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Some months ago my lovely Roland HP-207 managed to set off my neighbour because I was playing it very late at night with my headphones on. However, the clicking sound carried through the wooden floor and both the music and her annoyance seemed to reach its respective climax simultaneously. Not a fun experience to be shouted at for fives minutes in incomprehensible German, and when she realised that she wasn't getting through (well, I could sense her feeling in every booming syllable), abusive English ensued!

Anyway, in attempt to solve the problem I got myself a tiling array of anti-noise-anti-vibration washing machine pads. It helped, she said, but not nearly enough.

The thing is I get home really late in the evening so the only time I get to play is usually past 10 pm. Does anybody have other suggestions? I happen to be moving to a new apartment soon (same story, wooden floor) and would like a more amicable relationship between my neighbour and my piano.

Thanks so much!

Tar

Angry neighbours and acoustic pianos are (sadly) associated sometimes, but having problems with neighbours with a digital piano when using headphones, is a novelty for me.

I would suggest some kind of rubber mat under the stand where your keyboard rests to avoid vibrations going through the floor. Structural transmission of sound is hard to avoid with a massive acoustic piano, but it should be a lot easier to achieve in your case.

Edit: Have you checked the sound that your neighbour can hear? May be a case of oversensitive neighbour?

Wow! I always thought German homes were so well constructed - such thick stone\cement\brick walls.

You could switch to an acoustic piano for a week, give her the full treatment, and then switch back to the digital.

Is your piano located over her bedroom? Could you relocate your piano to another room?

This is an amazing story.

That's hilarious!!!! My wife complain about the exact same thin with my electric! My electric is in a room directly above the master bedroom. I would practice late at night (with headphones) but she could her the keys. She said it sounds like I'm hitting something with a hammer......I don't think I'm that bad!

The room with the electric has carpet! I remedied the situation by backing the keyboard away from the wall and playing a touch lighter. You could try putting additional rubber pads between the keyboard and stand AND pads between the keyboard and floor. I'd make sure that no part of the keyboard or stand touches a wall. If you are playing directly over her bed, move the keyboard to another spot!

Good luck!

The only complaint I get from my neighbours is why I don't play more often...

Generally if there's any specific material than can really do the job I would love to grab hold of it. A generic "mat" doesn't seem to work.

@kurtie: I already have pads that are supposed to reduce noise from the washing machine underneath my piano (I don't know what this says about my playing... will this turn into another musician's joke? "Q: What's the difference between a digital piano and a washing machine? A: You can turn down the washing machine.") Apparently she's one of these people who "listen to the silence" so I guess her hearing must be exceptionally keen. But I think deafer ears than hers would hear it, too. I found this out the other day because when I was recording a video the clicking noise ended up a lot more audible than the music.

@Dave: If I did that I probably would have got thrown out of the building for good (With the current level of resentment I was already threatened a tip-off to the landlord!) It is unfortunately right above her bedroom... but I have no idea about the new place I'm moving into. I guess best would be to check out the flat below me and try out a mutual-exclusion policy.

@Michael: Alas I am aware that I'm a rather heavy-handed pianist (have always been) I can even point out the very music that set her off: this video from 4:55. (Of course this time she didn't complain otherwise I wouldn't've finished recording!)

@Saul: A mark of a fine musician

Tar,

My experience with Rolands is a thumping rather than clicking sound. I think the only way you'd get clicking is if you play with a lot of finger curl and long fingernails.

To size up the thump, play your 207 with the power off (no headphones of course). See what you think.

Altering touch on a digital is nothing more than changing the volume setting. You could play around with that. The higher the volume level selected, the less thump you'd probably make as you adjust your touch to fit the sound level you're comfortable with. If you try it out wearing your cans, you'd want a second person to listen for the thump.

I agree with Kurtie's assessment of the structural transmission of sound. Make sure the console is not touching the wall and put thick chunks of rubber under all points that it comes in contact with the floor.

Actually, you're absolutely right! It's a thumping sound. That word just slipped from my mind...



The thing is that volume compensation does not compensate for momentum. The sound a real piano (and the Roland) made with a faster stricken "thump" is qualitatively different than that from a gentler touch. Also, forcing myself to play with gentler touch also interferes with the momentum of the arms that follow natural gravity when landing on the key, so loud-and-fast octave passages are hard played like this. I had already done the very experiment you suggested, it sounded ghastly!!
[/quote]


Right now it's standing around two inches from the wall and the pad (I'm not sure if it's all rubber but it must have a large percentage of) is around 1.5 cm thick. Apparently this hasn't worked. I don't want to mount my piano on a six inch rubber block though ... I would need a higher stool for a start! :S

How about turning on a fan at full blast to drown out the sound? Place the fan on the floor right over her head. The louder the better! Start it up when you get home so she gets used to hearing the "white noise" before you start playing. I use a fan every night to help me sleep. She will get used to it as well and eventually will want a fan of her own.

