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#1490334 - 08/07/10 05:24 PM Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females?
grademusictutors Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/24/10
Posts: 21
I saw a similar thread to this which had a different lineup previously so I'll keep this brief by saying it was interesting but refreshing to see a reader poll in BBC Music magazine voting the Russian at no1 of greatest C20th pianists (the usual names like Horowitz and Rubenstein were there also).
I thought about it and felt there wasn't a female poll so here is my list of greatest females pianists:

1.Alicia de La Rocha
2.Marta Argerich
3.Angela Hewitt
4.Annie Fischer
5.Gina Bachauer
6.Imogen Cooper

A friend suggested I add Tori Amos to the list. Do you agree? Maybe you have a differenct list
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#1490339 - 08/07/10 05:38 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: grademusictutors]
Kuanpiano Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/06/10
Posts: 2151
Loc: Canada
Maria Yudina? I haven't heard much from her, but she's apparently famous back in Russia.
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#1490344 - 08/07/10 05:44 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Kuanpiano]
Pogorelich. Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 4528
Loc: in the past
Uchida
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#1490345 - 08/07/10 05:45 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Pogorelich.]
bplary1300 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 05/03/08
Posts: 353
Loc: Maine
Maria Joao Pires, her Mozart is divine..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tVvu0l54kQ&feature=related


Edited by bplary1300 (08/07/10 05:46 PM)
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#1490360 - 08/07/10 06:08 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: bplary1300]
Varcon Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/15/04
Posts: 1931
Loc: Mount Vernon, Georgia 30445
How could Guiomar Novaes be omitted? Undoubtedly equal to any of those in the list and surpasses most.

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#1490365 - 08/07/10 06:14 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Varcon]
BDB Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 21695
Loc: Oakland
Dorothy Donegan. I heard her play Rachmaninoff and Mendelssohn in the same piece, while playing circles around another pianist.
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#1490398 - 08/07/10 06:49 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: BDB]
Thracozaag Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/06/04
Posts: 1980
Loc: Salt Lake City
Some favourites:

Novaes
Myra Hess
Monique de la Bruchollerie
Yvonne Lefébure
Elly Ney
Rosita Renard
Jeanne Marie-Darre
Annie Fischer
Magda Taliaferro
Clara Haskil
Fannie Davies
Madeleine de Valmalete
Moura Lympany
Marcelle Meyer

Wish we had recordings of Teresa Carreño-aside from the piano rolls-she must have been something else.
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#1490439 - 08/07/10 07:44 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Thracozaag]
Varcon Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/15/04
Posts: 1931
Loc: Mount Vernon, Georgia 30445
And, Koji, there are a host of others. Did you ever hear Ida Krehm? Wow!!!

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#1490448 - 08/07/10 07:53 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Varcon]
Thracozaag Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 10/06/04
Posts: 1980
Loc: Salt Lake City
Yes, as I recall, she was the first female pianist to record significant amounts of Scriabin.
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#1490454 - 08/07/10 07:59 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Varcon]
Andromaque Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/29/08
Posts: 3886
Loc: New York
Clara Haskil
Marguerite Long
Eliso Virsaladze (if you have never heard of her, please check some of her UT clips. Magnificent. She was Berezovsky's teahcer also I think)
Rosalyn Tureck
Maria Tipo
The list is long indeed

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#1490475 - 08/07/10 08:30 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Kuanpiano]
Catenaires Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/01/10
Posts: 160
Originally Posted By: Kuanpiano
Maria Yudina? I haven't heard much from her, but she's apparently famous back in Russia.


Yudina is fabulous. I really like her Schubert, particularly D 960.




