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>> Now I have a question about the singing. I can sing the first cornet solo of Struttin (32 bars). Is that enough or am I supposed to do the whole thing?

Are you having fun with this? Do as much as you can. This is something you can easily do away from the piano. Just replay the solo like 10 times. First listen than try to sing along. Once you vaguely get the whole solo, start splitting it as much as it makes sense. 1, 2 or 3 bars, and try to nail it down. The key being to try and sing with the correct pitch. How well you sing isn't that relevant.

If you have transcribe!, that's very helpful for this.

>> Does he teach using the book?
Yes, you'll complete the foundation, and then move on to other things. It's kind of up to you what you want to learn, but you gotta have the foundation. Depending on your level, it might take a while to complete the 2 books. But you can start improvising very soon.

Just the Louie solos, including heads, is ok:)

DF

Hi 10
That is so kool that you've started studying Lesson 1. Have fun singing - it only gets funner. I'm up to Perhaps by Bird which is very melodic and has great phrasing.
And over time you will refine your own methodology for singing.
As Knotty said, Transcribe is great. For example, if you like, you can use the Text function and label your phrase numbers, whatever works for you.

This is absolutely the hardest thing to do without a teacher - is to gauge where you are, when you are ready to move on, and to what. What to do to make it better? Because sometimes, adding a layer of complication is *not* actually the best thing.

I think probably my natural fault is to stick doing what I am comfortable with, rather than move on. That's why I'm trying to do lots of listening, so that the repertoire is at least familiar.

Hi everyone, hi Dave!

Yes, I had fun with Struttin' but also find it quite frustrating. I realise it's a good exercise, and I remember Knotty suggested this kind of thing a long time ago. It makes me want to get my cornet out. But the thing is in a right state - the valves are all seized up, all the moving bits in fact. And I'm just physically pathetic, having borne two kids since I last played. Yes, I'm sure it would do me a lot of good, but there are only so many hours in the day, and for very few of them do I actually get to make some noise.

What gets me is that I never played jazz when I was actually physically able. And I got so bored with cornet music because there was so little written for it - except jazz.

So, having got that out... yes, I have Transcribe but I didn't use it for struttin. I've just listened on the bus, and when I took my son to Tae Kwon Do and had to wait in the car for an hour. Scat singing fills those times easily. OK, on the bus I just listened and imagined I was singing.

I will get JOI for my birthday (May), until then I am limited to the first lesson. This isn't a problem as I have lots to be doing in any case.

You're funny 10, it's great Struttin' had that effect on you !

>> I think probably my natural fault is to stick doing what I am comfortable with, rather than move on. That's why I'm trying to do lots of listening, so that the repertoire is at least familiar.

It's tough knowing what you're comfortable with, versus what you think you are comfortable with, but really repeating mistakes.
It's the issue with forums like these, there's just so much information, it's all too tempting. Also, doing hanons 10 mins / day for a year requires a bit of discipline, but it's not like you're doing the same one every day, or at the same tempo. So it should always feel challenging. In Joi, Dave explains sustain vs challenge tempo.

Tlt,
I think you found the perfect time to practice singing with solos. If the music gets too fast, you can re-record it on your ipod via transcribe and do the same you're doing now.

I've reached a compromise with myself. I hoovered about a tonne of dust off the old case and made this recording with the mouthpiece:

http://www.box.net/shared/rnsfi82krn

I'll practice with the mouthpiece for a week, and then decide if I want to get the cornet reconditioned. There was something about listening to Louis that I can't quite explain, but I needed to tongue it. To feel that buzz in my lips. Singing's no good.

Miles Davis never did that to me.

Now that I think about it knotty, I can even take my laptop with me to Tae Kwon Do and use transcribe there. It is so useful just to be able to play the one phrase again and again till you get it.

>> Now that I think about it knotty, I can even take my laptop with me to Tae Kwon Do and use transcribe there. It is so useful just to be able to play the one phrase again and again till you get it.

sounds good.
I learned that solo probably 2 years ago, and I still can sing it for you note for note. When you take away all the stuff around Louis, like banjo, bad recording quality, clarinets etc... it sounds surprisingly modern...
I did use the piano a lot to find out the pitches. Maybe that's cheating

btw, I'll listen to the cornet recording a little later. Got the tuner in here giving me a headache

Hi TLT, welcome to joy of improv. So good to have another recruit. Also joing the discussion on the Joy thread. Maybe one day it will be as big as this one

guys there are actually so many versions of strutting w/o some bbq on youtube. which one did you use to transcribe?

got mine from the album with the same title.

Me too. Mine turned out to be on my mp3 player already.

Hi saiman, I didn't know about that thread. I haven't been on the non-classical thread for a long time.

Tlt ,

That was awesome. Sounds like you really got it. This one isn't about speed at all, so feel free to take it slow. In fact, the slower you get, the tougher it is.

Really entertaining, I can't wait for the next one.
Which one will it be?

Hi Knotty, maybe I should try it slower then? I just put the metronome to the same speed as my recording. As for next, I've had some Lester Young suggested to me. I've got 5 hours on the train ahead of me tomorrow, so I might make a start then.

It really is an amazing thing, because now I know where I am putting each and every note in that solo. When I started I couldn't hear anything. There was no sense. But I had to listen to it a lot for that to happen.

Yes, it somethin' else, isn't it?

You can do one or more Louis if you got it.
Lester Young, you definitely want to spend some time on. Not all of Lester Young (Prez) is top notch, though. He had some hard days. So pick carefully ...

Hey 10
I thought your Struttin' was awesome too. You are really getting into this singing thing.
btw is there any instrument you DON"T play ?!

Hi folks

It's taking time to progress. I have a question though relating to the next stage I am moving on to now adding in chord tones.
Jazzwee said back page 55.


I have 4 chord tones per octave. 1, 3, 5, 7.
When I move up an octave do I repeat 1357 or do I add in 9, 11, 13

Is there rules around fingering for arps. What finger where?
I read the above post just now and it made me think there is some rules to follow to make fast playing possible?

Here is latest recording. Focus on quavers into third off beat emphasis, legato, 3rd / chord tone left ringing. some repeat note and some chord arp.

http://www.box.net/shared/4qrohptgiv

http://www.box.net/shared/nabczgup7p

I think I tried one maybe two arp/chord tones in second one.

Sory about background noise. have 4 pixies

SC

Great work SC. Second one was cleaner the first.

Issues on the first one where (a) not being in the groove, (b) there were times when you lost the offbeat emphasis so the downbeat came out more and those times also made it lose legato.

Less occurrence on #2

I'm just impressed with your progress here. As individual phrases they are certainly harmonically appropriate at all times. After a while, these patterns will stand out in your ear and you will be able repeat portions of this when needed.


NEXT STEP

Taking you off track for a moment, let's break your approach a little and you will hear more phrasing possibilities. Add these two elements. Think about how you are going add the elements while maintaining the rest the same.

(a) Start with a chord tone on the downbeat and make it a long note, sometimes quarter somethings half. This also gives you time to think about what to do next.

(b) Double some notes. How about starting the line with two quarter notes (same chord tone) on the downbeat?

Don't forget - quarters are played short (like a dotted eighth). Half notes you can let ring.

Don't accent the downbeats here.

(c) Learn to put space in different parts of the beat, not just around beat 3 to 4+. You are not obligated to play on the first part of the beat or anywhere. Now you already have space here but the space should occur naturally like breathing. Not just tied to a chord progression. For example, when you let something ring, it's a good time to not play anything after.

All this requires some thinking as it shakes away the mechanics of what you just did (3rds, neighbor tones, etc.) But it makes you think of the big melodic feature.