For anyone who lives near London and likes classical music and interested in Roland's best concoction/creation , you can get free tickets via http://roland.co.uk/premiere. It's being held in the Britten Theatre, Royal College of Music, and the pianist is Daniel Tong, who'll also be collaborating with a violinist and cellist in trios.

It looks like Roland is promoting the V-Grand for classical musicians, in contrast to its sibling (V-Piano) which seems to be mainly directed towards pop/rock/jazz musicians wanting something for gigs.

bennevis, I believe Roland also toured the V-Piano with similar classic concerts a couple of years ago.

Cheers,
James
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I probably missed them if there were any here (but I wasn't into DPs till last year....) but certainly in UK, all the promotional blurb for the V-Piano is distinctly targeted at the pop/rock fraternity, looking at their brochures, websites etc. And for die-hard classical pianists like myself, it takes a big leap of faith to steel myself to touch (let alone play) something that is a big black flat slab..... .

But with the V-Grand, there should be far less of a problem, just as the AvantGrand N3 has been aimed squarely at the classical market from the start.

Are you sure you're not thinking of the RD-700NX?



10-20 years ago, perhaps. Not really the case these days.

Cheers,
James
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Positive - I'm looking at the V-Piano brochure as I type, and some (apparently) well-known pop artists are grinning out of its pages at me, with their effusive praise for the instrument .

Have a look at the Pianist forum where all the classical pianists lurk, and read what they think about DPs (and I'm talking DPs that actually resemble acoustics).

Bennevis, there are always the 'purists', and they exist and have existed on every form of innovation since I can remember, to name a few:
- Don't use digital consoles, professionals only use analog... its the only way to go! (during the 90s)
- The only way to do serious photography is with film! Never would digital cameras be a substitute for good film. (during the 2000s)
- 35mm film is what professional film makers use, digital backs are for indy film makers! (up till last year!)
- Virtual instruments will never match the acoustic ones (still going on)

I don't have anything against people that think that way, I don't agree with them, but I can see where they are coming from. I can say, being an amateur pianists and having been besides musicians and technical people all my live, that for 'low end' instruments... new virtual instruments are better! The new keybed of my FP-7F is actually of better quality than my not-so-good vertical acoustic piano. Of course, the Steinway I once tested was probably nicer and around $80.000 more expensive!

I will trust my ears and fingers rather than the purists who think just because they are not acoustic they are no good.

Try them, and if you feel that way, that is your truth and not what others tell you about it, that is what I think anyways.

Best regards,
Rafa.

I would very much like to see and play the Roland V-grand but it does not yet seem to be available here in the Washington, D.C. area. I called dealers in my area listed on the Roland site and not only did they not have the v-grand in stock they didn't seem to know when they would get one in. One dealer said he thought there might be one in Florida.

I'm sure it will be worth the wait.

There seems to have been a delay in getting the V-Grand out - I was originally informed it would be available to try in my local dealer in May, but it looked like Roland wanted to do a big launch in London first. I did manage to have a quick look at it in another country though.

I certainly agree with you that at low price points, DPs are better than what you can get for new acoustics at the same price (though I wouldn't have dreamt of saying this in 2009, before I'd played on a DP...).

Incidentally, I acquired my first digital camera only last year, and that was because 35mm transparency (slide) film had become so scarce and expensive. As I haven't got a computer, the only way I can view my photos (other than via the camera's tiny screen) is to connect the camera to my TV.

Why not buy a computer?

Actually, just out of curiosity, may I ask how you are able to post messages on this forum without a computer?

Cheers,
James
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I've got no need for one in my home (I've got far better things to do, like playing the DP, learning new repertoire, listening to the radio and CDs, going out running and climbing etc, etc).

Don't tell, but most of my postings (on weekdays) is done on my work computer, under cover... . On weekends (like now), I post using the computers in the gym/health club - it gets me fired up before I start on the weights and stuff, and swimming.

