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#1636425 - 03/08/11 09:19 AM my take on some Kawai DPs - what do you think?
annlee Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/10/11
Posts: 14
Loc: North Carolina
Hi everyone,

I had a chance to go to Raleigh this past weekend and sample some Kawai DPs. I forgot to bring my notes with me, so I was really just going off what I felt and heard. Here are my observations:

CN32 - felt like a keyboard
CN42 - felt like a keyboard
ES6 - liked the feel better than the CN32 & CN42. Tone was nice too, but without a cabinet it doesn't feel like a piano, especially when I'm letting loose on bigger pieces.
CN23 - Pretty decent overall, but wish it had a heavier action. One of the keys was not sounding so that concerned me.
CE200 - Felt like I was playing a piano (almost)! Something a little artificial about the sound tho.
CP139 - Liked the action here as well, but the bass notes felt strangely springy. Far more bells and whistles than I need.

I wish there had been a CA and a CN33 or CN43 for me to try. But if I had to choose from the above, I would go with the CE200 or the CN23. Does anyone have any comments about these two models, or any of the others? It took awhile to really isolate the touch and tone of the models and compare them, so I'm curious whether other people's assessments are similar or different from mine.

When I asked the dealer some basic questions (because I had forgotten my notes) he couldn't even tell me the answers off-hand but had to look up the info first. When I asked about the current models he didn't know about that either and just told me to go to the website. This is the second dealer I have been to in NC that does not seem to be very knowledgeable. Thank goodness for these forums!

Anna
North Carolina, USA
_________________________
Currently working on:
Bach, WTC1 Prelude & Fugue in D Major
Mozart, Twinkle Twinkle Variations
Schubert, Impromptu No. 2 in A flat, Op. 142
Ravel, Vales Nobles et Sentimentales

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#1636492 - 03/08/11 10:56 AM Re: my take on some Kawai DPs - what do you think? [Re: annlee]
rickshapiro Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/15/08
Posts: 171
I'm amazed you have a dealer that carries so much Kawai DP equipment. I live in a very densely populated area (Central NJ) and have been unable to find a MP6 to demo.

I even sent an email to Kawai a few weeks ago asking them to help locate one for me. It fell on deaf years with no response.


Edited by rickshapiro (03/08/11 10:57 AM)
_________________________
Music Hack

Nord NP88,Yamaha Motif ES7, Ensoniq KS32, Brodmann 187 Grand, JV2080, GR20, JV90, MKS-20, Sonar S1, Reaper, ACID, Record/Reason, Samplitude, VOX Tonelab, Tech21 Power Engine, NI, Kore, True Piano, Sampletank, Komplete, Bluesky Studio Monitors Yamaha 01X, Line 6 HD500, tons of guitars.

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#1636514 - 03/08/11 11:26 AM Re: my take on some Kawai DPs - what do you think? [Re: annlee]
Kawai James Online   content
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 5089
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Hello anniee,

Originally Posted By: anniee
CN32 - felt like a keyboard
CN42 - felt like a keyboard
ES6 - liked the feel better than the CN32 & CN42. Tone was nice too, but without a cabinet it doesn't feel like a piano, especially when I'm letting loose on bigger pieces.


It's perhaps worth noting that the CN32, CN42, and ES6 all share exactly the same keyboard action (AHA IV-F).

Originally Posted By: anniee
CN23 - Pretty decent overall, but wish it had a heavier action.


The CN23 utilises the new 'RH' action. How did you feel it compared to the older action in the CN32/CN42/ES6?

Originally Posted By: anniee
CE200 - Felt like I was playing a piano (almost)! Something a little artificial about the sound tho.


Yes, the CE200 utilises a very nice wooden-key action, although as you noticed, the sound technology is perhaps a little dated compared to the latest instruments.

Originally Posted By: anniee
CP139 - Liked the action here as well, but the bass notes felt strangely springy. Far more bells and whistles than I need.


The CP139 utilises the 'RM3 Grand' wooden-key action (a newer, improved version of the 'AWA Grand PRO II' action used in the CE200). The bass notes have counterweights added to the front of the keys (like an acoustic), this helps to lighten their weight (resulting in a more uniform weighting) when playing pianissimo.

Originally Posted By: anniee
I wish there had been a CA and a CN33 or CN43 for me to try.


Yes, the current generation pianos are a considerable improvement over the older models. The CA63/CA93 and CN33 are very popular among PW forum visitors.

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

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#1636515 - 03/08/11 11:27 AM Re: my take on some Kawai DPs - what do you think? [Re: annlee]
Kawai James Online   content
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 5089
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
rickshapiro, may I ask which address you sent the email too?

