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I have been to this piano dealer :
http://www.centre-chopin.com/fiches-numerique.php?$=25.

The website mentions CA-63. So I went to the store to try it. The dealer told : "We don't have now. It will be here in the next two weeks.

The dealer told me that CA-93 will not be available. He doesn't think there is so much difference between the two models.

However I tried the Roland HP307. The sound is good. However I'm disppointed with the touch. Not heavy enough for me. It doesn't feel realistic to me. To me, the keyboard is more important than the sound (though I can agree this is a very personnal statement).


I'll come back later to tell about my impressions for the CA-63.

so which is better? CA93, HP307 or CLP380??

That highly depends on who you talk with!

I'm quoting myself here:
"Just pick the one that's best according to your own ears and fingers (at the music store you could let them adjust touch settings and piano sound according to your preferences).

Be sure to use both the in-built speakers (at moderate to high volumes) and your own headphones."

Hi worov. So, did you buy the ca 63? Do you like it?

Nothing beats spending a few hours on each to make a proper comparison.

Over the last 2 weeks I've spend nearly 15 hours playing on the following at 5 separate dealers:

V-piano, HP 307, CP-1, CP 308, AvantGrand N-3, YU5 Silent Piano, CA-93, CA-63.

After much consideration, I'm torn between the CA-93 and the HP-307 and here's my overall impression on both. The CP 380 fell out of consideration (I couldn't find a dealer that had the CP380/370 in stock but I played on both a CP-1 and a CP308 (has the same key action so I'm told). I dislike the action on both.

CA-93 / CA-63
Pros:
It has in my opinion the best action in 3-4k price range and allows for extreme control in terms of dynamic range. It was able to capture many subtle variations of pianissimo. They were a joy to play. You'll likely want to set the Touch to Heavy. The default setting of Normal touch didn't quite feel right to me.

While there seems to be some debate on whether the soundboard contributes to the sound quality of this instrument, I can say the CA-93 sounds very nice. When compared directly to the CA-63 at volume level 6+ on the Concert Grand the CA-93 feels much richer to me. The lower range in particular outperformed the CA-63. Whether this is a result of the soundboard or the placement of the speakers I really have no idea. With the headset, both instruments sound identical.

Cons:
Not all instruments are created equal. I played two different CA-63s and the sound on some of the upper range notes was very bell-like and harsh on the Concert Grand patch on one and much more mellow on the other. This occurred even after I had reset both to factory default settings. My only guess is that this may have to do with the action on a couple of the keys as I tested it playing slow scales across the affected notes and it seemed like they were a bit more sensitive than their neighbors. This was noticeable with or without headphones so it isn't a speaker thing.

Personally, I don't like the control console on the left. I prefer the more traditional layout with the controls easily reachable just above the keys.

2 Track record only? This might not sound like a big deal, but it does make a slight difference.

HP 307
Pros:
Default Grand Concert sounds better than both the CA-63 and CA-93 when wearing headphones. Specifically, I think the HP 307 sounds nicer in the high range.

The 307 sounds slightly richer than the CA-63 without headphones but I'd give the edge to the CA-93 when playing without headphones at volumes 6-7 (there is no contest when comparing notes in the low range CA-93 wins hands-down).

Texture of the keys is very nice to touch. Action is good but a bit on the 'bouncy' side.

More pronounced 'Escapement' feel than on the CA-93. I don't really care much for this feature but my mom, swears by it. She absolutely loves the escapement click.

Controller interface felt a bit more intuitive than the CAs and I prefer the top layout.

Cons:
Thumping. The keys really thump when you depress them. This is much less of an issue when playing with headphones.

Here are my overall rankings:

Key Action:
CA-93 9 out of 10
CA-63 8.9 out of 10 (.1 for lack of escapement)
HP 307 8 out of 10

Sound w/Headphones:
HP 307 7.5 out of 10
CA-93/CA-63 7 out of 10

Sound (built in speakers)
CA-93 8 out of 10
HP 307 7 out of 10
CA-63 6.5 out of 10

Interface:
HP 307 8 out of 10
CA-93/CA-63 6 out of 10

FishTako,

Thank you for posting your experiences - it's clear that you are torn between the HP-307 and CA93. However, without wishing to complicate matters further, have you considered the LX-10F (HP-307 with partially ebony polish cabinet and improved speakers)?

