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#1719381 - 07/23/11 03:35 PM Woohoo! LF stage type for $800.
KHen Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 183
Loc: North America
Rejoice! the unthinkable has happened and I am now finally able to buy a dp (sold my drum set). As some of you may know, or not, I have been w/o a piano for years. I play at church on the williams overture piano they have, it's horrible in my opinion, and I am ready to buy my own to use on stage for worship and at home to practice jazz piano. So I'm looking for one that has onboard speakers, but is gig friendly also because I'll be playing on stage with it every sunday and is within my budget of $800. I'm pretty current with all the boards out, but still would like some opinions.

-Yamaha p155- I might, big if, be able to get this for $800 from somewhere, but how do you think it would hold up to being moved every week and playing on stage. I have already played this and liked the action.

-Roland fp4- This sounds like it would be a good option for me, since the arrival of the fp4-f the prices for the old fp4 have gone down, but not sure if I can get it for $800. Some nice features session partner being one, but I haven't tried the action so not sure if it's to light or not.

-Casio px130- Within my budget, but would like to get more If it's possible.

-Kawai ES6- I'd have to find a used one of these in order to get it for $800, but again it would be a good choice I think.

-Korg sp250- Don't really like this board, the action is very noisy and clunky to me.

What do you guys think? And the $800 is very tight no leeway here on getting a 1k board, unfortunately.

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#1719386 - 07/23/11 03:41 PM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: KHen]
voxpops Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 3016
Loc: Oregon
Originally Posted By: KHen
-Roland fp4- This sounds like it would be a good option for me, since the arrival of the fp4-f the prices for the old fp4 have gone down, but not sure if I can get it for $800. Some nice features session partner being one, but I haven't tried the action so not sure if it's to light or not.

What do you guys think? And the $800 is very tight no leeway here on getting a 1k board, unfortunately.

If you have $79 leeway, the FP4 was available new at NovaMusik for $879 a little while ago (may have been the white version only - which I have, and it looks quite smart). You might try them (and others) and see if you can negotiate on remaining stock. Personally, I think the FP-4 is still a great little board if you need to move it around. I also think it was very well made and so I wouldn't have a problem buying a slightly used one if that fell within budget.

Edit: some people are quite critical of the FP4's action. I find it perfectly playable and expressive. No it's not quite as heavy or piano-like as the P155, but that doesn't make it a bad action. The saving in weight is also helpful. My FP4 also has a matte finish on the black keys that really helps during hot, sweaty gigs!


Edited by voxpops (07/23/11 03:45 PM)
_________________________
Occasional author and inveterate ivory tickler:
http://www.amazon.com/author/richardspanswick

https://soundcloud.com/richards-recordings/sets/strange-charm-waiting-for-the/s-ppGuy

"can hardly wait to hear what voxpox has to say..."
[HisKidd, May 2014]

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#1719502 - 07/23/11 07:02 PM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: KHen]
azandj Offline
Full Member

Registered: 12/24/10
Posts: 45
Loc: Texas, USA
Originally Posted By: KHen
williams overture piano
T.T
_________________________
Home piano: Yamaha P2 upright

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#1719527 - 07/23/11 07:49 PM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: KHen]
ando Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/10
Posts: 3480
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Originally Posted By: KHen
I play at church on the williams overture piano they have, it's horrible in my opinion...


Our friend, Gyro, isn't going to like hearing that. He plays the "biggest concertos" on his... laugh

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#1719756 - 07/24/11 02:09 AM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: ando]
pv88 Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 08/31/10
Posts: 2580
Originally Posted By: ando
Originally Posted By: KHen
I play at church on the williams overture piano they have, it's horrible in my opinion...


Our friend, Gyro, isn't going to like hearing that. He plays the "biggest concertos" on his... laugh


Would also like to hear our friend above perform/post a performance of any big concerto (or, a part thereof) for us to listen to?

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#1719778 - 07/24/11 03:19 AM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: KHen]
KHen Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 183
Loc: North America
Haha yeah I don't much care for the williams where I play at.

@ vox, thanks for putting in your 2 cents worth. I see that you have the NP88, how do you compare the fp4 to the the np's action. I've heard that the NP88 action is the worst part of the dp, but do you like the action of the fp4 better than it? The np88 is nowhere near my budget I was just kind of getting a feel for how the action would be.

Anyone else have any opinions at all about the dp's in my budget. I think before I started this thread I was already leaning toward the fp4, but I wanted to hear what others have to say.

