I mean come on, you buy one and then next year we have newer model with better sound or keybed etc. They are designed to get money out of you! I was about to buy CLP340 and I decided
to go with acoustic. Who cares if I have to tune it once in a while, at least next year I will not be tempted with something better because there will be not...

Well that was productive. Do you feel better getting that off your chest?

Of course a donkey sucks when compared to a Mercedes in a highway, but sometimes the donkey can reach to places the Mercedes can't.

The same could be said about computers, you buy one and then next year it's newer model with better performance, screen resolution etc. Better to stick with an abacus if you want to buy something that will hold it's value.

I couldn't agree with you more. I wouldn't worry about those 230 tunable strings ... or your neighbors, enjoy your piano.

Better yet, post some samples of your playing, it gets so quiet here.

exactly, thanks foe reminding me - computers suck too.

But you're using one to post your thoughts on the wrong forum!

But, is the upgrade process a "Need" or a "Want"? I do photography as my other hobby (both Digital and film). Regardless of how good of a camera you may, when the new version comes out, EVERYONE wants to upgrade it. Does it make them better photographers? Does it make the photos they produce any better? Since a digital sensor reached 6MP in a DSLR, it could be argued that any real difference is negligible. Yes, certain areas have improved, but as a whole, most new features are gimmicky or Upgrades for Upgrade sake. My current rig is just over 3 years old. Apart from the batteries not holding charge like they used to, for me to upgrade would have zero influence on my final images….which is why I won't see an upgrade for a while (as a matter of fact, I would be happy to keep this shooter until it bites the dust).

I can see the same in Digital Pianos. People will always upgrade when newer units come out. A lot of this is about having the latest and the greatest. A lot of this is also marketing hype sucking people in. Will upgrading make you a better pianist? Hardly. Will your current digital piano work as good as the upgrade? More then likely

(BTW, I have both a digital and an acoustic. I love them both….)

Sure. But then again, if everything you need could be addressed by an acoustic piano, then you probably shouldn't have been looking at the CLP-340 to begin with. The way I see it, people buy a CLP-340 because they need a digital piano (insert all those digital only reason here.) If you are perfectly served with an acoustic, then actually, the acoustic is still great.

When I lived in an apartment, I bought a digital. Believe me, if I had a choice, I would have bought an acoustic upright. Back in 1990, I could have gotten a really nice upright for $4,500 that would still be pretty good today, but the $4,500 digital I bought is not even as good as a $500 P85 today.

What would happen if this were not true?

I remember a couple hundred thousand years ago my cave-mate Thang said


Thang's grammar was never very good. But as you see this problem is neither new nor limited to digital pianos.

Seriously, if it were not for this "problem" we'd all be like Thag, living in a cave and eating animals we killed with pointed rocks

offnote, I pretty much agree with you. DP manufacturers have been infuriatingly slow at climbing the technology curve, with each new offering just a slightly different - sometimes improved, sometimes a step back - version of some previous random offering. PC samplers left them in the dust long ago in terms of sample set size and quality - so what are we paying the big bucks for? A set of keys and a highly compressed sample set, plus maybe some cheap underpowered speakers placed in sub-optimal enclosures. Roland SN is pretty much the only thing that's kept any of my interest, time will tell how that pans out.

I'm not sure I get that whole "my DP is obsolete" concept. Is there music written that you can't play on an old DP? Granted the newer ones sound better / have more bang for the buck, but like anything else electronic, you have to jump in at some point.

For the most part I agree with you. The electronic business in general are near crooks. It's a well thought out marketing pyramid to continuously suck money from the consumers. Eventually something is going to have to happen. But until then, not much you can do about it. As long as there is a market for it, it will exist. People love their frivolous gadgets.

i like that

I don't get the "obsolete" thing either. My piano will never be obsolete. It will always play just as well as it did when new, until it finally breaks down.

Unlike others, I will not have any wish to "trade up" in 2 or 4 years. If this piano lasts 20 years, I'll use it for 20 years. I don't really care what new models come along. I don't live in a piano store, so I only hear my piano, not the shiny new ones in the showroom.

Digital pianos are like any other electronic device you buy, every year a better version of last years product comes out. The question is do you really need or want the upgraded version. I'm perfectly happy with my digital piano and have no intention in upgrading until it breaks. I'm also perfectly happy with my older model computer, TV set, stereo and any number of other electronic appliances around my house. I've never had the desire to upgrade electronic devices just because something a little better has come out. If you want a digital piano for the purposes of portability, silent practice, etc. Then get the best digital you can afford that meets your current and hopefully your future needs. If you want to use you digital piano as an acoustic, and don't need the advantages that a digital give you then by all means buy an acoustic. There are reasons for selecting one over the other based on your needs. The best scenario is to have at least one of each.

