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Topic Options
#1661185 - 04/16/11 11:32 AM Kawai CL Series
Edwardt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 04/16/11
Posts: 6
Hi everyone,

This is a big big hello from me as I am totally new here :-)

Well, I guess I could start by saying that I really love to play piano no matter that fact that I have not played before smile and at this time, I dont think that there is any thing that could prevent me from buying and learning to play piano - except my budget!!!

Honestly, I spent almost a week to read the discussion for the not-expensive DPs to buy. As I mention, I am a real beginner and have no knowledge in this area, but I realized (after reading tons of posts in our forum) the touch and the tone are the most important things for newbie.There are lots of dps out there with good and bad things. However finally, I end up with the Kawai CL series, especially CL 25 (near AUD1200) and CL35 which is around AUD1400 (over my allowed budget). I have considered the yamaha p95 as well (as it is in the price range) but after all, I decide that Kawai CL is the way to go. Now, as I see, CL 35 is looked superior and have 3 pedals instead of 1 from CL25, so is this a big and important difference between two model, does it affect the sound much? if and only if I just want to play the piano with grand piano sound, does the CL25 good enough to meet my demand?

I have also tried korg sp17 and Yamaha (dont remember the model as it was not very impressive)which are in the same range of price but found out that the Kawai fit me the most - hope that I am right :-)


One more question, as I am living in Melbourne - Australia and when I check for the price, it is relatively high. So if there is anyone who know which store in Melbourne that I could get these stuffs with the reasonable price, please just let me know as I am a student with a very limit budget and there is no way for me to go but make the right choice :-)

Anyway, I know and pretty sure that your opinion here would contribute a great value for my consideration, so I love to hear you all, for real!

Thanks !


Edited by Edwardt (04/16/11 11:34 AM)

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#1661340 - 04/16/11 03:42 PM Re: Kawai CL Series [Re: Edwardt]
bluebilly Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/19/10
Posts: 443
Loc: England
The usual advice is for you to try out the pianos to find out which one is to your liking but if your new to piano playing your not sufficiently skilled to determine the difference between one piano and another therefore you have to rely on the good, unbiased, advice gained from members of these forums. All of the pianos you have mentioned are of excellent quality but if I were asked to make an immediate decision as to which I'd recommend I'd go with the Kawai, either the CL-25 or CL-35.

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#1661359 - 04/16/11 04:17 PM Re: Kawai CL Series [Re: Edwardt]
spanishbuddha Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/08/09
Posts: 2423
Loc: UK
I would say that as a beginner paying more for any DP just because it has or supports 3 pedals instead of 1 is wasting your money.

It's difficult to choose as a beginner but you seem on the right lines, 88 keys, hammer action, good piano tones.

Also consider stage (semi portable) with built in speakers or not, or home style piano. Then look at whether you want other sounds, or really want all of those sounds on offer (some offer 100's).

Then as bluebilly says you've got to try them for yourself. You may have trouble knowing which ones are best but hopefully you will dislike something about some which helps narrow it down.

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#1661627 - 04/17/11 01:47 AM Re: Kawai CL Series [Re: Edwardt]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9528
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Edwardt,

The CL35 utilises a slightly newer keyboard action than the CL25, while the sound technology is also more modern (88-key sampling on the CL35).

If you are considering these two models, it may also be worthwhile waiting for the new CL26/CL36, which feature further improved keyboard actions and sound technology.

Kind regards,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#1661649 - 04/17/11 03:41 AM Re: Kawai CL Series [Re: Edwardt]
Edwardt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 04/16/11
Posts: 6
bluebilly, thanks for the comment and add that I have the same opinion - prefer the Kawai CL rather than Yamaha or Korg.

spanishbuddha, really appreciate your advise, I will try out these dps again to see that whether I could find a point to narrow the view down. Really insight thoughts though.

Kawai James, I am so glad that there is a "Kawaier" here to help, can I know the release time for CL 26 and the price of course? the quality distance between it with CL25 ? Regretfully, I have to say that I actually could not afford the CL35 or CL36 as the price is relatively high. In the meantime, I am trying to negotiate to have a good price at AUD900 with the Cl 25.IS that a good price to buy? And one more thing, when I go for the Kawai in Australia, is the product made in Japan or anywhere else? Really concern about this as I heard the rumor that there are some from china or faking something. Do need advise from you, James.

By the way, it is still open for opinions from Kawai fans as well as Yamaha or Korg fellows.
Thanks for all.