Edited by Catenaires (08/07/10 08:52 PM)

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#1490476 - 08/07/10 08:32 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Andromaque]
MiM Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 07/09/09
Posts: 543
Loc: Pennsylvania
Who has the best technique?
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#1490485 - 08/07/10 08:42 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Thracozaag]
argerichfan Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8907
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
Originally Posted By: Thracozaag
Some favourites:

Novaes
Myra Hess
Monique de la Bruchollerie
Yvonne Lefébure
Elly Ney
Rosita Renard
Jeanne Marie-Darre
Annie Fischer
Magda Taliaferro
Clara Haskil
Fannie Davies
Madeleine de Valmalete
Moura Lympany
Marcelle Meyer

Wish we had recordings of Teresa Carreño-aside from the piano rolls-she must have been something else.


I agree, Teresa Carreño must have been a force to reckon with. What I would give to hear her in the concertos she was so famous for: Rubinstein 4, MacDowell 2, Beethoven 5.

But Koji, my good mate, you are without a doubt one of the finest and most knowledgeable pianists on this board, but you have always consistently turned a deaf ear to anything concerning Martha Argerich. What is she doing wrong for you? I think that is a fair enough question.

Your list above has many stellar names, and with the exception of Bruchollerie, Renard, Valmalete and Meyer, I have heard recordings of them all. Are you seriously going to rate, say, Novaes (a satisfyingly quiet pianist), Lefébure, Ney (that's a rather politically sore spot with me, and rather sloppy technically), Darre (a sledgehammer of a pianist), Fischer (you have seen her Liszt Eb on YouTube?), Haskil (unsurpassed in only Mozart and Beethoven's 3rd), Davies (huh?) and Lympany above Argerich?

Forgive me, I just don't understand this. shocked

You could have included Yvonne Loriod, Ruth Laredo, Lilian Kallir, Seta Tanyel, Idil Biret, Constance Keene, Ursula Oppens. All of them -IMO- are in a sense finer and more vibrant pianists than most of the ones on your list.

For all that, I would be curious to hear Fannie Bloomfield Zeisler, Annette Essipoff, Olga Samaroff, Sophie Mentner. But I seriously doubt they would take on Argerich today. I don't think Carreño could either, at least from what I have read.

As for Clara and her star pupil, Adelina de Lara, well the less said. And of course -this always gets me into trouble with the women here- I think Clara would never rate a footnote today without the surname she was fortunate enough to appropriate.
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#1490513 - 08/07/10 09:30 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: argerichfan]
Andromaque Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/29/08
Posts: 3886
Loc: New York
Jason
I never understood your beef with Clara. Obviously we do not know what she sounded like but her skills are very well documented, and she was already concertizing and famous before she married Robert. SHe continued to be revered as a great artist and to receive great reviews well after his death!!
But your antipathy towards her pales in comparison to the pure hatred that Steven Isserlis reserves for her. He never forgave her burning of Schumann's late music compositions, which she thought were unbecoming of his genius. For all we know she may have been right. After all, she was his biggest champion. At her deathbed, she is said to have asked someone to play for her one of Robert's Romanze.

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#1490532 - 08/07/10 10:15 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Andromaque]
argerichfan Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/15/06
Posts: 8907
Loc: Pacific Northwest, US.
Originally Posted By: Andromaque
Jason
I never understood your beef with Clara.

She was a very mean spirited woman. She did everything possible to undermine the relationship of one of her lesbian daughters -this is documented- she constantly meddled in the affairs of her other children -this is also documented- she had no more talent as a composer than any of the other mediocre guys writing at the same time (that's obvious), she never lost an opportunity to denigrate Liszt, she utterly misunderstood everything about Wagner, and she never taught anyone important. She was just Clara.

Of course it is received wisdom that Robert's love for Clara produced some of the greatest works ever for piano, but I'm not terribly convinced that without Clara those works would never have seen the light of day.

And I hasten to add: IMO!

smokin
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Jason

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#1490553 - 08/07/10 10:56 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: argerichfan]
stores Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/09
Posts: 6648
Loc: Here, as opposed to there
Originally Posted By: argerichfan
Originally Posted By: Andromaque
Jason
I never understood your beef with Clara.

