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#1541799 - 10/23/10 02:59 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Piano World]
Keith D Kerman Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/12/03
Posts: 3349
Loc: Gaithersburg, MD (Washington D...
Originally Posted By: eweiss
My wife dragged me to an art museum with one of her friends. Her friend went up to one of the docents and asked "what can you tell me about this painting?"

As if she couldn't learn all she needed by just looking at it and evaluating it on her own. There's no need to look to an external source when 'evaluating' art. Trust your initial reactions. Something people have a hard time with because they think they're supposed to think or feel a certain way. Usually the way the 'experts' tell them to.


If someone's initial reaction to an explanation about art is one of enjoyment, should they dismiss it because an expert told them that is not the way to enjoy art? How about if someone regularly notices that they more deeply enjoy art, even art they already enjoy, once they know more about it? Should they then dismiss those feelings because an expert tells them they shouldn't experience art with any external insight beyond the art itself?
_________________________
Keith D Kerman
PianoCraft
Rebuilding & Sales of vintage and pre-owned Steinway and Mason & Hamlin
New Steingraeber, Estonia, Charles R. Walter, Brodmann, Feurich
www.pianocraft.net
http://www.youtube.com/user/pianocraftchannel/videos

keith@pianocraft.net 888-840-5460

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#1541800 - 10/23/10 03:01 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Mostly]
eweiss Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/28/09
Posts: 2393
Loc: Beautiful San Diego, CA
Originally Posted By: Mostly
You obviously have no clue.
Having a weird feeling, I checked your post history, and saw a few points you tried to make on this forum ; then it all came back to me.

Checked your post history too. Now it all makes sense.
_________________________
Play New Age Piano
http://www.quiescencemusic.com

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#1541802 - 10/23/10 03:05 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Keith D Kerman]
eweiss Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/28/09
Posts: 2393
Loc: Beautiful San Diego, CA
Originally Posted By: Keith D Kerman
If someone's initial reaction to an explanation about art is one of enjoyment, should they dismiss it because an expert told them that is not the way to enjoy art?

Of course not. But why bother with that when the painting is hanging right in front of you.

Originally Posted By: Keith D Kerman
How about if someone regularly notices that they more deeply enjoy art, even art they already enjoy, once they know more about it? Should they then dismiss those feelings because an expert tells them they shouldn't experience art with any external insight beyond the art itself?

I can only tell you how I would approach it. For example, I mentioned liking the music of George Crumb. Never heard of him before. Never read about him. I listened to his music and liked it. Now, if I want to learn more, I can without bringing in an 'experts' bias telling me why I should or shouldn't like it. smile
_________________________
Play New Age Piano
http://www.quiescencemusic.com

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#1541807 - 10/23/10 03:18 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Piano World]
btb Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 01/21/04
Posts: 4263
Loc: Pretoria South Africa
One wonders whether Dale Hendersen isn’t giving classical music a bad name ... his scraping of the cello with his dismal Bach repetitions are an insult to the world of classical music ...
the cello has been used to grand effect in so many masterpieces ... one thinks immediately of the works of Dvorak (or the familiar Swan in Saint-Saens Carnival of the Animals.)

Or is Dale just practising in company to get the feel the stage prior to an examination ?

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#1541815 - 10/23/10 03:34 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Piano World]
Keith D Kerman Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/12/03
Posts: 3349
Loc: Gaithersburg, MD (Washington D...
I once tasted a cheese that I thought was terrible. An expert told me to try that cheese again with a specific wine. The combination was sublime.
I hated sushi upon first trying it. I tried it again and still hated it. Because I was dating a girl that loved sushi, I kept trying it. About the 7th time I tried sushi, something shocking happened. It became deliceous. It is now one of my favorite foods.

Music and art can be that way.
_________________________
Keith D Kerman
PianoCraft
Rebuilding & Sales of vintage and pre-owned Steinway and Mason & Hamlin
New Steingraeber, Estonia, Charles R. Walter, Brodmann, Feurich
www.pianocraft.net
http://www.youtube.com/user/pianocraftchannel/videos

keith@pianocraft.net 888-840-5460

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#1541818 - 10/23/10 03:38 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Piano World]
Victor25 Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/30/09
Posts: 1676
Loc: The Netherlands
eweiss, your opinion is respected just like any other here, but I'm starting to see a pattern here. You are free to express your opinion, but this is starting to turn into a fight... AGAIN.
_________________________
Currently working on: Perfecting the Op 2/1, studying the 27/2 last movement. Chopin Nocturne 32/2 and Posth. C#m, 'Raindrop' prelude and Etude 10/9
Repetoire: Beethoven op 2/1, 10/1(1st, 2nd), 13, 14/1, 27/1(1st, 2nd), 27/2, 28(1st, 2nd), 31/2(1st, 3rd), 49/1, 49/2, 78(1st), 79, 90, 101(1st)

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#1541852 - 10/23/10 04:29 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Nikolas]
Andromaque Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/29/08
Posts: 3886
Loc: New York
Originally Posted By: Nikolas
... So it's not that weird that people haven't heard the Bach cello suite! In fact I haven't and I don't feel that bad with myself!