BTW, I don't own a cell phone, or MP3/iPod, or i-anything either (and I wouldn't know how to use any of them.....). I believe the technical term for my unique malady is 'Luddite' .

Not having a computer is one thing, but no cellphone? wat!

When I'm out on a long run in the countryside, or 20000ft up a mountain fighting for my life in a blizzard, or even sunning myself on a beach in the Seychelles (not that I ever sun myself on a beach ), the last thing I want is someone ringing me up on my cellphone and enquiring about my state of health.....

If I don't own a cellphone, and never have, problem solved.

I also know a guy who does not want a cell phone... If you come to think of it, they provide instant communication, but also a great deal of stress.

Well, I can appreciate the benefits of not owning a mobile phone (do you not carry a communication device or GPS tracker when climbing?). However I believe a computer is an essential piece of technology - especially when it comes to adjusting the many parameters of the V-Piano!

Cheers,
James
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I do carry a tiny GPS receiver in my backpack (Garmin Geko 201, if anyone's interested ) when I go mountaineering, but it's strictly for emergencies - and so I don't go astray and descend the wrong side of the mountain when trying to extricate myself in a storm or whiteout (as someone did on K2 a few years ago). But no satellite phone or walkie talkie, unless I'm given one (as on Everest).

I don't doubt that in the hands of a master (like yourself ), a computer saves a lot of hassle when customizing the V-Piano, but my befuddled brain couldn't possibly cope with all those LED (or is it LCD?) graphics when trying to adjust parameters on the computer. Not to mention trying to set the whole thing up in the first place (Roland helpfully provided a CD-ROM which I've no idea what to do with.....).

So, I continue to use elbow grease in such matters .

Are you sure you're not having a lend of us, Bennevis? You seem to post at all sorts of times throughout the day. Availability never seems to be an issue when it's a topic of relevance to you. Seems odd from somebody whose begging and borrowing time from other people's computers. You've managed to rack up almost as many posts as I have and I'm on the computer around the clock! Maybe you are having a bit of a joke on us? Of course, if you are, you probably wouldn't tell us!

I'm only pulling your leg.... .

Actually, if you check the times I post, it's always between 0800 and 1800 GMT or BST (British Summer Time) on weekdays, except when I'm at the gym for a few hours at weekends, or rarely, in the evenings.

Of course, that would be at night Down Under .

Mobile phones are great and very useful except that many people will think that you are some sort of antisocial weirdo for having the audacity to actually turn the damned thing off when you do not wish to be disturbed. Own a mobile phone and some people behave as if it is THEIR right to contact you whenever THEY choose and therefore turning off your phone is somehow taking liberties. It really is quite peculiar.

On topic, I am going to the V-Piano Grand Concert next week. I received an email last week to say that the tickets are on the way but also that very few tickets are left so if anyone is thinking about going, they had better register for tickets asap.

I'll be going to the premiere as well, its just down the road from me so will pop over after dinner

The event was well attended (maybe the champagne reception preceding the concert had something to do with it? ), and I chatted to some music students as well as classical music enthusiasts who don't actually play, but just came for the concert (- always a good sign, in my book).

My first impression of the V-Piano Grand's sound was somewhat disappointing: from where I was sitting (20ft from the stage), it seemed to be lacking in brilliance and resonance, though the bass was good. The V-P G is the size of a baby grand and sounded somewhat like one, with muted treble and a generally tubby sound, though its bass was far superior to any acoustic grand of this size.

Midway through the first half, the Roland representative gave an excellent illustrated short talk on the V-Piano & Grand, and showed how they differ from sampled DPs. The slide showing how sampling is done is intriguing - about a hundred mikes poking into the innards of a grand. He connected a computer to the Grand to demonstrate how changing the parameters changes the sound, and played it himself - very well too.

After the interval, Daniel Tong was joined by two colleagues to play trios by Haydn and Dvorák. The fortepiano setting he used for the Haydn didn't sound very convincing, I must say (I've heard Walter fortepianos on recordings though never played one). That was the only time in the whole concert that he used a different setting. I suspected that he hadn't tweaked the parameters, and simply used Vintage Piano 1 in its factory preset. (BTW, the performances themselves were excellent).