She was a very mean spirited woman. She did everything possible to undermine the relationship of one of her lesbian daughters -this is documented- she constantly meddled in the affairs of her other children -this is also documented- she had no more talent as a composer than any of the other mediocre guys writing at the same time (that's obvious), she never lost an opportunity to denigrate Liszt, she utterly misunderstood everything about Wagner, and she never taught anyone important. She was just Clara.

Of course it is received wisdom that Robert's love for Clara produced some of the greatest works ever for piano, but I'm not terribly convinced that without Clara those works would never have seen the light of day.

And I hasten to add: IMO!

smokin



While all of what you've written here is true (as you say it's all well documented), none of it makes her any more, or less a pianist. You could dig up a lot of dirt on practically every composer I can think of, but none of that dirt makes them any more, or less a composer.
_________________________

"And if we look at the works of J.S. Bach — a benevolent god to which all musicians should offer a prayer to defend themselves against mediocrity... -Debussy

"It's ok if you disagree with me. I can't force you to be right."

♪ ≠ $


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#1490573 - 08/07/10 11:21 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: stores]
JustAnotherPianist Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/20/08
Posts: 798
Loc: United Kingdom
Yudina was incredible. Lili Kraus as well.
While some of Novaes' recordings indeed showed enormous potential, it is my opinion that she never really fufilled that potential. Many of her recordings are...patchy at best.
Same thing with Biret-a FEW of her 100,000+ recordings are exquisite. Many of her recordings, imo, sound like she simply didn't learn the pieces well enough to perform. And every live recording of hers I've heard was truly GHASTLY. Perhaps if she played only about 10% of the repertoire she claims to command.....
There are a couple of girls who are hot hot hot right now... Yuja Wang, Claire Huangci, Sofya Gulyak, and so many others... Ingrid Fliter isn't too bad either. Obviously these young types have a long way to go before they belong in the 'best female pianists of the 20th century' list.
If I had to choose ONE female pianist as my favourite, it would have to be Yudina.

*flamesuit on*
I've always struggled to find any appeal in the playing of Hess or Haskil.

I quite like Annie Fischer though. Does anyone here know much about Ann Schein??

As long as Helene Grimaud doesn't make it anywhere NEAR this list...

I know this forum is madly in love with Valentina Lisitsa, but I've never really been able to respond posively to her playing. Even her technique, which garners much praise from some of the less knowlegeable members here, I find less than impressive. Too surfacy a sound. Sure she can burn notes, but the sound??

Olga Kern has impressive chops, but some wacko musical ideas to go along with it.

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#1490577 - 08/07/10 11:28 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: JustAnotherPianist]
Pogorelich. Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 4528
Loc: in the past
I agree about Helene and Lisitsa, but Kern is one cool piece of s---. Judging by one class I saw and talking to people about it.. Plus I don't mind her playing.
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'I want to invest my emotions only in music; it will never disappoint me or hurt me - it is a safe place to be.'

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#1490579 - 08/07/10 11:29 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: JustAnotherPianist]
Keith D Kerman Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/12/03
Posts: 3334
Loc: Gaithersburg, MD (Washington D...
Originally Posted By: JustAnotherPianist

Does anyone here know much about Ann Schein??


Incredible pianist with a gorgeous sound. Also, about the nicest person in the history of the world.
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#1490583 - 08/07/10 11:36 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Keith D Kerman]
JustAnotherPianist Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/20/08
Posts: 798
Loc: United Kingdom
I'm just listening to her Rach 3 right now (lol here signature piece she's played it over like 70 times). It's just about right. Powerfully expressive. She makes the most out of the incredible textures throughout-very difficult indeed I've played this many times myself. MMMMM ANN SCHEIN YOU RACH.

Anyone heard Martina Filjak (sp?) She's Croatian I believe, and on the way to becoming quite a major star....

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#1490584 - 08/07/10 11:37 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: JustAnotherPianist]
JustAnotherPianist Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/20/08
Posts: 798
Loc: United Kingdom
Oh yeah Kern came to GGS a couple years back didn't she? Who played for her? I hope it was Alex... that boy is a genius.

