet, and jurors were moved to tears by his passionate interpretation of Chopin's Piano Concerto No. 1 in E Minor, Op. 11.
My screen keeps jumping up and down, so that's all for now. My best to you all, Kathleen
Edited by loveschopintoomuch (09/02/10 02:10 PM)
_________________________
After playing Chopin, I feel as if I had been weeping over sins that I had never committed, and mourning over tragedies that were not my own." Oscar Wilde, 1891
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