Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Adult Beginners Forum After Alfred's Level 1 - Am I ready for a repertoire book?

@rozina:

The Developing Artist series was Designed by the Faber duo to be the main introduction to students following the 'Piano Adventures' series, though of course it can be used by anyone. It is designed of two books per level: 1) Piano Literature and 2) Piano Sonatinas. You can begin using the Prep Book around level 2 of any children's method book (level 1 for gifted children).

The first book remains in 5-finger position, which will be a great thing to review and brush up on basics, paying particular attention to tone and musicality. You can also transpose the pieces to multiple keys to get a good finger and brain workout! However, by the end of the series, you are basically late-intermediate piano repertoire: something similar to levels 5-8 of Keith Snell.

The problem is, there is much less selection in this series than in other repertoire series, which means not only will you pretty much have to learn all the pieces, but you'll probably need more at every level. However, for a self-learner with internet access, this can be easily remedied by free online music resources.

The link I provide below has the listings of all the books. You can click on the title to find what's within each.

http://pianoadventures.com/publications/mainLibraries/devArtist.html

While technically graded, within each book, the pieces are arranged first by era, then by life-dates of composer. This shouldn't present too much of a problem because you can check the gradings on the internet, on these forums, or just by 'eye' if you can tell whether or not the next piece is more or less suitable for you than another.

I also would not recommend the "Bach Selections from AMBN" from them, as it only has a few songs. Instead, you can find those pieces online or buy another book for a few dollars more.

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All in all, they aren't bad books if you know what you're doing with your pieces, and if you seek help on these boards if it ever feels like they are getting to be 'too much' at any one point. While I do prefer other piano repertoire series, it's not because of the pieces themselves, it's simply the selections. They're great books, and you won't go wrong with getting them.

However, if you have a classics book already, I suggest just going through the table of contents on each of those books and highlighting what's already in your books and working on those first.

Rozina, you're right. Those pieces on that website jump A LOT between levels (Avalanche by Heller next to Clementi's first sonatina?!). You'd be better off from other resources, I think.

Thank you for the extensive answer, it is greatly appreciated! I will check the link for further information on the series!

I do have a follow up question regarding what you wrote in this paragraph:


Does that mean after I learn all of the pieces from one book I might not be ready for the next level book from the same series? That would be a bummer, but not that huge, since the books are not that expensive. The first two go for €10 both

The major reason why I would like to have a series like this is, because it is a pain to select your next piece to learn not having a teacher to do it for you. And I seem to overestimate my skill level when looking at new sheets. And it sucks a lot to learn a new piece and after 2-3 weeks realize you can't really finish it because it is a bit above your skill level.

I did listen to some pieces from book 1 and 2 and I must say they sound fun!

Anytime! And I'm always around to answer questions if you need help figuring out which piece would be best next for you.

In reply to your follow-up: I want to say both yes and no.

See, I'm of mind that you need a few pieces at every level that you REALLY REALLY REALLY polish. Beyond performance ready. Nit-pick at them so much you almost want to scream. Not a lot of pieces, mind you, but a handful. I believe it's incredibly useful because it forces you to really pay attention to everything you're doing and also just to learn that skill - because trust me, it IS a skill to take a piece to that quality, which isn't something you're going to learn how to do easily with only hard pieces some years from now.

But, you should also learn many other things at every level. Not to performance level, but to gain a lot of reading and practicing experience, and also the techniques with each piece (compare the Baroque Bach to Scarlatti...very different!).

One of the reasons I like the Keith Snell series is between the three books, I can find a handful of songs that kids really love and won't mind learning, while the rest can be used as throw-away and quick-study pieces.Another excellent series is Masterworks Classics:
http://www.sheetmusicplus.com/title/Masterwork-Classics-Level-1-2/3507984

However, the Faber books are a good 'diet' of repertoire if you work on both the Sonatina books (lots of fingery goodness, a la Classical style!) and the Literature books at the same time, and supplement it with Bach pieces (which you can find for free online) and a handful of other pieces. And you're right - that's why these repertoire books exist. To assist teachers (and students!) to better see levels of the repertoire in order to benefit the student in learning.

I have a few adult students. The first ones I had thought the Alfred book was boring also. I switched to the Bastien All in One as I gained new students and they have really enjoyed it.

Hello, rozina

I'm also in the self taught stage now and I'm using the Alfred's Adult All in One, Masterwork Classics, Pathways to Artistry by Catherine Rollin.

With Pathways it teaches you how to use technics and gives you pieces to play with details on where to apply each one. It comes in three levels of Technique, Repertoire, and Master Works. I just learn the technics in these pieces and move on the other series and use what I learned there.