Nikolas, you can't be serious.. Are you??

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#1541925 - 10/23/10 05:54 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Andromaque]
Nikolas Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 5431
Loc: Europe
Originally Posted By: Andromaque
Originally Posted By: Nikolas
... So it's not that weird that people haven't heard the Bach cello suite! In fact I haven't and I don't feel that bad with myself!




Nikolas, you can't be serious.. Are you??
Actually I am... I don't think I've heard the piece, unless it's also transcribed to a number of different instrumentations (which is the case to some Baroque or earlier works for semi-obvious reasons).

And, yes, I don't feel that bad that I don't know a single work pointed out...

Angelina: Bach vs little 'ol me? heh... I think I'd love any help I could get, but anyhow let's not get into this.

Let me rephrase myself, because I probably went a little too far: A nice gesture, that's for sure. I don't think any music genre is dying, and certainly not Bach's music. At the same time I think that the story is not news worthy, while it is extremely nice. That's all I think. The Joshua Bell, as I said, was aiming at the opposite idea (that nobody actually took notice), and as such it was interesting as an experiment. Not to mention that Joshua did it for a couple of days I think, or maybe a week, while this guys is doing it for a long time apparently!
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#1541937 - 10/23/10 06:19 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Keith D Kerman]
eweiss Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/28/09
Posts: 2393
Loc: Beautiful San Diego, CA
Originally Posted By: Keith D Kerman
I once tasted a cheese that I thought was terrible. An expert told me to try that cheese again with a specific wine. The combination was sublime.
I hated sushi upon first trying it. I tried it again and still hated it. Because I was dating a girl that loved sushi, I kept trying it. About the 7th time I tried sushi, something shocking happened. It became deliceous. It is now one of my favorite foods.

Music and art can be that way.

That was a good analogy. I'm starting to bend. smile
_________________________
Play New Age Piano
http://www.quiescencemusic.com

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#1541960 - 10/23/10 06:48 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: eweiss]
Keith D Kerman Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/12/03
Posts: 3349
Loc: Gaithersburg, MD (Washington D...
Originally Posted By: eweiss
Originally Posted By: Keith D Kerman
I once tasted a cheese that I thought was terrible. An expert told me to try that cheese again with a specific wine. The combination was sublime.
I hated sushi upon first trying it. I tried it again and still hated it. Because I was dating a girl that loved sushi, I kept trying it. About the 7th time I tried sushi, something shocking happened. It became deliceous. It is now one of my favorite foods.

Music and art can be that way.

That was a good analogy. I'm starting to bend. smile


Soon my analogy will have you spending time with music you hate while dining on brussel sprouts! Muahahaha!!
_________________________
Keith D Kerman
PianoCraft
Rebuilding & Sales of vintage and pre-owned Steinway and Mason & Hamlin
New Steingraeber, Estonia, Charles R. Walter, Brodmann, Feurich
www.pianocraft.net
http://www.youtube.com/user/pianocraftchannel/videos

keith@pianocraft.net 888-840-5460

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#1541976 - 10/23/10 07:11 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Keith D Kerman]
eweiss Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/28/09
Posts: 2393
Loc: Beautiful San Diego, CA
Originally Posted By: Keith D Kerman
Soon my analogy will have you spending time with music you hate while dining on brussel sprouts! Muahahaha!!

Perhaps later.



Right now I'm stroking my kitty.
_________________________
Play New Age Piano
http://www.quiescencemusic.com

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#1541982 - 10/23/10 07:19 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Piano World]
Andromaque Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/29/08
Posts: 3886
Loc: New York
Actually my favorite recipe for brussel sprouts is to saute them (cut in half and face down) in garlic butter then simmer them in good white wine.. Very delectable..

Nikolas, there are 5 cello suites, each made out of six "movements".. May I recommend Eric Siblin's book about them and Isserlis' recording. They are not just any "piece". They are heavenly masterpieces that every music lover should know. You are right about the availability of transcritions for differnet instruments including the piano. But they were written originally for solo cello with the 6th written probably for a 5 string cello (Isserlis uses one in his recent disc. he produces magical sounds). Sorry if you already knew that..