I do not know why two different CA63 instruments should not sound identical, especially after performing a factory reset - were you listening using headphones, or was this the speaker output?



This is not quite correct. The CP1/CP5 utilise a new action called 'NW Stage', which is ungraded (all 88 keys are the same weight) and arguably geared towards electric piano playing. The CLPS-308 however does use the 'NW' keyboard action, which should be the same as the CLP370/CLP380.

Anyway, good luck finalising your decision! Both the Roland and Kawai are superb digital pianos, so I'm confident that you will be very happy with either instrument.

Cheers,
James
x

Hi FishTako,
I respect your personal comparison, opinion and preferences related to the factory Concert Grand sounds in single voice mode.

Now, based on this, let's take the next step in boosting sound quality and dynamics by entering the advanced dual voice mode for acoustic piano voices (CA93/CA63 only):

'Enhancing the default settings of Kawai CA63 and CA93 digital piano'
http://www.attacca.eu/images/settings_CA63_93.pdf

Lightspeed is too slow, we're going to have to go right to Ludicrous Speed!

[video:youtube]mk7VWcuVOf0[/video]

Thats an interesting point, and something I would never have thought of! But I wonder how the owner of the music shop in the town would feel if I asked if I could do a Factory Reset on one of their keyboards!

I wouldn't ask in the first place. And if they thought about it at all they'd probably thank you for doing so - all the random button pressing going on can leave them in weird states, and confuse people who are demoing them.

Thank you for the clarifications on the CP1 and CLPS-308. With all the keyboards out there, it gets hard to keep them all straight and organized in your head!

I did have a brief chance to try the LX-10F but the salesperson mentioned it had the same speaker set up as the HP 307 so I didn't really consider it given that the finish is not a factor for me.

In regards to the differing CA63s, I did notice the sound difference both with speakers and headphones which is why I thought it may have to do with sensitivity on a few keys. My mom had a similar impression. She didn't like the first CA63 and when we went to the second, she was surprised when I told her it was the same model she played earlier.

Thanks for the link. It looks like you've done an impressive amount of work sampling with the dual layered sound feature. I have to admit I didn't play with that much when at the store and will likely need to make another test run to finalize my decision.

You're welcome, thanks for your thoughts.

The CA93/CA63's sound shaping potential is huge; the list of different piano and other timbres will keep on growing, also based on user/owner input. You're invited to post your related insights here: https://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubb...0for%20KAWAI%20CA93/CA6.html#Post1448603

Actually the "speaker set up" is not the same in the LX-10F and the HP-307 as you or the "professional salesperson" could see by simply examining the actual specifications.

http://www.rolandus.com/products/productdetails.php?ProductId=1076#
http://www.rolandus.com/products/productdetails.php?ProductId=1055

The LX-10F has six speakers compared to the four of the HP-307 and due to placement of some in the upper cabinet of the "upright" they also give a more realistic and defined sound projection on the LX-10F.

The LX-10F not only has a different finish but a much different appearing, stark, modern, upright piano design look including having a proper soft-fall keyboard cover rather than a flimsy, sloping slidey thing as on the HP-307 and Kawai CA-63. It also has an extra wide and deep music desk when open reminiscent of a grand piano or very high end upright.

Is that LX-10F the same model that's being advertised together with a separate Yamaha subwoofer (if I recall correctly)?

Yes. By one of those American websites that creates discounted bundles for lots of what they sell including the LX-10F but that apparently don't think that the Kawai CA cabinet pianos are worth selling at all.

http://kraftmusic.com/catalog/keyboards/weightedactionkeyboards/8081
http://kraftmusic.com/catalog/keyboards/weightedactionkeyboards/index.asp?brand=27

The "Official" Top of Line Digital Piano Playoff Thread, right?
http://wn.com/Kawai_part1

...the Roland LX10F is double the price than a KAWAI CA63, and even 1.200 Euro more expensive than a Kawai CA93. You have to decide for yourself if this is worth it and you have the extra money available... an Alternative would be the (not yet released) successor of the KAWAI CA111.

Especially that second video footage is very funny, hpeterh!

Can't resist: I do wonder whether Kawai is paying their employees enough...
... if you feed'em peanuts, you get monkeys. (no pun intended)