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#1660586 - 04/15/11 11:00 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: cardguy]
Pogorelich. Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 4610
Loc: not somewhere over the rainbow
Originally Posted By: cardguy
Originally Posted By: stores
Look people...let's get over the "Skippy" thing already, eh? It's not a racist term... it's not an insult... it's not anything more than if I'd said, "Settle down, buddy". Does anyone want to call me Skippy? Feel free. If not, then let's drop it.


Two things I respect about you is your piano ability and the fact that you've never denied being an SOB, at least that I've seen. Claiming that "Skippy" was something just shy of a term of endearment is just plain disingenuous in my opinion

Just to add, I don't consider "dude" an insult. It's usually a friendly term between co-equals.


Seriously, who gives a [censored]? Calm down people. The world isn't ending because of the word "skippy".

Christ Jesus.
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"The eyes can mislead, the smile can lie, but the shoes always tell the truth."

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#1660595 - 04/15/11 11:11 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Batuhan]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 20186
Loc: New York City
Some members, me included, don't like it when other members are continually nasty/arrogant/obnoxious.

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#1660600 - 04/15/11 11:17 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Batuhan]
Pogorelich. Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 4610
Loc: not somewhere over the rainbow
Nobody is being arrogant or nasty or obnoxious. Actually you, PL can be and have been all of those things - but so what?

Get over it... I would.
_________________________

"The eyes can mislead, the smile can lie, but the shoes always tell the truth."

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#1660607 - 04/15/11 11:28 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: pianoloverus]
Butters109 Offline
Full Member

Registered: 01/12/09
Posts: 207
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
Some members, me included, don't like it when other members are continually nasty/arrogant/obnoxious.


I would say hypersensitivity, to the point of creating drama where there isn't any to begin with, is more obnoxious than any "slur" mentioned in this topic.

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#1660623 - 04/15/11 11:52 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Pogorelich.]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 20186
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: Pogorelich.
Nobody is being arrogant or nasty or obnoxious. Actually you, PL can be and have been all of those things - but so what?

Get over it... I would.
There's a big difference between using an inappropriate tone occasionally and doing so regularly.

How would you describe the tone of your "get over it"? Appropriate talk to someone I think you know is several times your age?

I am certainly not the first person to say that stores' posts often can be described using the adjectives I gave.

I think you should consider that what an older person finds obnoxious or inappropriate tone may not be what a 20 year old person finds that way.

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#1660813 - 04/15/11 04:56 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Batuhan]
DameMyra Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/21/04
Posts: 2047
Loc: South Jersey
Boy, did this thread go off into left field. BTW, did anyone notice that the OP doesn't seem to be streaming his practice anymore.
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MTNA/NJMTA/SJMTA

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#1660834 - 04/15/11 05:50 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: pianoloverus]
stores Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/09
Posts: 6648
Loc: Here, as opposed to there
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus


How would you describe the tone of your "get over it"? Appropriate talk to someone I think you know is several times your age?





See, right here is where you cross the line. No one cares how old you are. It's a completely irrelevant factor, but I'm not the least bit surprised that you would bring it up. Get over it.
_________________________

"And if we look at the works of J.S. Bach — a benevolent god to which all musicians should offer a prayer to defend themselves against mediocrity... -Debussy

"It's ok if you disagree with me. I can't force you to be right."

♪ ≠ $


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#1660989 - 04/16/11 12:07 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Batuhan]
Pogorelich. Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 4610
Loc: not somewhere over the rainbow
I have no idea how old you are, so why should I change the "tone" (and over the internet how do you do that anyway) of how I talk to you? You are a member to me, like everybody else - an equal. I talk to you the way I would talk to anybody. I don't bow to people according to their age. It's who they are that matters. But anyway... this place seems to love drama and overly-sensitive people strive for it usually. So let's just let it go, shall we?
_________________________

"The eyes can mislead, the smile can lie, but the shoes always tell the truth."