Edited by Edwardt (04/17/11 04:53 AM)

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#1662190 - 04/18/11 08:17 AM Re: Kawai CL Series [Re: Edwardt]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9528
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Hello Edwardt,

The CL26/CL36 should start shipping in Europe within the next few months (the CL36 will likely arrive at dealers stores first), however I'm afraid I do not know the pricing/availability of either model in Australia. My recommendation would be to contact Kawai Australia directly using the information on the following page:

http://www.kawai.net.au/contact.html

The main differences between the CL25 and CL26 are related to the instruments' sound technology and keyboard actions, with the CL26 upgraded to use essentially the same sound/action as the previous CL35.

CL25:
- 'AHA IV-E' keyboard action
- Harmonic Imaging sound technology

CL26:
- 'AHA IV-F' keyboard action
- Harmonic Imaging, 88-key piano sampling sound technology

There are also some minor design changes to the CL26 cabinet, which will be available in white, black, and rosewood finishes (depending on the market).

To answer your final question, the 'CL' models are manufactured in Indonesia - Kawai does not manufacture any instruments in China.

Kind regards,
James
x

ps. I expect it may exceed your budget, but the Roland F-110 may also be worth considering if you are in the market for a compact DP.
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#1662315 - 04/18/11 12:10 PM Re: Kawai CL Series [Re: Kawai James]
ChrisA Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/28/08
Posts: 3841
Loc: Redondo Beach, California
Originally Posted By: Kawai James
Hello Edwardt,

The CL26/CL36 should start shipping in Europe within the next few months (the CL36 will likely arrive at dealers stores first), however I'm afraid I do not know the pricing/availability of either model in Australia. My recommendation would be to contact Kawai Australia directly using the information on the following page:

http://www.kawai.net.au/contact.html

The main differences between the CL25 and CL26 are related to the instruments' sound technology and keyboard actions, with the CL26 upgraded to use essentially the same sound/action as the previous CL35.

CL25:
- 'AHA IV-E' keyboard action
- Harmonic Imaging sound technology

CL26:
- 'AHA IV-F' keyboard action
- Harmonic Imaging, 88-key piano sampling sound technology

There are also some minor design changes to the CL26 cabinet, which will be available in white, black, and rosewood finishes (depending on the market).

To answer your final question, the 'CL' models are manufactured in Indonesia - Kawai does not manufacture any instruments in China.

Kind regards,
James
x

ps. I expect it may exceed your budget, but the Roland F-110 may also be worth considering if you are in the market for a compact DP.


It's all a matter of opinion. Here is mine.....

James knows his stuff when it comes to Kawai. When he says the sound is much better between cl25 and cl26 he is right. In the past sound was Kawia's weak point. Newer models have improved sound. The CL25 is not a newer model.

But always, Kawai has had very good key actions and I'd take any Kawai over the action Roland puts in their F110. With Kawai there is not a huge difference between their lowest cost and best key actions. They all have the same family resemblance but they differ in the level of refinement. But both Roland and Yamaha it is not like that. Each of those companies makes an entry level key action that is very different from their top line action. The Roland F110 and the Yamaha P95 use entry level key actions.

So you have some not perfect options. Waiting is not good, Compromising on the sound is not good, Compromising on the key action is worse. Spending more money would fix all of this but debt is not good either.

I think for a beginner the #1 most importance feature of a piano is the quality of the key action. I'd compromise other features to get good keys. I bought a Yamaha P155, it was the lowest priced model that had Yamaha's better key action inside. It sells here for about US$1,000. There were no comparably priced Kawai models available in the US.


Edited by ChrisA (04/18/11 12:27 PM)

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#1662559 - 04/18/11 09:32 PM Re: Kawai CL Series [Re: ChrisA]
dewar Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/14/11
Posts: 139
what key action will the cl 36 hold?

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#1662574 - 04/18/11 09:56 PM Re: Kawai CL Series [Re: Edwardt]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9528
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
dewar, the CL36 utilises the 'RH' action without let-off (same as the CN23).

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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#1662847 - 04/19/11 10:30 AM Re: Kawai CL Series [Re: Edwardt]
Edwardt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 04/16/11
Posts: 6
Hey hello all, wow I've just finished my mid semester tests, that is cool!

Thanks all, I really appreciate your contribution.

Kawai James, I have contacted someone from Kawai Australia and knowing that if I want to get a Kawai Cl26, I have to wait for, saying a little long but furthermore, the price will be relatively high (somewhere in England is advertising it as $900 which once converted, become a big amount in Aus dollar). SO in general, it's kinda hard for me to reach that one. So, if the kawai cl 25 is good enough for me, I may go for it.