My colleagues at Kawai America are usually very prompt with their email responses, as I'm sure other PW members here will attest.

Please note however, that within the US, the MP6/MP10 models fall into a slightly different category to the traditional console-type digital pianos, and are perhaps less likely to be stocked by traditional piano dealers.

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

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#1636526 - 03/08/11 11:39 AM Re: my take on some Kawai DPs - what do you think? [Re: Kawai James]
rickshapiro Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/15/08
Posts: 171
Originally Posted By: Kawai James
rickshapiro, may I ask which address you sent the email too?

My colleagues at Kawai America are usually very prompt with their email responses, as I'm sure other PW members here will attest.

Please note however, that within the US, the MP6/MP10 models fall into a slightly different category to the traditional console-type digital pianos, and are perhaps less likely to be stocked by traditional piano dealers.

Kind regards,
James
x


productsupport@kawaius.com
_________________________
Music Hack

Nord NP88,Yamaha Motif ES7, Ensoniq KS32, Brodmann 187 Grand, JV2080, GR20, JV90, MKS-20, Sonar S1, Reaper, ACID, Record/Reason, Samplitude, VOX Tonelab, Tech21 Power Engine, NI, Kore, True Piano, Sampletank, Komplete, Bluesky Studio Monitors Yamaha 01X, Line 6 HD500, tons of guitars.

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#1636550 - 03/08/11 12:11 PM Re: my take on some Kawai DPs - what do you think? [Re: Kawai James]
annlee Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 02/10/11
Posts: 14
Loc: North Carolina
Kawai James -

Thank you so much for your comments and clarification! I had a feeling that I was probably interpreting some things wrong (like the action of the ES6 vs the CN32 & CN42.)

I did prefer the action of the CN23 to the older CNs. So the action of the CN33 and CN43 is the same as the CN23? If so, I might be looking to a CA, because I don't think the CN is going to quite satisfy me.

I think I had read elsewhere that wooden vs. non-wooden isn't really a big deal, but to me the wooden key really felt more like a real piano. (And while I was playing I wasn't aware which had wooden keys, so it's not just a psychological effect.)Am I off base here or is there really something about the wooden key?

Anna
North Carolina, USA


Edited by annlee (03/08/11 12:22 PM)
_________________________
Currently working on:
Bach, WTC1 Prelude & Fugue in D Major
Mozart, Twinkle Twinkle Variations
Schubert, Impromptu No. 2 in A flat, Op. 142
Ravel, Vales Nobles et Sentimentales

Top
#1636566 - 03/08/11 12:28 PM Re: my take on some Kawai DPs - what do you think? [Re: annlee]
egallego Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/08/10
Posts: 137
Loc: Spain
Anna, given your playing level and what you are looking for, I guess you should try the CA63/93 Kawai.

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#1636952 - 03/08/11 09:05 PM Re: my take on some Kawai DPs - what do you think? [Re: annlee]
Kawai James Online   content
5000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 5089
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Hello annlee,

Originally Posted By: annlee
So the action of the CN33 and CN43 is the same as the CN23?


Well, all three models use essentially the same 'Responsive Hammer' (RH) action, however the CN33 and CN43 feature 'let-off' simulation which may add a little extra friction to the keystroke when playing pianissimo.

Originally Posted By: annlee
I think I had read elsewhere that wooden vs. non-wooden isn't really a big deal, but to me the wooden key really felt more like a real piano. (And while I was playing I wasn't aware which had wooden keys, so it's not just a psychological effect.)Am I off base here or is there really something about the wooden key?


Well, every player has their own individual preference. Some folks don't believe the wooden keys make a difference, others (namely Kawai CA owners...) absolutely swear by them. I believe the material of the key is important. Plastics are strong, relatively inexpensive, and can be moulded into practically any shape, making an ideal material for uniform, mass produced components like piano keys. However, there's just something about wood, and the fact that it's an organic material that appeals to me.

However, it's not enough to simply substitute plastic keys for wood and expect the whole action to immediate feel more realistic. The mechanism and the way the key moves is also very important. Kawai's wooden-key digital piano actions adopt a number of acoustic-piano like characteristics, all of which combine to give the instrument a more authentic feeling. I could go into more detail, however I'm weary that this particular post is beginning to sound like a sales pitch - and that's not my intention. Instead, I recommend reading the following blog post from Tom Love, one of my colleagues at Kawai America, where he outlines the benefits of Kawai's wooden-key actions:

http://kawaius.com/main_links/Blog/entries/wooden_keys.html

You may also wish to watch the CA93/CA63 product videos that demonstrate the 'RM3 Grand' wooden-key action:

http://kawaius.com/main_links/digital/CA_2010/ca93_demovid-overview-1.html

I hope this helps.

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

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