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#1661093 - 04/16/11 05:54 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Pogorelich.]
Batuhan Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/21/09
Posts: 965
Loc: Istanbul
Originally Posted By: Pogorelich.
I have no idea how old you are, so why should I change the "tone" (and over the internet how do you do that anyway) of how I talk to you? You are a member to me, like everybody else - an equal. I talk to you the way I would talk to anybody. I don't bow to people according to their age. It's who they are that matters. But anyway... this place seems to love drama and overly-sensitive people strive for it usually. So let's just let it go, shall we?


If you ask me im 18.
_________________________
Sorry for my English, I know it sucks, but I'm trying to improve.


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#1661114 - 04/16/11 07:06 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Pogorelich.]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 20186
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: Pogorelich.
I have no idea how old you are, so why should I change the "tone" (and over the internet how do you do that anyway) of how I talk to you? You are a member to me, like everybody else - an equal. I talk to you the way I would talk to anybody. I don't bow to people according to their age. It's who they are that matters. But anyway... this place seems to love drama and overly-sensitive people strive for it usually. So let's just let it go, shall we?
I'm surprised you didn't know that I am several times your age as my age has come up occasionally before although not in the way I've mentioned it in this thread. My post has nothing to do with "bowing" to people because of their age. But I think when polite people talk to someone many times their age they talk politely. Do you talk to your grandparents the same way you talk to a 20 year old friend?

The post in this thread that I and others(long before I said anything)complained about was, I think, of inappropriate tone no matter what the ages of the posters.

"Tone" of post is determined by the words used...the content of the post. It doesn't have to mean the sound of the words.

What one person might consider "overly sensitive" can be a completely reasonable or even thick skinned reaction to another person. I do think there is a general lack of sensitivity on internet postings where some people talk far differently from the way they'd in face to face conversation.


Edited by pianoloverus (04/16/11 08:48 AM)

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#1661137 - 04/16/11 09:32 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Batuhan]
Pogorelich. Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 4610
Loc: not somewhere over the rainbow
Fine. I will always be careful when I talk to you. I never want to get people upset, especially if I don't even mean it. That's just how I talk.

And I don't have grandparents. Haven't had them since I was 12.

Like I said, I don't treat people differently according to their age but according to what kind of person they are, not how old they are. I have always been like this and don't intend to change.

P.S. My teacher is in his mid-sixties. We talk to each other like friends (and he swears almost as much as I do, btw, it's hilarious). Not one person looking down on the other because they are younger. That doesn't make sense to me.


Edited by Pogorelich. (04/16/11 09:37 AM)
_________________________

"The eyes can mislead, the smile can lie, but the shoes always tell the truth."

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#1661144 - 04/16/11 09:50 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Pogorelich.]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 20186
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: Pogorelich.
Fine. I will always be careful when I talk to you. I never want to get people upset, especially if I don't even mean it. That's just how I talk.

And I don't have grandparents. Haven't had them since I was 12.

Like I said, I don't treat people differently according to their age but according to what kind of person they are, not how old they are. I have always been like this and don't intend to change.

P.S. My teacher is in his mid-sixties. We talk to each other like friends (and he swears almost as much as I do, btw, it's hilarious). Not one person looking down on the other because they are younger. That doesn't make sense to me.
It's not a question of one person looking down on another.

You know your teacher's personality and that him likes to swear. But before you got to know him would/did you speak to him the same way? If you found out he didn't like swearing would you speak the same way to him? Were you "always like this and don't intend to change" even when you were 15?


Edited by pianoloverus (04/16/11 09:52 AM)

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#1661148 - 04/16/11 09:59 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Pogorelich.]
cardguy Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/17/08
Posts: 977
Originally Posted By: Pogorelich.
Fine. I will always be careful when I talk to you. I never want to get people upset, especially if I don't even mean it. That's just how I talk.

And I don't have grandparents. Haven't had them since I was 12.

Like I said, I don't treat people differently according to their age but according to what kind of person they are, not how old they are. I have always been like this and don't intend to change.