If you have your technics down then I would suggest Masterwork Classics . It has better pieces to play and it comes in 10 levels. Book one levels 1-2, 3-10 a separate book.

Goto to sheetmusicplus.com . They usually have reviews and sample pages of a lot sheet music and books.

Martin

@MartinJB:

All songs will teach you technique. You will never have you technique 'down.' It will continue to grow and improve.

Pathways is just another example of a repertoire series, more designed like a method book, very similar to First Impressions by Dietzer, who includes study guides for all the pieces in her books and matching theory books that use the pieces as examples.

However, all the repertoire in the Pathway Repertoire book is written by Rollin herself, if I'm not mistaken...and why would you want to play Rollin when you can play Kuhlau, Turk, and Bach? Just my opinion.

II
I’m new to this. So maybe I’m not explaining this right.

You’re correct all pieces will teach you technique. I guess what I was looking for was the actual physical motion to perform it (i.e wrist lifts, arm weights, wrist rolls ect ) to get reactions.

I’ve had a couple of teachers so far and I told them in the first interview that I want to learn this right, show me everything. I’m a beginner, I don’t know better. All I got was “ok, play this” and not showing me the physical aspect of it. I just had the wrong teachers, no brainier there. There’s about three close to me and I went thru two, I'm not going for strike three. I hope that explains a little better

Someone suggested the Rollin series on the form and I purchased it. It showed me step by step physically. That’s all I use it for because you’re right again, I don’t want to play all Rollin when there’s a slew of others.

I’m trying to do this the correct way with the resources that I have which is this form and as been very helpful.

If you have any suggestion(s) on a way to proceed I would greatly appreciate any comments that you recommend.

Thank you
Martin

Thank you again for all the information!

I am very much leaning towards the Faber books at the moment. I don't mind finding extra material before going into another level as long as I know the progression in the book is the right one and the book itself wont slow me down or make it difficult to progress. I also don't mind playing all the pieces form one book, to be honest I prefer that I have a hard time selecting what will be good for me, so playing everything kinda avoids that.

I am however having seconds thoughts about the way I am going about learning to play the piano. I am basically only playing pieces. I don't dedicate much time to playing scales. I mostly play them as warmup. I focus to play them evenly tempo wise. I have only learned C and G major. And lately I have given some time to F major. I also started to play C major hands together a month ago, so I can practice playing notes at the same time. I realized I have some problem with that, since I learn every piece hands separate first and one hand can be a bit behind through a whole section or piece! I also never played any arpegio exercises. What I am beginning to think, after seeing the First impressions series you mentioned II, is that I might be doing myself harm by skipping the theory part in playing. I really like the way First impressions made. However, it is a bit too expensive for me (money is also the reason why I am not looking for a teacher).

The reason for the paragraph above is basically to hear your (a teacher's) thoughts on that way on learning on my own

@MartinJB,

No, I know what you meant I was just teasing a bit. A lot of people around here ask what the songs that will teach you...and the answer is, all of them!

I understand that you want to know the difference between wrist staccato and finger staccato, and what this arm roll will do against that arm roll...but the reality is, you don't just learn that from studying it out of a book. It comes from playing more and more music where these things are used, and seeing the differences between them. To ignore myself for a second, a technique series I love to supplement with is called 'Finger Power,' by a series by Schaum. Comes in Books 1-5.
http://www.sheetmusicplus.com/title/Schaum-Fingerpower-Level-One-Book/1564997

These books will have isolated exercises for each of the specific kinds of techniques one finds in piano music. I prefer it over other exercises like Hanons, but even then, I still don't use it too often.

Now, I know you probably disliked that your teachers didn't go over specific motions to create specific sounds with you, and that makes sense. I teach my students different attacks, but through the application of their music, not the other way around. I suppose my main point is: give it time.

I'm sure the Rollin books are great. And I'm sure she is a fine composer, too. Wouldn't hurt you to use them, as she probably wrote them with far more pedagogical uses than a lot of other pieces. But it's sometimes best not to get TOO caught up in the "what technique did I just use there?" mode.

It sounds to me like you're on the right track. I'd probably ditch Alfred's after page 120 or so since you have Rollin, and use that for your main 'method book.' Then, just keep working on your Masterworks Classics books. That would be more than enough for the 'learning techniques and repertoire' portion of the piano.

Why page 120.

Also can you suggest something else similar to Masterwork Classics.

You won't go wrong with the Faber books, but if possible, I would get the Masterworks in its place (if it's cheaper. if not, don't worry about it too much and just go with the Faber's).

