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#1538118 - 10/18/10 02:57 PM Follow up to 'custom settings' thread: Need more responses!
barryc Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/16/10
Posts: 14
Background: I'm finally choosing to 'pull the trigger', going with the Kawaii CA 63. But, I still have a major hurdle choice and I need some expert help.

I am composing classical piano (only) and need something to record as I come up with new ideas. I'm choosing the 63 because of touch and an adequate sound. I'm not needing equipment for producing cds or anything, just want to have the capacity to put the body of work into an organized format and want to get good sound.

Question: Having read the thread on CA93/63 'custom settings', does the CA 63 have adequate customizing inherent to it or do I still need a Pianotech/computer/sound card/more speakers, set up in order to get great sound?

I'll appreciate any and all responses. Thanks, in advance


Edited by barryc (10/18/10 11:54 PM)
Edit Reason: poor response rate

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#1538204 - 10/18/10 04:40 PM Re: Help in buying decision/ follow up to 'custom settings' [Re: barryc]
ChrisA Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 3841
Loc: Redondo Beach, California
Originally Posted By: barryc
...
I am composing classical piano (only) and need something to record as I come up with new ideas. I'm choosing the 63 because of touch and an adequate sound. I'm not needing equipment for producing cds or anything, just want to have the capacity to put the body of work into an organized format and want to get good sound...


Use a computer. Software like Garage Band is all you really need. It can save music, put it in folders and if you also record MIDI (in addition to the audio) it can print music in standard notation.

I'd think if you are composing and you end product is sheet music you'd want some good notation software.

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#1538699 - 10/19/10 10:32 AM Re: Follow up to 'custom settings' thread: Need more responses! [Re: barryc]
TADutchman Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/26/10
Posts: 760
Loc: Apeldoorn, The Netherlands
Originally Posted By: barryc
Question: Having read the thread on CA93/63 'custom settings', does the CA 63 have adequate customizing inherent to it or do I still need a Pianotech/computer/sound card/more speakers, set up in order to get great sound?

I'll appreciate any and all responses. Thanks, in advance

Hi barryc,
Let's split it up:

Do the CA93/CA63 have adequate customizing?
Yes absolutely, because of the extremely coherent UPHI sampling quality and unique dual voice mode combination, there is no other console type DP currently available that can touch it when it comes to customizing piano voices, not even close! cool

Reference: http://www.attacca.eu/images/settings_CA63_93.pdf



Do I still need Pianoteq?
I.m.h.o. the CA93/CA63 with for instance the new Steinway patch sounds amazing and is way superior to standalone Pianoteq (playability is excellent too). But please don’t just take my word for it: you’re personally invited to go and test a wide variety of dual voice custom settings for yourself and report back your findings at the CA93/CA63 custom settings thread! smile

Reference: (playing live, I perceived bigger differences between recording 2. and 4.)
http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubbthreads.php/topics/1530455.html#Post1530455



Do I still need more speakers?
If you think so, you’d better buy the high-end CA93 with soundboard and 6-speaker system for authentic live playing at moderate to high volumes shocked wow (by the way, the CA63 and CA93 sound identical over headphones).

Reference: http://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubbthrea...tml#Post1474117


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#1538709 - 10/19/10 10:55 AM Re: Follow up to 'custom settings' thread: Need more responses! [Re: barryc]
spanishbuddha Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/08/09
Posts: 2235
Loc: UK
OT: Nice paper TADutchman and Pinipon. I don't have a CA63 but do enjoy the result of the (static) overlay of piano tones using the CN33.

I know the emphasis is on how the results sound in your custom settings, but I just wonder if it would make sense or be interesting to also submit one of your piano sounds to Dewster and DPBSD to see what a waveform and spectrum analysis would make of it?

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#1538721 - 10/19/10 11:12 AM Re: Follow up to 'custom settings' thread: Need more responses! [Re: barryc]
elecmuse3 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/05/10
Posts: 304
Loc: Cincinnati
What is your end goal, the steps you already have taken to get there and the steps you will take next?

If you are composing solo piano works, and will print them as notation to have them played by a fantastic acoustic piano performer (whether yourself or another), then ease of recording and integration with decent notation software will rank high on your "wanted" list, and best possible sound and action will rank lower.

If you will be using a sequencer to record your keyboard playing, and then use the edited MIDI files to play back the same hardware instrument, the sound becomes much more important, and notation unnecessary, unless/until you want another to play your pieces.