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#1719819 - 07/24/11 06:53 AM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: KHen]
macbug Offline
Full Member

Registered: 07/20/11
Posts: 80
Loc: Vancouver
I saw a street band downtown last week and they were using a white FP4... but definitely try it out before you buy!

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#1719894 - 07/24/11 10:56 AM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: KHen]
voxpops Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 3016
Loc: Oregon
Originally Posted By: KHen
how do you compare the fp4 to the the np's action. I've heard that the NP88 action is the worst part of the dp, but do you like the action of the fp4 better than it?

You know, I don't notice too much difference between the two actions, at least nowhere near the difference between either of those and the FP-7F's. The NP88's is possibly a tad heavier than the FP-4's, but when playing they both respond fairly well. For some reason though, the NP88's action bugs me a bit whereas the FP-4's doesn't. It may be more psychological than anything, to do with their relative price points and the quality of the samples. I would say that the FP-4 ties together better as a package - nothing stands out as being mismatched - just don't expect too much from the built-in speakers.

Of course, the FP-7F is a much more sophisticated piano emulator than the FP-4, but it's also twice the price.
_________________________
Occasional author and inveterate ivory tickler:
http://www.amazon.com/author/richardspanswick

https://soundcloud.com/richards-recordings/sets/strange-charm-waiting-for-the/s-ppGuy

"can hardly wait to hear what voxpox has to say..."
[HisKidd, May 2014]

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#1727856 - 08/06/11 04:43 PM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: KHen]
KHen Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 183
Loc: North America
Thanks for responding back and sorry it took me forever to write back. Looks like I'll be making a little trip to guitar center in like 3 weeks so hopefully I will get a chance to try out the fp4. All the youtube clips I have found of it sound pretty good to me and I am by no means good at all, personally I would think the fp4 is way to much piano for my skill.

It seems though at my price point of $800 that the fp4 may be the best that I can get. Looking forward to the coming weeks!

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#1728094 - 08/07/11 06:48 AM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: KHen]
joangolfing Offline
500 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/06
Posts: 666
Loc: Iowa
I play on a Roland FP-4 and like the action compared to my Everett upright piano. It is very light and easy to carry with me when I travel for 3 months in the winter. It has been very reliable compared to the Korg SP250 that I owned before this one. The keys on the Korg got noisy over time. It don't see that happening on the Roland FP-4. I'm sure there are people like me wanting to move up to the FP-4f and willing to sell.

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#1728104 - 08/07/11 07:23 AM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: KHen]
EssBrace Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/01/09
Posts: 2373
Loc: Suffolk, United Kingdom
If there is any chance at all you can get the P155 on a deal at your budget, then that is the one in my opinion.

FP-4 is often criticised for its action, although a few people do like it. I think the Nord has a significantly superior action to the FP-4.

All the pianos you mention have built-in speakers. If that is not a definite requirement you might pick up a Yamaha CP33 for $800. You might also just want to check out the Yamaha P95 - will be within budget but has a lighter action along the lines of the Roland FP-4 - but some people really like it.

What's with the Williams then? Gyro shouts from the rooftops about it..."the logo makes Steinway's look cheap", "it's okay", "I find it adequate"....high praise indeed! Or maybe you want more than "okay" or "adequate"?...so maybe you have to wear a hair shirt and self flagellate to really appreciate the Williams.

Anyway, good luck in your search.

Steve
_________________________
Yamaha CP1

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#1728154 - 08/07/11 10:46 AM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: voxpops]
anotherscott Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 3142
Originally Posted By: voxpops
Originally Posted By: KHen
how do you compare the fp4 to the the np's action. I've heard that the NP88 action is the worst part of the dp, but do you like the action of the fp4 better than it?

You know, I don't notice too much difference between the two actions, at least nowhere near the difference between either of those and the FP-7F's. The NP88's is possibly a tad heavier than the FP-4's, but when playing they both respond fairly well. For some reason though, the NP88's action bugs me a bit whereas the FP-4's doesn't. It may be more psychological than anything, to do with their relative price points and the quality of the samples. I would say that the FP-4 ties together better as a package - nothing stands out as being mismatched - just don't expect too much from the built-in speakers.

