Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Digital Pianos - Electronic Pianos - Synths & Keyboards CA93 vs LX-10 vs. LX-10F

Please help this intermediate piano player choose a digital piano! I've done a ton of research (I think I've read every forum post from the past 6-12 months), and I've tried nearly every Yamaha (CVP & CLP), Roland (HP30X, RD-700NX, V-Piano) and Kawai keyboard out there (twice). Here are my requirements in priority order:

• Great piano sound & feel
• For home use, desire a cabinet & speakers (avoid the mess of separate speakers & wires)
• My budget allows me to buy any piano, but want to get good value. I've found that $3.5k-$5k models best meets my needs, and everything above seems unnecessary.
• Would like to practice against a rhythm section (I'm terrible playing with other musicians)
• Play around with some sequencing/garageband (but this is very secondary).

I'm in the home stretch but am having difficulty making the final choice (there are some fine pianos available)

I've narrowed it down to these:

CA93
Pros: sounds great with clear tones (especially at the low range), solid keyboard, 100+ style rhythms, sound board
Cons: Limited & less interesting sounds/instruments (only 80)
Cost: $4,000

LX-10
Pros: My favorite keyboard feel, sounds great with clear tones, many instruments and interesting sounds
Cons: no rhythms included, older keyboard & sound technology
Cost: $3,400 (heavily discounted to make way for newer models)

LX-10F
Pros: Really intrigued by this since it combines the great sound system of the LX-10 with the newer Supernatural sounds and keyboard.
Cons: I've never played this and wonder if it's worth the wait.
Cost: unknown, but maybe $5k?

Thoughts on other models:
HP307 - supernatural piano sounds great thru headphones, but disappointed by weak speaker system that muddies the sound

V-Piano - best sounding piano, but no cabinet & speakers, not worth the extra cost ($6k total) for me

CLP-380 - great sounding piano, but more expensive than comparable Roland/Kawai

RD-700NX - great sounding piano, provides rhythm section, but no cabinet & speakers, concerned about note stealing problem

CVP509 - stunningly beautiful piano with incredibly realistic instruments (the best I've heard), but the 2x cost ($8k) not really worth it since you're paying for the sequencer/arranger and this technology becomes outdated quickly. More cost effective (& newer technology) by connecting to a computer.

My Questions:

• Given my criteria what would you buy?
  
• How much better is the LX-10F vs. the LX-10? Is the LX10-F worth the $1500 price difference I would expect to pay?
  
• Have I overlooked anything?

Thanks for any help you can offer!

LX-10 vs LX-10F ; yes - 10F is worth the extra money. Better keys and much better sound engine. If you're going to spend a lot on a high end home model , you want to end up with the best and not yesterdays technology.

CA-93 - also nice. You should try them, because it can also be a matter of taste, apart from the technical details . One is based on Steinway sound, the other on Kawai grands.

I wouldn't buy the LX-10. The LX-10F is a LOT better sounding and feeling. The CA-93 is pretty close to the LX-10F - for me they are of equal quality, except I like them in different ways.

Just checked prices for a direct comparison: in Europe I see a price difference of 1300 Euro! Simply using Thomann as a reference, I saw the LX-10F for 4299 Euro and the CA93 for 2999 Euro.

Given that you want "no separate speakers & wires", I think you should look at a Roland RG-1F, a mini-grand style piano.

Most consoles don't sound very good because the don't have an adequate sound system. The RG and some others mini-grands do.

Yes, I think the LX-10F is about 500 Euro overpriced. The LX-10F has more features than the Kawai, but in a value for money play-off, I'd take the Kawai. If they were the same price, or if there were only 500Euro difference, it would be a very close race. I think the LX-10F deserves to be 500Euro dearer just because of its cabinet - it's a beautiful design and a really nice piece of furniture. The CA-93 isn't ugly, but it's not as special to look at as the Roland.

CA-93 is not polished. CS3 is the first Kawai that is, perhaps the other model will follow. Looks so much nicer...

