Piano World Home Page Forums Our Most Popular Forums Adult Beginners Forum Which scale includes all 5 black keys

Can anyone please tell me which scale covers all 5 black keys?

thanks in advance

B maj, C# maj (Db maj)and Gb maj (F#maj) to name a few.

That's a very interesting question, but why do you ask? There are more musical scales than religions.

b major

Since I like to be a clever arse now and then, D#/Eb minor pentatonic uses ONLY the black keys (no white keys at all).

This is the most clever answer

Any combination of notes can be called a scale and many are not "officially" named.

However, among major scales, F#(Gb), B(Cb), C#(Db) (and all other enharmonic variations) are generally known to use all the black keys.

Jazzwee, by enharmonic variations, do you mean only the relative minor scales of the major scales concerned*, or are there other enharmonic variations?

*For the record, the relative minor scales of the B, Gb/F# and Db/C# major scales, are Ab/G# (minor), Eb/D# (minor) and Bb/A# (minor), respectively. Hope I got this right!

LOL - Pianonotehead, yes relative minors are certainly in there but I said 'Major Scales' to avoid that.

I'm sure someone will prove how smart they are by pointing out also the enharmonic double flats and double sharps...:)

I wasn't trying to prove how smart I am, I thought everybody knew that. I was just curious*, because of this elegant phrase of yours, enharmonic variations, if there were other such variations than the relative minor scales of major ones.

So the question still is: what are the other enharmonic variations, I mean of the major scales to be exact, and prevent any (major) misunderstanding.

BTW, when I first learned to play the B major scale, I couldn't BELIEVE how easy it was compared to the C major scale! I had been afraid, initially, of the black keys, but that cured me.

I mean I know that it all begins with middle C on the circle of 5ths, but if you want to scare the beginning student, start him on the C major scale. If you want to show him that scales are nothing to be afraid of, start him on the B major.

I didn't mean you Pianonotehead . I meant keys like double sharps and double flats like I stated. Dbb, B##, and such rarely encountered nonsense.

No problem, however I've seen those double flats/sharps on scores, never played from such a sheet though.

Don't understand it, seems a bit far fetched to raise or lower a note more than once. Can I expect to see a middle C in sheet music for some advanced piece, and I'll actually be playing it far down the bass, because of a huge number of flat signs?

All joking aside, I probably shouldn't be worrying about this, I'm up to my knees trying to keep time in simple rhytms, consisting of nothing but quarter and eight notes,plus a few dotted ones.

I have heard that Irving Berlin played only in the key of F#! He enjoyed playing primarily on the black keys. His piano had a lever that moved the strings in relation to the hammer, so that he could play in other keys while keeping the same fingerings for the key of F#.

One of his transposing pianos is on display at the National Museum of American Jewish History in Philly.

Supposedly he said that the key of C was for those who "study music"!

Although my “by-ear” favorite keys are F major, C major, and G major (in that order) I too am learning to appreciate and play in the black key scales.

F# is particularly nice. I also like Bb because the lowest Bb in the bass sounds really nice. I also like Eb. A lot of gospel songs and church hymns are in Eb and Ab.

Someone here once mentioned a formula for easily identifying the key signature in most written music, but it escapes me at the moment… lots of very smart folks of the PW forums.

Rick

Major keys:

Sharps, move a half step up from the last #, that's the key. E.g. Sharps F#, C#, G#, D#. Last sharp is D#. Move a half step up: key is E major.

Flats, the next to last flat is the key. E.g. Flats Bb, Eb, Ab, Db. Next to last flat is Ab: key of Ab major. Memorize one flat (Bb): key of F major.

Minor keys:

work out the major key, then count three half steps down for the Minor key. E.g. Sharps F#, C#, G#, D#, A#. If it were major, would be B major. If it's minor, count down A#, A, G#. Key of G# minor.

Double sharps and double flats are to preserve the correct spelling of chords.

The basic rule is that in a root position triad or seventh chord, the letters (ignoring sharps and flats) skip a letter each time. For example, Cdim7 is C, Eb, Gb, Bbb (that's for the fully diminished C chord). And Baug is B, D#, F##.

[quote=Andy Platt One of his transposing pianos is on display at the National Museum of American Jewish History in Philly.

Supposedly he said that the key of C was for those who "study music"! [/quote]Iwonder if any of these "transposing pianos" are still available in a rebuilt state. Might be really great for playing popular music. Reminds me of using a capo on a guitar.

Iwonder if any of these "transposing pianos" are still available in a rebuilt state. Might be really great for playing popular music. Reminds me of using a capo on a guitar. [/quote]

On the west coast of Canada they're still available, but quite rare. Very interesting instruments because they also have extra keys at the bottom like a Bosendorfer, or at least the ones I saw have this.

There is also one of the pentatonic scales... try it from F#

John