The First Impressions series is really useful and great. I love its design, but in actuality, if it's too expensive, then it may not be worth it. It requires 2 books per level (repertoire and theory) for levels A-C, and 1-3, and 1 book per level at levels 4-6. Alongside each two levels is a supplemental book, Discovering Piano Literature. The repertoire books have study guides to help you pay attention to things like technique and theory. The theory has ear-training and composition and application.

Now, if it's too costly, don't worry about it. It's nothing you can't replace.

If you decide to go with the Faber's, you can easily fill in your theory from other (free) resources. One workbook I've been recently more interested in is below. You can print it for free online, in chapters, and just work your way through it. It's a nice and thorough introduction that I've just started using with an adult student who really seems to be 'getting it.'
http://www.gmajormusictheory.org/Fundamentals/workbooks.html

Of course, there are many more resources available for that too.

As for technique, I've been (very slowly!) writing a document that details how to 'go about' doing it for a self-learner. It's nothing you can't find on the internet, of course, just in one place for piano on the forum who frequently ask. What I recommend is finding out what key your pieces are in.

For example, in Faber's "Prep Piano Literature," the first song is in C major. So play C major, penta-scales (5-finger pattern), HS, then HT, gradually speeding them up throughout the week. Play the C-major triad. Play the inversions of the C-major triad. Play the one-octave scale HS, then HT. Then try a one-octave arpeggio.

Technique, however, SHOULD be a warm up. Your focus on pieces will help you greatly because that's what pieces are made up of: scales and chords! I think you're just worried that you're not 'getting to them all' fast enough, but give it time and pace it for the level you're at.

On the notes of practicing, practice however feels 'smartest' to you. That is to say, if you don't NEED to practice a piece hands separately, then don't. Spend your time drilling the parts you have trouble with. Sometimes it's a line, sometimes it's just two measures. Sometimes it's the left-hand, so you just focus on that and work it up, and then you put them hands together. There's really an endless combination of practice methods that work - it just takes trail and error and dedication and practice to figure it all out!

Because I think that after that point, the Rollins picks up nicely. However, you could probably stop as early as 115. There isn't anything wrong with finishing it, either. It just depends on what you want to focus on (I personally don't like the books, but then again, I'm a teacher who can see and supplement for a student). For a self-learn, it wouldn't be a bad idea, but the Rollins can easily replace it at that point.

I've suggested many different series here. The two I like the most are:

1) Keith Snell's Piano Repertore, Levels Prep, 1-10:
http://kjos.com/sub_section.php?division=5&series=147
http://www.sheetmusicplus.com/search?q=keith+snell+piano+repertoire
-Fundamentals of Piano Theory
-Baroque and Classical
-Romantic and Contemporary
-Etudes

These four books are the bulk of what students need, though I supplement the Contemporary portion A LOT because there is very little that students like in there (I love Jon George though, so it works out as I have a lot of pieces to give them!). On every other front, this series has almost EVERYTHING one would need to gain a good amount of technique and repertoire at many levels. However, there's absolutely no guidance within the series itself.



The one I love, and suggest to self-learners, is:
2) First Impressions
http://www.intermediatepiano.com/intermediatepianopedagogy/Mlous_books.html
http://www.sheetmusicplus.com/search?q=first+impressions

You can see my description of it above, but essentially it's composed of three books:

a) Main Repertoire book, which includes study guides for the song.
b) Theory book
c) Supplemental Music Repertoire books (Discovering Piano Literature, where each level of this matches to two levels of First Impressions).

This series can be used pretty much after page 100/115 of the Alfred AIO. It was designed to be used by Alfred's Basic (the children's series) level 2. It also moves at nice and steady pace compared to other books, which is a good thing for self-learners.




Another one that I see, but don't like as much as the First Impressions one, is: Keys to Stylistic Mastery:
http://www.sheetmusicplus.com/search?q=keys+to+stylistic+mastery

It has more songs than First Impressions per level, but only three levels, so I always feel as if it's not enough for a student. There are study guides that go along with each song, though, if I'm not mistaken.

Jon George, by the way, is a modern composer who recently passed away. He wrote many contemporary pedagogical pieces that are beautiful and fun.

http://www.sheetmusicplus.com/search?q=jon+george

Particular ones I use are:
1) A Day In The Jungle
2) the Musical Moments series
3) I've also used various 'Artistry at the Piano' books with students, but don't recommend these for self-learners

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Another modern composer I want to suggest is a forum member by the name of Elissa Milne:

http://www.sheetmusicplus.com/search?q=elissa+milne

She has some beautiful and VERY FUN pieces, particularly the 'Peppers' books.