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#1541995 - 10/23/10 07:28 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Piano World]
Drunk3nFist Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/11/08
Posts: 640
Loc: London
How he manages to play in such an environment, I do not know. But I tip my hat off to the man, for such consistency.
_________________________
Ravel - Une Barque Sur l'Ocean
Kapustin - Etude No. 7
Bach/Busoni - Chaconne

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#1542066 - 10/23/10 09:18 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Piano World]
fuzzy8balls Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/28/07
Posts: 465
Loc: San Diego, CA
Why does he think classical music will die out in 100 years? Just about every Asian kid learns an instrument and enrollment in music schools is not dropping.
_________________________
YouTube Channel: www.youtube.com/user/fuzzy8balls

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#1542149 - 10/24/10 12:04 AM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Andromaque]
Nikolas Offline
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/26/07
Posts: 5431
Loc: Europe
Originally Posted By: Andromaque
Nikolas, there are 5 cello suites, each made out of six "movements".. May I recommend Eric Siblin's book about them and Isserlis' recording. They are not just any "piece". They are heavenly masterpieces that every music lover should know. You are right about the availability of transcritions for differnet instruments including the piano. But they were written originally for solo cello with the 6th written probably for a 5 string cello (Isserlis uses one in his recent disc. he produces magical sounds). Sorry if you already knew that..
Thanks... smile

Actually once I posted I thought that I probably know at least part of it. It's the best known piece probably for cello (again a huge generalization...). But I did research a tiny bit on youtube and there it was. Ok I know at least part of the suites. And I do think it's great music! smile
_________________________
http://www.musica-ferrum.com

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#1560543 - 11/19/10 02:05 AM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Piano World]
weldon29 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/16/09
Posts: 83
I don't get why people thinks that classical music is dying, there are more listeners of classical music then there ever was.

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#1560573 - 11/19/10 04:45 AM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: weldon29]
wr Offline
8000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/07
Posts: 8027
Originally Posted By: weldon29
I don't get why people thinks that classical music is dying, there are more listeners of classical music then there ever was.


I don't know if that assertion is reliable. But anyway...

There are well over twice as many people crowding this planet than were alive when I was born. So there needs to be an equal increase of the number of people listening to classical music simply to keep up. There could be more listeners than ever while still being a smaller proportion of the population.

I think that classical music is, if not exactly dying, undergoing a pretty drastic change from the days when it played a much more vital role in the culture (of the Western countries, at least). I'm not going to try to come up with all the reasons/symptoms, but I think one of the most important is that although some people do listen, they only listen, instead of playing or singing the music themselves. My impression is that in the US a far lower percentage of people actually know how to read music than was true, say, 75 years ago.

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#1560611 - 11/19/10 07:48 AM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: wr]
weldon29 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 04/16/09
Posts: 83
Originally Posted By: wr
Originally Posted By: weldon29
I don't get why people thinks that classical music is dying, there are more listeners of classical music then there ever was.


I don't know if that assertion is reliable. But anyway...

There are well over twice as many people crowding this planet than were alive when I was born. So there needs to be an equal increase of the number of people listening to classical music simply to keep up. There could be more listeners than ever while still being a smaller proportion of the population.

I think that classical music is, if not exactly dying, undergoing a pretty drastic change from the days when it played a much more vital role in the culture (of the Western countries, at least). I'm not going to try to come up with all the reasons/symptoms, but I think one of the most important is that although some people do listen, they only listen, instead of playing or singing the music themselves. My impression is that in the US a far lower percentage of people actually know how to read music than was true, say, 75 years ago.
The only people who listened to classical music back in the days were the royalties of Europe, now, not only has classical music spread to the common man, it has also been spread ed to mush of Asia. Even if we compare the people who were alive to the people who listen to it, I highly doubt that the percentage would be lower.

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#1561261 - 11/20/10 01:18 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Piano World]
chopin_r_us Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/17/10
Posts: 1016
Loc: UK
In the 19th century (what we call classical music) was more of a middleclass thing and it still is more or less.

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#1563123 - 11/23/10 08:16 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: eweiss]
megadave73 Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 10/27/10
Posts: 9
Loc: Ontario, Canada
Haha!...I agree with you completely sir! There is far too much psycho-babble going on with regards to this subject. There's plenty of great music that I simply do not enjoy. One day, perhaps my tastes will change, but for now I feel no shame in saying "nope, not for me".
For years ALL I listened to was insane heavy metal music. I had next to NO interest in classical music or the piano. Now, it consumes me...go figure. It has nothing to do with "education" about the genius of Chopin & Mozart. My tastes changed and NOW I like it. Simple. Thank you for defending simplicity

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#1563281 - 11/24/10 01:38 AM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Piano World]
fallapart Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 39
I heard from a lecture on crimiology that some cities are starting to play classical musics in subways to reduce crime. So, no need to worry as long as there's a practical side of the story.

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#1563692 - 11/24/10 10:08 PM Re: Save the Music - Bach in the Subway? [Re: Piano World]
PaintedPostDave Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 06/09/10
Posts: 558
Loc: Upstate New York
I think it's great. I am a jazz aficionado but I have purchased many classical cds after being exposed to something I had not heard before. If I hear him I might buy a y0-yo-ma cd, etc.

Rather than 59th street at Columbus Circle, I would like to see how he does at, say, the 1-9 stop at Sheridan Square. He would probably expose classical music to a lot more who previously had no exposure. At the 59th street stop he is likely "preaching to the choir". In any case, kudos!
_________________________
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Yamaha M1A console
1927 Knabe 7' 8" grand
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