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#1490593 - 08/07/10 11:55 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Pogorelich.]
stores Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/09
Posts: 6648
Loc: Here, as opposed to there
Originally Posted By: Pogorelich.
I agree about Helene and Lisitsa, but Kern is one cool piece of s---. Judging by one class I saw and talking to people about it.. Plus I don't mind her playing.


I also agree. I don't care for the first two, but I love Olga.
_________________________

"And if we look at the works of J.S. Bach — a benevolent god to which all musicians should offer a prayer to defend themselves against mediocrity... -Debussy

"It's ok if you disagree with me. I can't force you to be right."

♪ ≠ $


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#1490601 - 08/08/10 12:12 AM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: stores]
jeffreyjones Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/31/10
Posts: 2361
Loc: San Jose, CA
Judging by the difficulty of her music, Amy Beach must have been a force to be reckoned with.

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#1490606 - 08/08/10 12:23 AM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: argerichfan]
Andromaque Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/29/08
Posts: 3886
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: argerichfan
Originally Posted By: Andromaque
Jason
I never understood your beef with Clara.

She was a very mean spirited woman. She did everything possible to undermine the relationship of one of her lesbian daughters -this is documented- she constantly meddled in the affairs of her other children -this is also documented- she had no more talent as a composer than any of the other mediocre guys writing at the same time (that's obvious), she never lost an opportunity to denigrate Liszt, she utterly misunderstood everything about Wagner, and she never taught anyone important. She was just Clara.

Of course it is received wisdom that Robert's love for Clara produced some of the greatest works ever for piano, but I'm not terribly convinced that without Clara those works would never have seen the light of day.

And I hasten to add: IMO!

smokin



Nothing you said negates the fact that she was a formidable pianist, though!

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#1490711 - 08/08/10 06:16 AM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Andromaque]
Nigel Keay Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/04/08
Posts: 132
Loc: Paris
Florencia Raitzin-Legrand. I've no idea where she'd come in the pecking order, but I know that she performed once with the legendary Amadeus String Quartet, so that impressed me as a viola player.
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#1490752 - 08/08/10 09:25 AM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Nigel Keay]
Derek Hartwell Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/03/09
Posts: 219
Loc: United Kingdom
Yvonne Loriod, and contemporary younger generation: Gabriela Montero who is a phenomenal pianist and improviser.
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#1490776 - 08/08/10 10:19 AM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Nigel Keay]
Kreisler Offline



Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 13804
Loc: Iowa City, IA
Speaking of Cliburn laureates, there was a woman at the 1997 Cliburn who made a huge impression. I haven't heard much of her recently, but she was truly a highlight of that year's competition and deserves mention:

Katia Skanavi

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yAa5S69Lq-o
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#1490789 - 08/08/10 10:47 AM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Kreisler]
Silent Thoughts Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/30/05
Posts: 314
One of my favorites is the late Maria Grinberg:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rir53pUzD7Q

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nU5JzvlKUxY

Olga Kern is one of my favorites, too. I once spoke with her for a while after one of her concerts and she gave me some very helpful tips for how to approach new repertoire.

Marcelle Meyer, mentioned earlier, is another of my favorites.

Just to name a few.

- Silence

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#1490872 - 08/08/10 01:47 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: Silent Thoughts]
BDB Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/07/03
Posts: 21695
Loc: Oakland
Myra Hess and Wanda Landowska.
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#1490921 - 08/08/10 02:52 PM Re: Greatest Pianist of 20th Century - Rachmaninoff. Females? [Re: BDB]
TheHappyMoron Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/06/10
Posts: 1166
Loc: UK
Maybe Maria Yudina, Martha Argerich or Valentina Lisitsa, but i think its impossible to say who's the greatest because each interpretaion is subjective and i may enjoy one performance by say, Argerich, but then think her recording of Rach's 3rd not quite so enjoyable, and vice versa with the others. Each performer has their own idiom in terms of interpretation. If that makes sense.
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