P.S. My teacher is in his mid-sixties. We talk to each other like friends (and he swears almost as much as I do, btw, it's hilarious). Not one person looking down on the other because they are younger. That doesn't make sense to me.


I'm 60 and I'd rather earn respect than have it accorded to me automatically. That said, I am instinctively respectful to those older than I am. Maybe that *is* a generational thing as I don't see younger types doing much of that.

As to the great Skippy controversy, I could care less if stores continues to put up snarky posts, which is pretty much his default style. What inspired me to comment was his attempt to deny it. Struck me as cowardly. Not to mention ridiculous, given his track record.

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#1661149 - 04/16/11 09:59 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Batuhan]
Pogorelich. Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 4610
Loc: not somewhere over the rainbow
Yeah I was. I wasn't as upfront as right now, but a version of that for sure. Why is that so hard for you to understand?

My teacher and I actually got along extremely well even upon our initial meeting, so we've been talking to each other like this forever. But we also respect each other, of course, and he never treats me like a child.


Edited by Pogorelich. (04/16/11 10:00 AM)
_________________________

"The eyes can mislead, the smile can lie, but the shoes always tell the truth."

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#1661153 - 04/16/11 10:27 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: cardguy]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 20186
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: cardguy
I'm 60 and I'd rather earn respect than have it accorded to me automatically. That said, I am instinctively respectful to those older than I am. Maybe that *is* a generational thing as I don't see younger types doing much of that.
My comment was more about being treated with courtesy as opposed to respect. I don't expect anyone to respect me automatically for any reason.

Originally Posted By: cardguy
As to the great Skippy controversy, I could care less if stores continues to put up snarky posts, which is pretty much his default style. What inspired me to comment was his attempt to deny it. Struck me as cowardly. Not to mention ridiculous, given his track record.
Yes. To me his Skippy comment was snarky whether or not Skippy has any specific meaning(which I don't know).


Edited by pianoloverus (04/16/11 10:28 AM)

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#1661162 - 04/16/11 10:41 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: pianoloverus]
cardguy Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/17/08
Posts: 977
No specific meaning. Just a general put down. Stores wants to say it's equivalent to saying "buddy" or "friend." But that would require the belief that stores has this warm and fuzzy side.

Maybe he does, but I've not seen it.

Pog's right in a sense. Who cares? Children are starving. Rain forests are burning. Why waste time with something so stupid?

I've no answer except:

1: That's what happens in Internet forums
2: Stores sometimes bugs me. :>)

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#1661195 - 04/16/11 11:52 AM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Pogorelich.]
Damon Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/22/06
Posts: 6403
Loc: St. Louis area
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus

What one person might consider "overly sensitive" can be a completely reasonable or even thick skinned reaction to another person. I do think there is a general lack of sensitivity on internet postings where some people talk far differently from the way they'd in face to face conversation.

Originally Posted By: Pogorelich.

My teacher and I actually got along extremely well even upon our initial meeting, so we've been talking to each other like this forever. But we also respect each other, of course, and he never treats me like a child.


I think an interesting exercise is to read something you posted in the past, long enough to have forgotten your tone. I think many would be surprised how that post may no longer "sound" the same. I do think people in this forum tend to be overly sensitive. It's very easy to have things misunderstood when print is not your primary form of communication. (I still think "skippy" was an insult, though laugh )
_________________________
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#1661214 - 04/16/11 12:15 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Damon]
cardguy Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/17/08
Posts: 977
Agreed Damon. It's difficult to convey tone on the Internet because visual and tonal cues are absent. It's very easy to interpret something as more harsh than it was intended by the writer. That's why emoticons are so useful on the 'net. If you're worried about someone reading you wrong, you can toss in a happy face...

Now if stores had only used a happy face along with "skippy."

:>)

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#1661239 - 04/16/11 12:53 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: cardguy]
Pogorelich. Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 4610
Loc: not somewhere over the rainbow
Originally Posted By: cardguy
But that would require the belief that stores has this warm and fuzzy side.