When the concert had finished, I went up to the stage to have a closer look. It looked like a user-setting which had all the parameters set at zero, though not one of the original factory presets. But surprisingly, when close up, the sound had the brilliance and resonance and overtones which had seemed lacking when heard from the stalls. Still, when I got the chance (after the other interested people had had their go at playing it), I increased the decay time and put the tone color up a notch. The sound was transformed - I dared to pull out all the stops and inflicted some fffff on it (though the music score of the Schumann/Liszt Widmung that I was playing only indicated fff ). I immediately felt like I was playing on a rich-sounding 9ft concert grand, and the uncanny sensation of that continued onto gentler music. It's been a while since I enjoyed playing a piano this much - actually since the last time I was at a piano showroom (Fazioli/Kawai). I could have played for hours....

Unfortunately, the removal men had already started to dismantle the furnishings around the stage and two blokes were waiting in the wings to pounce on the V-Piano Grand....

Thanks for the review bennevis - it sounds like a terrific event.

A colleague recently attended a similar showcase in Sydney - I'll forward your review to him for comparison.

Cheers,
James
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The brochure handed out at the event showed that London and Milan have their V-P Grand premieres this month, to be followed by Beijing in August, then Budapest in October. Osaka and Tokyo had it in February and again in June, LA and NY in March, followed by several European and Australasian cities.

It looks like you missed your opportunity in Japan.....

I'm sure I'll have a chance to see/try the V-Piano Grand in the not too distant future.

By the way, do you recall if the piano was amplified in any way?

Cheers,
James
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No, it was a traditional classical concert setting (apart from the electric cable connected to the V-P Grand). The piano's lid was fully up, and the pianist had the keyboard lid on its lower position to hide the console display so as not to be distracted by LED display and buttons (not possible on the original V-Piano).

It was a very enjoyable and interesting experience, listening to the V-Piano Grand in the very capable hands of Daniel Tong at the Britten Theatre last night.

I went to the concert with my friend, a piano teacher who also gives recitals.

I haven't got a lot of time so I will go into more detail later but my overall impression is that the V-Piano Grand is an incredible achievement by Roland, an amazing music instrument in its own right and is in a totally different league to every DP that I have ever heard.

In terms of tone generation, it is absolutely incredible. The range of tones it is capable of from the keyboard alone (in the capable hands of a virtuoso concert pianist) is jaw dropping and has to be heard to be believed. As my friend said (after John Maul played around with the tuning), on single notes and simple passages he would defy anyone to state with any confidence that they were listening to electronics.

Unfortunately, the amplification and speakers are not up to the same standard. In the Britten Theatre, on occasion the V-Piano Grand sounded relatively underpowered, especially during complex passages.

For example the first and third sections of Chopin's Nocturne in F were absolutely delightful and thoroughly convincing but it was plainly obvious during the dramatic second section that the amplification and/or speakers couldn't cope with the dynamics at the volume necessary to project to the back of the hall, like a supercar nearing its top speed and running out of acceleration. The bass was muddled and the overall sound was compressed.

This is its Achilles heel and the main area, for me, where the acoustic concert grand is still quite some way ahead of its DP cousin in a concert setting. Obviously I cannot talk about touch sensitivity, keyboard action etc as I haven't played it but Daniel Tong seemed very comfortable and I only heard one mistake near the start of the first piece.

Is it a great leap forward? I haven't had the opportunity to play it yet but I would have to say yes. My friend was also very impressed and cannot wait to play it. We both felt that last night we might have been at a very special event akin to the first time we ever heard a CD.

For sure my next digital piano will not be the V-Piano Grand (too expensive) but it will be modelled and it will definitely contain no samples. It will be one of the V-Piano Granddaddy's cheaper descendants.

Are classical concerts not miced/amplified, though?

James
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Oh dear, that bad was it?