So for those of you that have seen my numerous posts, you know I've been looking for a new stage setup. I'm currently playing in a Jazz quartet and a second gig accompanying a singer playing pop music.

I have an ES7 but the lack of a good weighted keyboard is really hampering my ability to play with the nuance I want.

I've looked at the CP5, RD700NX and Nord Piano. They are all fine but have compromises. I like the CP5 in many ways (nice action) but the pianos becomes very sterile and bland to my ears after playing for a while, it is almost to perfect.

The RD700NX has a great keyboard feel, the sounds are very complex; so much going on that it is almost distracting. The keybed wear issue is real and it does not appear Roland is going to permanently address it. The polyphony issue also gives me pause because with the vocal accompaniment gig I may want to use background audio. Again Roland is not addressing this issue.

I really like the Nord Piano but it is truly a one-trick pony. No ability to split, no bass or organ sounds and a limit of 500MB for all samples.

In this day and age it seems crazy to me that hardware synths/pianos are so limited in RAM and DRAM. The Nord Bosi piano is fantastic but I'm not sure it compares with the large sample libraries available for softsyths. I own True Pianos (modeling), the pianos from Komplete and Galaxy Gold. These libraries are really huge and there is so much more going on within these. I think korg is on the right track with SD but it needs to really open up. Why put a 4GB piano and a 40MB Violin.

Anyway, I'm removing the "looking for the right sound" from the equation. I think this is easiest. I'm now considering the CP33. It has a good feel, is solid, some master controller capabilities and the sounds can be used in a pinch. The weight is reasonable as well. Lastly I can get it under the $900 mark.

That leaves money for a new notebook computer if I want for the softsynths. I also allows me to purchase a Kronos non-weighted or Motif XS rack or use my existing ES7 if I need more sounds. Yes, there are more moving parts but I think the flexibility is worth it.

I'm just wondering if there is anything comparable to the CP33 as a controller that also has decent sounds in the sub $900 price range.

Any comments would be greatly appreciated.

This is the hard truth (for some) when it comes down to it. That's why whenever I get asked about what I think of the NP88 and would I recommend it, I'm very careful to point out that the NP88 suits my needs as a piano player who wanted great piano sounds and EPs, with light weight and flexibility. The NP88 isn't for everyone.

As for your choice on the CP33, I think that's a great choice. It's a solid board no doubt. It seems like a great choice for you and with the price, it's kind of in a league of it's own for your needs.

Good luck Rick!

I have a CP-33 which I have used for a number of live performances and I'm very happy with it. Rather than having several hundred different patches, 95% of which you would never use Yamaha decided to create a small number of patches ( I think it is 28 ) but each of them is of high quality. The patches I use are the piano, electric piano, organ and clav. One thing I've noticed is how well the sounds cut through the mix.

I've found it very easy to transition between playing the CP-33 and an acoustic piano, the action may not be exactly the same as that of a grand piano but it's not a big adjustment.

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Dave, thanks for the feedback. It is greatly appreciated. So you feel the CP50 keyboard action is better then the CP33, more piano like?

Also, I do not know why soft pianos as a whole would be any more thin or brittle then the same samples placed in a DP. It really would depend on the A/D converters I guess.

I cannot remember who makes the piano samples for nord but that company also directly sells some of those sampled pianos and they are bigger in size then what is in the Nord. My understanding is the Nord folks take these libraries and "slim" them down by removing some components. I'm going to assume the full sample set in most cases played through a computer should either be better or no worse then the slimed down instrument in the Nord.

I'm pretty sure Nord produce most - if not all - the main acoustic pianos/EP sounds used in their instruments themselves...and in my opinion they do a pretty stella job (shame there's still no Pianet sound available...)!

The only exceptions are some of the Nord Sample Libraries (Chamberlin, Mellotron, etc.), which are licensed from other companies/studios.

I could be completely wrong of course, but I do not recall ever reading that Nord purchases their main sounds from a software piano company. I'd be interested if you could find a source for that claim though...