Both of these, among many others, would do great to supplement the 'Contemporary' portion of the Keith Snell series.

@II

I'll keep at the Alfred's AIO, they have a thread on this series I can get help from.

I'm going to add the Keith Snell's Piano Repertore for a main with my Masterwork Classics.

Not feeling the Rollins pieces at least in level one for now. I'll spend just enough time to get the lesson and apply it to the mains.

Thanks for the tips.
Martin

II you have been very helpful! Thank you for that! I have a feeling your students have a great teacher

I will put some more taught into which series I should get based on availability and budget and then get one. Thank you for the free theory resource as well! And good luck with writing your own!

By the way, thanks for the rough idea on how to take on scales and arpegios. I think I will enjoy them more now

@Rozina: glad to have been helpful. Let me know what you end up deciding, I'd be interested in knowing!

@MartinJB:

The Rollins I was referring to was her 'Masterworks' book, as that is standard teaching literature. Alfed's, again, won't hurt you to continue.

As far as repertoire series goes, it's probably not worth it to have more than one. The pieces are not ones you'll get too attached to, and there will be A LOT of overlap. Choose one and stick with it, I think.

Good luck!

II,

I see now. I'll try the way you suggested.

Also are the keith scale series worth getting?

Depends. If you already have all the Masterworks, then no.

But, if you don't and you want more pieces at each level to choose from, they're really good.

There's a few note mistakes in each level, not to mention some pieces are the 'harder' ones at each level in comparison, but it's a good one.

Masterworks is great too.

Again, for a self-learner, First Impressions (or the less-used Keys to Stylistic Mastery) are probably more useful because of their study guides, but not absolutely necessary.

In the end, as long as you choose one and stick with it, you really can't go wrong.

Edited to add:
I forgot to say, for those who like to have the scales written out in a graded fashion, the Keith Snell also has a 'Scale Skills' book at each level which is really a useful tool too.

I am of the view that after any book 1 in any piano instructional series, the player can then move on to anything he wants. That is, skip book 2, 3, etc. and go right to what you want to play, and learn the rest of what you need on the job, so to speak.

The reason for this is that any book 1 seems to be designed with the above in mind. That is, some players will simply refuse to continue on into the next book and work on pieces that are seemingly not that much more difficult than the ones in book 1. So the first book in any instructional series is deliberately designed to give you all the basics of playing, so that impatient players can go from there into anything they want. (Furthermore, there is a certain hazard in continuing on in book 2 when you can't stand more of what you got in book 1, because this can turn you off to piano forever--you then might start to associate piano with tedium and drudgery, and when that happens, the chances are high that you'll eventually quit playing.)

So go ahead and play anything you want from now on and learn as you go.

This thread has been a goldmine of information and I'm glad to know I'm not the only one. II - I particularly want to thank you for all your detailed explanations which I have found extremely helpful. Your students are lucky to have found you.

I did a lot of research reading about the various repertoire series and thinking about my own development. I think my problem was that being able to play saxophone, I was not satisfied with the basic pieces in the Alfred's book & the Alfred's Greatest Hits Level 1 book. Which BTW, I'm surprised no one mentioned the Alfred's Greatest Hits. I also have the level 2 and some of the songs are really nice. I guess people here are more oriented to classical?

I realize that my problem was not being satisfied with the pieces, however I realize that each one is used to reinforce a technique learned in the method book and that I shouldn't expect too much out of them. As someone said, some pieces are just "throw away" pieces.

So first step for me is to work through all the pieces in Greatest Hits level 1 and learn from them before moving on.

Since I already purchased Alfred's Level 2, I'll use that as my method book and I'll supplement it with the Greatest Hits Level 2 and a piano repertoire series. I think a repertoire series will keep me motivated and stimulated. It will be my reward for doing a lesson from the method book.

I'm leaning towards Keith Snell's series based on the recommendations of II however it's not available here in France so I would have to order it from the US.

I haven't heard anyone talk about "Succeeding With the Masters" which is another repertoire series I read about in these forums. I'm curious what others think about that series.

The challenge for me is to find a good series here in France so that I can avoid shipping & duty costs ordering from the US. Masterworks Classics is available here in France and so far it's the only one I've seen mentioned in this thread that I can find here. So now I just have to find what is available and make my decision. If Masterworks Classics is almost as good as Keith Snell's then I may just stick with that.

Thanks to everyone who has contributed to this thread and these forums. You make it possible for self-learners. I know a teacher is best but it's not always an option for everyone and we self-learners really appreciate all the feedback from the teachers. You all are very generous with your time and your passion for the piano really shows.