ChrisA, are you saying that the sound from Kawai CL 25 is some how not as good as Yamaha or Roland? But anyway, I have to confirm that you were right, I dont have much options here but go for the one fit my budget and accept to sacrifice some features. From what you wrote, I assume that the suggestion is that I should take the Kawai CL 25, is it right? besides, you may know that the price for these stuffs is quite different as I could not find the Yamaha p155 @ $1000 in Australia, the cheapest one offer that dp with the price of $1800 and something, so it's true that that is so nice dp, but it's just out of my hand!
I did try to listen for the sound from these dps on youtube, there are lots of samples for yamaha p85 as well as p95 however there are very few pieces of music for the Kawai and as the sounds for yamaha are recorded better ( I think so) so it is somehow better than Kawai's melody. So, this makes me, again reconsider my decision. Anyway, I still give the Kawai higher point as from many discussions, there is a claim that the key feel from kawai is better than Yamaha p 85-95 .There are of course, other Yamaha series which having cool sound but we are not considering them here as they are just over my budget.

I am about to come to the store and try again the DPs( Yamaha p85-95 and Kawai cl25)and may decide to order one after that unless there is significant factors or opinions from you that I better consider, that is what I am expecting and again love to hear from you all.

By the way, to all people who have tried or actually have your Kawai CL 25 with you, I think that you have probably experience this dilemma before, so if you see these words, I hope you could give me some hints.

Thank you, thanks for all!

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#1662949 - 04/19/11 01:23 PM Re: Kawai CL Series [Re: Edwardt]
dewar Offline
Full Member

Registered: 02/14/11
Posts: 139
it looks like the cl 36 will sell for maybe 929 euro. Or $1330.

http://www.keysound.co.uk/productlist.asp?cid=3

Even without the letoff might be something nice to look into depending on the specs.

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#1665673 - 04/24/11 05:18 AM Re: Kawai CL Series [Re: Edwardt]
Edwardt Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 04/16/11
Posts: 6
Hi all,

I have had a chance to come to the store and tried out two dps, CL 25 and Yamaha P95. Well, for the first 20 mins, I was so sure that the Yamaha has better sound or at least my ears is just fine with its sound. However, I then asked the staff for helping playing some pieces of music. He did actually play cool, so I had an opportunity to experience both dps side by side.

This time, as be playing by the same song, each piano provides different kind of melody. The Yamaha sounds thinner and more "modern" while Kawai provides thicker sounds and suit better for classical music, I think. In my opinion, kawai cl 25 sounds better somehow. Its just warm and full laugh

About the keys, for me ( I spent almost two hours to test the key touch :-) ) the CL 25 definitely has better key touch and I actually like it.

Finally, I managed to get the CL 25 @ AUD 885 and I think that was a good deal. So now I was starting practicing and I am very very pleased with it. So for one who is going to get a Kawai dp, specially on this model, try it - it wont let you down, for sure.

So, I got the piano just as I wish to and I am very happy with that. Now I would like to say thanks to you, guys for helping me much in my consideration. Thank you and wish you guys every beautiful day with your piano.

Edward.


Edited by Edwardt (04/24/11 09:57 PM)

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#1666672 - 04/26/11 03:44 AM Re: Kawai CL Series [Re: Kawai James]
Csillag Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/22/10
Posts: 249
Loc: Hungary, Europe
Originally Posted By: Kawai James
dewar, the CL36 utilises the 'RH' action without let-off (same as the CN23).


Until now, the cheapest DP with the RH keyboard was the CN23, right? Now this is going to change, since the CL36 will enter the market at a lower price point, right?

Could you please summarize the differences between the CN23 and the CL36? (Or tell me where can I find the specs for the CL36?)

Thank you for your help:

Csillag

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#1666676 - 04/26/11 03:54 AM Re: Kawai CL Series [Re: Csillag]
Csillag Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/22/10
Posts: 249
Loc: Hungary, Europe
Originally Posted By: Csillag
Could you please summarize the differences between the CN23 and the CL36? (Or tell me where can I find the specs for the CL36?)


I have found the 2011 European catalog you have mentioned in this thread.

From a quick look in the catalog, I could not spot any major differences (except the built-in pedal in the CN23), so it would be a great help if you could summarize the differences.

Thank you for your help again:

Csillag

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#1666684 - 04/26/11 04:23 AM Re: Kawai CL Series [Re: Edwardt]
Kawai James Offline
9000 Post Club Member

Registered: 09/06/07
Posts: 9528
Loc: Hamamatsu, Japan
Csillag, the CN23 and CL36 both feature three pedals, however you are correct - the two models essentially share the same specifications. The most significant differences are in the cabinet design/appearance, the speaker sizes and output power (both larger on the CN23), and the fact that the CL36 is connected using an AC power adaptor, not a power cable.

I hope this helps.

Cheers,
James
x
_________________________
Employed by Kawai Japan, however the opinions I express are my own.
Nord Electro 3 fan & occasional rare groove player.

"Richard, none of us could forget you have a CLP-990." - EssBrace, 2014

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