Cheers,
James
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I'm not one to start rumors but for what it is worth, take a look at this link. These are old, not sure there is any arrangement today.

http://www.northernsounds.com/forum/show...71232335ed903bc

http://www.sampletekk.com/products.php?cat=44

http://discussions.apple.com/thread.jspa?threadID=2218518

http://www.kvraudio.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=4139429

rickshapiro, thank you for posting the first forum link - it looks like I stand corrected.

However, it's perhaps worth noting that the forum post is from 2005, so it's possible that the situation has changed in recent years - especially with the introduction of their V5 piano libraries.

Still, interesting find - thanks again for the link.

Cheers,
James
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I just do not want the Nord comment to take away from my point that a purely unprocessed a sample set played from a hardware keyboard should not be that much different then a computer and the difference would be in the A/D converters.

Also, I'm not disparaging Nord in anyway. The NP is probably by first choice in a dedicated DP.

I think James is right in regards to the v5 Nord Piano Library being their own.

http://www.clavia.se/main.asp?tm=Libraries

As for the topic, honest to God, I almost suggested you go for the CP50 instead for the better built in sounds, but since you are using it as mostly a controller, I didn't bother to bring it up. If I hadn't gone for the NP88, the CP50/MP6 would have been my next choices. Dave Ferris knows where to find the CP50 for ~$1300 which is a killer deal for the CP50.

I thought about the CP50 but I'm wondering if the touch is better then the CP33. I know many people found the CP50 keyboard to actually be better then the CP5 in weight. It is also a shame that Yamaha did not put on two mod wheels, something that a dedicated controller would typically have. Although I have not compared dimensions it seems like the CP50 is much larger in size and weight then the CP33. The CP50 is tempting though, would be about $500 more then the CP33 even at Dave's price. I'm going to assume the sounds in the CP50 are better then those in the CP33.

I'm also thinking that the RD300NX might be the right choice. If the keybed is anything like the NX (without the wear issue) it would be perfect. The 700NX really does feel good. The RD300NX also contains everything to make it a viable controller. Will not know for a couple of months (really sucks).

Yeah I think for your needs, you'd probably be fine with just the CP33. It's a good solid board, light weight, and serves the purpose you need.

As for the RD-300NX, the action is the Ivory Feel-G, while the RD-700NX is the PHAIII Ivory Feel, which is a different action altogether. Dave Ferris played both, so perhaps ask him his thoughts on the differences.

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The "library" may be there own, but most if not all the samples are licensed:

http://www.clavia.se/main.asp?tm=Libraries&cllibr=Nord_Sample_Library

I verified with sampletekk that most of the pianos are theirs being used by nord under license. I own the C7 sampletekk and it is the exact piano from the nord demos on their site if I play the same music. Sampletekk said that they did a good job making the overall/release samples smaller for the nord. But even though they are smaller, they sound excellent, and the nord has string resonance and pedal noise, where you need extra software for the sampletekks to get these features (i use logic esx24). :-)

To be honest, I'm quite amazed at the similar quality. The sampletekk is over 10 gigs and the nord less than 200MB. Talk about compression and/or editing!? But the difference is almost impossible to hear (although I don't own a nord to test, I've heard the release samples can be heard 'looping').

I chose the CP-50 over the NP and SV-1. Loved the NP but a bit pricey and I needed some other sounds. The CP-50 only comes with one AP but it's killer. Only one rhodes but it's great as well. Overall I've been very impressed with the sound quality. When I got it home I was very surprised that it sounded much better than anticipated. In GC it was connected to a low budget keyboard amp. Didn't sound bad but way better on my studio monitors. I was seriously considering a cp-33 because of the price. But I played a cp-300 for 3 years and was a bit tired of that sample. I am actually in the minority of people who like the LED's. It shows up great in the dark, if you're playing in low lighted venues. The action is terrific, very smooth, feels like a piano. Overall I'm very happy with the purchase. The CP-50 is very portable. Built solid.