Maybe he does, but I've not seen it.



I've known him for years... and you're wrong about that. It's just a different sense of humour, we're not all the same, right?
_________________________

"The eyes can mislead, the smile can lie, but the shoes always tell the truth."

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#1661242 - 04/16/11 12:56 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: pianoloverus]
Pogorelich. Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 4610
Loc: not somewhere over the rainbow
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
My comment was more about being treated with courtesy as opposed to respect. I don't expect anyone to respect me automatically for any reason.



So I have to be polite, ALL the time, without having a different "tone" ever? I can't say "Oh come on" or something, I always have to say "dear sir, please come on"? I know I'm exaggerating, but.... come on!!

That's not how humans function. I really think you need to stop being so overly sensitive - mainly because nobody means ill, especially in this situation. Believe me, if I mean ill, you'd know, and I'd know and everybody will too. And also I'll say it again - who cares? Let it go.
_________________________

"The eyes can mislead, the smile can lie, but the shoes always tell the truth."

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#1661246 - 04/16/11 01:03 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: cardguy]
stores Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/09
Posts: 6648
Loc: Here, as opposed to there
Originally Posted By: cardguy
Stores wants to say it's equivalent to saying "buddy" or "friend."



No no no no no no. I said "buddy"...I didn't say "friend". It's simply a term. Would it have been different had I said "Spanky", or "Melvin", or whomever? It means nothing and those who mussssssst place some importance behind it need to find themselves a hobby. Some of you really need to get out of the house a bit more. Get over it already.
_________________________

"And if we look at the works of J.S. Bach — a benevolent god to which all musicians should offer a prayer to defend themselves against mediocrity... -Debussy

"It's ok if you disagree with me. I can't force you to be right."

♪ ≠ $


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#1661248 - 04/16/11 01:08 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: pianoloverus]
stores Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/09
Posts: 6648
Loc: Here, as opposed to there
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
I'm surprised you didn't know that I am several times your age as my age has come up occasionally before although not in the way I've mentioned it in this thread. My post has nothing to do with "bowing" to people because of their age.



You're so full of it. If your post has nothing to do with your age and the "oh my god here he comes bow your head" respect that you feel should be shown you as a result then you would never mention your "surprise" regarding the fact that Angelina didn't know your age (as if she should remember it before addressing such wisdom and experience). Waaaaaah! Get off my grass!!!
_________________________

"And if we look at the works of J.S. Bach — a benevolent god to which all musicians should offer a prayer to defend themselves against mediocrity... -Debussy

"It's ok if you disagree with me. I can't force you to be right."

♪ ≠ $


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#1661249 - 04/16/11 01:11 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: cardguy]
stores Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/09
Posts: 6648
Loc: Here, as opposed to there
Originally Posted By: cardguy
If you're worried about someone reading you wrong, you can toss in a happy face...

Now if stores had only used a happy face along with "skippy."

:>)


I'm not, however, worried about someone/anyone reading me wrong. I said what I wanted to say. If I wanted to use a happy face I would have, but I'm not Mark.
_________________________

"And if we look at the works of J.S. Bach — a benevolent god to which all musicians should offer a prayer to defend themselves against mediocrity... -Debussy

"It's ok if you disagree with me. I can't force you to be right."

♪ ≠ $


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#1661263 - 04/16/11 01:38 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: stores]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 20186
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: stores
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
I'm surprised you didn't know that I am several times your age as my age has come up occasionally before although not in the way I've mentioned it in this thread. My post has nothing to do with "bowing" to people because of their age.



You're so full of it. If your post has nothing to do with your age and the "oh my god here he comes bow your head" respect that you feel should be shown you as a result then you would never mention your "surprise" regarding the fact that Angelina didn't know your age (as if she should remember it before addressing such wisdom and experience). Waaaaaah! Get off my grass!!!
What nonsense...from one of the snarkiest(to use another poster's description) posters in the history of PW. Expecting courtesy i different from respecting respect. You don't care about either.