I think I'll go with pure acoustic too. I'll sound so much better when I show up at my friend's house for a jam sess... Oh wait...

You should save your money and buy a book that deals with improving your grammar. I should hope your piano skills are better than your writing

Your points are valid with TV's and soundbars as well, but does that imply they are inadequate? In a free market enconomy, equilibrium is achieved through marketing, promotional and competitive analysis.

For example, the P95 might not be a big upgrade over the P85, but to a new customer the updates on the P95 might steer them away from a competitor.

Remember, the acoustic pianos of today are better than those in the 1800's.

My Buddy, Mick Seven would probably love your post. He swears only by his Fender Rhodes and B3. WHen the DX7 came out he called it a "cross between an Atari 2600 and Casio!"

I however like my P95 more than my Baldwin Acrosnoic

They don't suck because they are great learning tools, are indispensible to many musicians and do offer a level of transparency that is good enough in many situations.

That being said, when you hear them next to a great acoustic, they do kind of suck. It's great having the digital, but I am humbled by my acoustic.

This guy (Tempei Nakamura) is a great example of why it's great that we have both.... but one just can't be replaced. I'm sure he relies on his DPs and enjoys playing them, but I would bet that he relishes his moments with acoustics a bit more. (DP on next post).

Just don't upgrade too often. I figure it like this: I bought a YDP223 4 years ago for $1600; sold it 6 months ago for $850 and bought a P155 for $1200. Net cost: $1950. I expect to keep the P155 for at least 4 years, so over those 8 years I'll have spent less than $250 per year -- roughly what it would cost to tune an acoustic.

(So no, DPs don't suck. No pianos suck, except maybe broken ones. Pianos are one of the few totally suck-free things in the world.)

+111!

The piano I play regularly and the one I really enjoy to play doesn't suck at all, regardless if it's just one day or a hundred years old.

BTW, these discussions are going to get boring to me... There are only a limited number of forum members that contribute, and after reading here for some months you know each of the members pretty well - and their distinctive opinions! So no surprises at all (Hi dewster, ChrisA, TADutchman, MacMacMac and the like)!

So I would rephrase the the statement of the TO: No, pianos (neither AP nor DP) suck - but repeatedly stating the same opinion over and over again sucks. And I don't exclude me on this statement. That's the reason why I am more and more going into read only mode and only contributing when I think I can really add something useful, which is only very occasionally the case!

I like my DP, and I'm playing it regurlarly! But I'm no longer posting regurlarly!

Have fun, everyone, and have a great Christmas time and a Happy New Year!

The videos well illustrate one advantage of digitals....the CP sounds better because it is recorded from line outs and the Shigeru is not particularly well recorded (and is too bright and in mono)...to match the CP you would need a pretty professional range of recording equipment and lots of time and skill.

Just an observation but this guy's playing, whilst no doubt dazzling in a technical sense, is just a noise to me; a fairly stressful one to listen to and almost totally lacking in anything that my brain identifies as musical. I couldn't listen beyond about two minutes on either video. There, I've said it.

Cheers,

Steve

DP costs so much less than acoustic pianos that people tend to always look for new features in every upgrade and end up upgrading way too many times for those few features they will probably never even use.

If DP would cost 15,000 bucks, you wouldn't upgrade it anytime soon

right, as a example I bought RD700GX, great keys action and look - sound not so...Year later or so they released "patch"
SN piano kit so I think should I buy it? hell no, because another few months later they made RD700GXF with patch already built in. Now I should upgrade I thought, but no - We got another version of this keyboard - RD700SN with the patch and the newer, improved key action rats race

So the alternative is?....

No development, no improvement, no innovation, no advance...

Buy what meets your needs at the time of purchase.

Steve

So what I read out of your comment is that DP builders should stop to release improvements!? You would be happy if a DP would keep unchanged for let's say 10 years so that you can tell everyone that you have the latest and greatest DP? Sorry, but I don't get it.

not at all, what I'm saying DP builders delay improvements and spread upgrades intentionally over the months or years just to keep the money flow.

I agree that Roland went a little crazy with milking the RD700 series this year!! Holy COW! But not all DP makers do this - Kawai for example put a few years between their MP series upgrades.

And I TOTALLY agree with you - computers DO suck. But dammit if you don't need 'em sometimes...

Curt

Do you know what else suck? Hoovers, they suck....Just sayin'