Only if you think others will be listening to the actual instrument you play do you need really good and loud sound, otherwise they'll be listening to downloads or CDs.
Let us know, there are many quite helpful folks here who wish you well. smile
_________________________
Terry@cincyrockers.com
www.theplayerpianoshop.com

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#1538726 - 10/19/10 11:21 AM Re: Follow up to 'custom settings' thread: Need more responses! [Re: spanishbuddha]
TADutchman Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/26/10
Posts: 760
Loc: Apeldoorn, The Netherlands
Originally Posted By: spanishbuddha
OT: Nice paper TADutchman and Pinipon.

Thanks, spanishbuddha!


Originally Posted By: spanishbuddha
I know the emphasis is on how the results sound in your custom settings, but I just wonder if it would make sense or be interesting to also submit one of your piano sounds to Dewster and DPBSD to see what a waveform and spectrum analysis would make of it?

That's exactly right, no paralysis by analysis: my main goals are maximizing sheer live sound quality and offering variety to CA93/CA63 owners! Although an excellent idea that also has crossed my mind before, submitting some of my dual voice presets to Dewster is currently not an option, because I work almost exclusively by way of developing completely new sound signatures with complex sympathetic resonances in my piano voices. These resonances are not yet supported with Midi-files, like what's needed for running the DPBSD test (firmware v1.08 perhaps?).
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#1538758 - 10/19/10 12:38 PM Re: Follow up to 'custom settings' thread: Need more responses! [Re: elecmuse3]
barryc Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 03/16/10
Posts: 14
These responses have been so helpful---thank you for taking the time to respond. It's very much appreciated. I'm only going to use the instrument in a small bedroom for practice, and recording and developing ideas.

I suppose if this were for playing in a larger room, I'd go for the 93, but it sounds as if you guys are collectively confirming that the 63 would be a good choice for my purposes. I think I'll be doing most of this via headphones. Thoughts on good ones?

I will want to eventually put my stuff to notation. Any further suggestions would be valuable to me in that regard also.

Thanks, again, all.


Edited by barryc (10/19/10 12:41 PM)

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#1538764 - 10/19/10 12:57 PM Re: Follow up to 'custom settings' thread: Need more responses! [Re: barryc]
Rimmer Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/15/10
Posts: 483
Loc: United Kingdom
Originally Posted By: barryc
I think I'll be doing most of this via headphones. Thoughts on good ones?


I have a few sets of headphones but the main ones I reach for are Sony MDR-V6's. They can be quite loud though so you have to be careful.

Headphones these days are much cheaper, for a decent set, than ten years ago. The MDR's are quite honest although for purely piano, you might want to check out something maybe a little bit duller if you're going to be using them for long periods of time. Some of the Sennheisers are good value for money and often a lot duller than the Sony's. Try and get some phones that cup your ears and are nice and soft. They best way to choose is to try some out and go from there. Everyones ears and heads are different sizes so what works for one person might not work so well for another..

Regards. Rimmer

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#1538897 - 10/19/10 04:32 PM Re: Follow up to 'custom settings' thread: Need more responses! [Re: barryc]
TADutchman Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/26/10
Posts: 760
Loc: Apeldoorn, The Netherlands
I'm using Sennheiser HD595 headphones and I've heard that AKG K701 works well too.
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#1538913 - 10/19/10 04:56 PM Re: Follow up to 'custom settings' thread: Need more responses! [Re: barryc]
ChrisA Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 3841
Loc: Redondo Beach, California
Originally Posted By: barryc
.... I think I'll be doing most of this via headphones. Thoughts on good ones?

I will want to eventually put my stuff to notation. Any further suggestions would be valuable to me in that regard also.

Thanks, again, all.


When buying headphones the first think to decide is if you need the "open" or "closed" type.

Closed ones will offer better sound isolation. They muffle outside noise from (say) a TV playing downstairs and they keep the sound you hear from leaking out into the room. "Open headphones don't isolate sound so well.

But for any given price piont the open headphones will have better quality sound. Or, for a given sound quality you'd pay double or more for closed headphones.

I use AGK K240 headphones. These have been the most popular studio headphones used in the recording industry for decades. You can get them for $100 from Sweetwater. If you like closed headphones of the same quality prices are closer to $200 an example would be the K271. Closed ones are needed if you plan to sing into a mic, so the headphones sound doe not bleed into it.



For recording I always say to simply use Garage Band until you can point to some specific feature you need that it lacks then upgrade to Logic Express. GB comes free and pre-installed on every Mac. The "free and pre-installed" part pretty much makes it a no-brainier.

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#1539241 - 10/20/10 05:40 AM Re: Follow up to 'custom settings' thread: Need more responses! [Re: barryc]
TADutchman Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/26/10
Posts: 760
Loc: Apeldoorn, The Netherlands
Originally Posted By: barryc
I will want to eventually put my stuff to notation.

In case you mean this literally: http://www.notation.com/ grin wink
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