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#1661264 - 04/16/11 01:42 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Batuhan]
Andromaque Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/29/08
Posts: 3886
Loc: New York
stores darling, for a concert pianist (that is what you are, right?), your people skills are a bit.. less than visible.
At the end of the day, it is all about perceptions. You can be incredibly nice at heart, but if you are perceived as nasty, that is how you will "go down". Thus a sharpening of one's communication skills is required. All the more relevant to younger Angelina..
In plainer English, it is not just PL who has commented on the impressions given by your communications. I am willing to bet my last dime that if anyone were to call you skippy (try to imagine one of your students doing that), YOU would NOT be a happy camper (and I , for one, would not want to be around for that scene), yes????

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#1661265 - 04/16/11 01:42 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Pogorelich.]
pianoloverus Online   content
Yikes! 10000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/29/01
Posts: 20186
Loc: New York City
Originally Posted By: Pogorelich.
Originally Posted By: pianoloverus
My comment was more about being treated with courtesy as opposed to respect. I don't expect anyone to respect me automatically for any reason.



So I have to be polite, ALL the time, without having a different "tone" ever? I can't say "Oh come on" or something, I always have to say "dear sir, please come on"? I know I'm exaggerating, but.... come on!!
You don't have to do anything. It's up to you.

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#1661310 - 04/16/11 02:53 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Batuhan]
Pogorelich. Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 4610
Loc: not somewhere over the rainbow
Okay, I'm a b***h, can we talk piano now? This isn't a "how to tall to people" help session.
_________________________

"The eyes can mislead, the smile can lie, but the shoes always tell the truth."

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#1661311 - 04/16/11 03:02 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Batuhan]
Pathbreaker Offline
1000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/18/04
Posts: 1194
Loc: Massachusetts
Seems like a sufficient close to this side conversation. I think a lot of you are just frustrated that the live stream is no longer available. smile

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#1661312 - 04/16/11 03:04 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: Pogorelich.]
cardguy Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/17/08
Posts: 977
For what it's worth P, which I grant isn't much, I've never found you anything but a very bright and engaging poster full of youthful passion and love for the piano. I don't recall a single time when I'd apply the "B" word to one of your posts.

Stores, I don't get why this bothers you. If you care what other people think about you...and from your general posting style it's a surprise to me that you might...then why not try a little kindness? I remember a post I put up as pretty much a newcomer both to the forum and the piano (as an adult restarter), and your response to my admittedly not very bright questions was:

"Yawn."

That to me is just plain nasty. I mean, why go out of your way to try and make someone feel badly? What drives that kind of thing?

At least you didn't call me skippy.


Edited by cardguy (04/16/11 03:07 PM)

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#1661381 - 04/16/11 04:50 PM Re: Practising Chopin's Ballade no. 1 - LIVE [Re: cardguy]
stores Offline
6000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/09
Posts: 6648
Loc: Here, as opposed to there
Originally Posted By: cardguy
For what it's worth P, which I grant isn't much, I've never found you anything but a very bright and engaging poster full of youthful passion and love for the piano. I don't recall a single time when I'd apply the "B" word to one of your posts.

Stores, I don't get why this bothers you. If you care what other people think about you...and from your general posting style it's a surprise to me that you might...then why not try a little kindness? I remember a post I put up as pretty much a newcomer both to the forum and the piano (as an adult restarter), and your response to my admittedly not very bright questions was:

"Yawn."

That to me is just plain nasty. I mean, why go out of your way to try and make someone feel badly? What drives that kind of thing?

At least you didn't call me skippy.


Sorry about the yawn, Skippy.
_________________________

"And if we look at the works of J.S. Bach — a benevolent god to which all musicians should offer a prayer to defend themselves against mediocrity... -Debussy

"It's ok if you disagree with me. I can't force you to be right."

♪ ≠ $


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