When comparing the Roland's ~300 tones to the Kawai's ~80 tones, the big number doesn't mean a whole lot...it's really about usable tones. However, the LX-10F has their grand piano designer which allows you to play with the modeling parameters to make custom acoustic piano tones. This could really swing the number of tones you actually use towards the Roland. The piano designer is nowhere near as powerful as the V-piano options, but it definitely gives you range.

BTW, where are you located? The LX-10F started showing up about 7 months ago. Also, for a really sophisticated backup band, check out Roland BK-7m. I hate to sound like a Roland commercial, but it was so cool.

Agree, I like as much usable tones as possible.

Disagree.

From hands-on experience, that piano designer is just okay (i.m.h.o. the marketing specs look better on paper), but in practice nowhere near as powerful or flexible as the Virtual Technician of the Kawai CA93 for developing completely new Acoustic Piano tones, dynamic E-Pianos and other new involving timbres. Don't believe it? Just check out the thread given below (including the user experiences and reviews), print out the presets list given in the first post (last update of 26 February) and go for a testdrive in a Kawai music store. You'll be amazed!

https://www.pianoworld.com/forum/ubb...0for%20KAWAI%20CA93/CA6.html#Post1448603

First off thanks for all your suggestion! I really appreciate them all.

Some of my thoughts about all your points.


I haven't seen this is at any of the local Bay Area dealers. It looks great. Is it worth the huge step up in price? I see it online for $7k, compared to $4-5k for the CA93 / LX-10F which both sound quite good.

It's a good point, but I doubt I'll spend much time actually fiddling with the sound dynamics. I'm just not inspired by it. Or maybe I'm just lazy.


The dealer showed me this in the catalog and I'm really interested in it. This influenced my decision to eliminate the top end arranger/sequencer pianos like the CVP509 (since I can just add this to other pianos and upgrade every few years as the technology improves). Has anyone seen or tried it? And will this work with the CA93 or just Roland pianos? I assume that's it's midi and so should work with either.

And again, thanks to everyone for your 2 cents. I really appreciate it.

Re: finding a Roland RG ...

I tried an RG-1 back in the fall of 2009. It was tagged at $7000, but the dealer was quick to offer it at $5000. (I liked it a lot, but I couldn't spend that much.) I presume that the RG-1F is similar in function, and (probably) in price.

This was at a "piano and organ" shop, a modest sized store with a dozen or so small grands on the floor and a similar number of Roland digitals, ranging from the HP-201 to the RG-1.

Most shops here specialize in just one brand of digital. his shop had only Roland. There's a LARGE shop here with only Yamaha, and another with only Kawai. Each maker has a "dealer locator" on its web site. Without that, finding what you want is hit-or-miss.

Does LX10F have the same keyboard problem as the others in the Roland line up? I reffer to to the wearing issue of the surface of the keyboard within few months...

Thanks for sharing. I had not had the opportunity to explore their Virtual Technician. I have had good luck with piano designer, but in comparing the thoughts of others from that thread, perhaps the range of the modeling variables on the piano designer is not so wide as effects in the Virtual Technician. That would make sense in how they are applied.
......
The LX-10F does have their better textured keytops, and yes there have been several reports of wear. The good news there is that the same reports had happy endings. Good service from Roland & a 5 year warranty just in case.
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I would guess that the BK-7m will work with the Kawai, but I would check into it. That might be your best solution to still be within $5k overall.

Regarding the Roland BK-7m, I do not have any experience with this module, however I believe FrankDaddy was considering one to pair up with his MP6, so it may be worth sending him a PM to find out how he's getting on.

Cheers,
James
x

I keep watching your posts in particular for any hint of a release of the CA113. I love my CA63 but if/when the CA113 comes to market I would find it hard not to upgrade. I know you can't confirm anything even if you know what is in the pipeline from Kawai; I'm just happy to try and read between the lines.