You are wearing headphones so you won't care and because it will be getting warmer soon...

For about €500 I know a guy who can permanently solve your problem, if you know what I mean.

Thank you, Tar!

Not 6 inches! Just a half inch of solid rubber, not the spongy stuff.

Maybe you should have a meeting with your neighbors to discuss your need for mucial momentum.

The situation sounds utterly ridiculous to me. Are you foot tapping without knowing it? Are you slamming the pedals?

Once I had my computer blaring music as loud as I could take it in my headphones, jamming away, before I realized that the speakers were on TOO... It wouldn't have been so embarrassing, except that I'd been listening to Barry Manilow.

Anyway, it just makes me wonder if you're doing something outside of just pressing the keys that's making the noise she's complaining about.

If not, then seriously, I'd just learn a few key words in German and share them with her the next time she yells at you!

Tar, I listened to your video - great playing and composition! Have a listen to it folks if you haven't already: Tar's Video starts slow but really gets going.

I don't think rubber pads are going to make enough difference to solve your problem entirely. It seems it's a combination of mechanical transmission and actual noise. You would probably need a really large, dense rubberised mat covering most of your room to help that. Very expensive.

Do you find the noise of the keys is caused when you press on them, or when you let go of the key and it springs up? If it's on release, you could probably modify your piano with some absorbent foam where the red/green felt is above the keys. If it's when you press down, I don't think there's anything you can do.

It sounds like you aren't able to move your piano to another room. Is that because you are in a shared flat? Maybe you could switch rooms? Maybe you'll have to move! You are obviously really into your music so you need a proper solution. It's very hard to practise when you are worried all the time.

Hope you work it out. Best of luck!

I have heard this problem before. As suggested above, make sure the piano does not touch floor or wall. Maybe you can put the piano on a floating floor, with some soft foam inbetween? You could test it by putting the piano on your matrass and ask the neighbours if that works.

And then I get 30 years. Naaah, I have too many pieces to write and I'm not sure my inmates would be as tolerant as my neighbour

Thank you guys! Lots of helpful advice (and entertaining reading) here! I'll be looking into denser material for the pad to stays under my piano. This seems to be the major component. And a nice word or two to my new neighbour would probably be good too.

Meanwhile, though, I got myself a T-shirt saying I've got a piano, and I'm not afraid to use it. I thought I'd flash this in front of my old neighbour just before I go

This is the correct advice.
You need a floating platform floor that will decouple the mechanical noise transmission.

Google this and you should be able to build your own in a weekend or find a firm to do so. This could become your little stage at home.

The problem may be that isolation pads designed for a washing machine (which is likely much heavier than your digital piano) are too stiff to effectively dampen the vibrations from your piano. You may want to try something a bit softer - maybe a couple of layers of carpet pad (the foam padding put underneath carpets) or one of the chef's gel mats which seem to be getting popular in the US.

Just checked out your video inner lion. I can't fix your problem with the neighbors but if I could play like that I gladly get thrown out of anyplace.

Maybe you should play without the headphones the music is great. I'd rather hear that then the thumping.

Good luck
Peter

I've had this problem and also attempted to solve it. It seems easy to solve until you actually try it.

Think of it this way: A pianist at a DP playing Chopin's Scherzo Op31 is expending the same amount of energy as a pianist sitting at a concert grand in a large concert hall playing the same composition.

The pianist at the AC is generating enough sound energy to fill the hall with no amplification - some considerable amount of energy.

Where is the energy going that the digital pianist is generating? A tiny and negligible fraction is triggering the sensors in the DP which produce a very small electrical signal which is then amplified a very small amount for the headphones (the lady can't hear the sound from the headphones because this sound energy is very, very small.)

Essentially all of the energy produces vibrations in the body of the DP - which are nicely transferred to the floor (some of the energy radiates into the room where the piano is, but much goes into the floor). Wood framed floors make really effective soundboards, and this is a problem that architects and structural engineers face on a daily basis as footsteps, voices, etc are heard by the occupants below (I'm a structural engineer by profession). Any solution effective enough to solve the problem is likely going to cost as much as the digital piano.

There are two practical solutions:

1) relocate the DP to another room where hopefully the vibrations won't transmit to the room where the lady sleeps,

2) relocate your residence to the lowest floor.

G