One thing that bugged me about the Nord action on the weighted Stage 2 (which I believe is very close to the action of the Nord Piano) is that the trigger point seemed low. Specifically, if I tried to do a thumb glissando from the top octave down, using just the nail tip of my thumb as I normally would, most of the keys would not sound. I did not have that problem on the weighted 88s I've played from Yamaha or Casio. Not that's it's a deal-killer, but it is something I noticed. Do you see that on the NP88, and is it any different on the similar feeling FP4?

On a related topic, although it's not in your sig, I noticed in another post that you also have (or had) a Kawai MP5. I was wondering how you would compare its action to the Nord, the FP4, the FP7F that you have...? I played an MP6 and felt the action was a bit heavy for my taste, but I read somewhere that the MP5 may be lighter. (I really like the feel of the FP-7 and FP-7F.)

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#1728187 - 08/07/11 11:44 AM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: anotherscott]
EssBrace Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/01/09
Posts: 2373
Loc: Suffolk, United Kingdom
Originally Posted By: anotherscott
One thing that bugged me about the Nord action on the weighted Stage 2 (which I believe is very close to the action of the Nord Piano) is that the trigger point seemed low. Specifically, if I tried to do a thumb glissando from the top octave down, using just the nail tip of my thumb as I normally would, most of the keys would not sound. I did not have that problem on the weighted 88s I've played from Yamaha or Casio. Not that's it's a deal-killer, but it is something I noticed. Do you see that on the NP88, and is it any different on the similar feeling FP4?


This is the precise modification that Nord have had Fatar make to actions for the NP88 - the trigger point has been changed to better reflect piano behaviour so this should not be an issue on NP.
_________________________
Yamaha CP1

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#1728311 - 08/07/11 03:38 PM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: EssBrace]
Auver Offline
Full Member

Registered: 03/13/11
Posts: 193
Loc: Norway
Originally Posted By: EssBrace
Originally Posted By: anotherscott
One thing that bugged me about the Nord action on the weighted Stage 2 (which I believe is very close to the action of the Nord Piano) is that the trigger point seemed low. Specifically, if I tried to do a thumb glissando from the top octave down, using just the nail tip of my thumb as I normally would, most of the keys would not sound. I did not have that problem on the weighted 88s I've played from Yamaha or Casio. Not that's it's a deal-killer, but it is something I noticed. Do you see that on the NP88, and is it any different on the similar feeling FP4?


This is the precise modification that Nord have had Fatar make to actions for the NP88 - the trigger point has been changed to better reflect piano behaviour so this should not be an issue on NP.


This is unfortunately not true, I've had the exact same problem as anotherscott on the Nord Piano. I think the action is responsive and nice, but when doing Jerry Lee music like I do much of, that glissando thing REALLY bugs me.
_________________________
My youtube channel for some fun stuff I do:
http://www.youtube.com/user/AuverAskerud?feature=mhum

Yamaha Clavinova CLP-811
Nord Piano 88

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#1728323 - 08/07/11 03:56 PM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: KHen]
EssBrace Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/01/09
Posts: 2373
Loc: Suffolk, United Kingdom
From the "Sound on Sound" review:

The NP88 has 88 velocity-sensitive keys and uses a Fatar keybed, modified to Nord’s specifications with a slightly deeper trigger point than on the Stage EX. This apparently improves fast repetition behaviour and gives a better feel for the acoustic sounds.

I remember reading about modifications to the trigger point but this actually says deeper, which I assume would cause your difficulties. For what it's worth, I also have a Yamaha CP33 up and running at the moment and I find that slightly frustrating because notes don't sound until the key actually bottoms out. Keys don't have to hit the bottom on the Nord before notes sound.

Steve
_________________________
Yamaha CP1

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#1728326 - 08/07/11 04:01 PM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: EssBrace]
KHen Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 183
Loc: North America
Ya the Williams piano has like 150 sounds, and all 150 of them are unusable live. I HAVE to use the grand piano so I have no choice.

Originally Posted By: EssBrace


All the pianos you mention have built-in speakers. If that is not a definite requirement you might pick up a Yamaha CP33 for $800.



I would prefer built in speakers because I will be practicing at home and my wife would like to hear me play and the built in's help on stage also. The cp33 has crossed my mind though. Either way I'll know in the coming weeks, if the Guitar center here carries any of the pianos that interest me.

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#1728421 - 08/07/11 07:01 PM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: EssBrace]
anotherscott Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 3142
Originally Posted By: EssBrace
I remember reading about modifications to the trigger point but this actually says deeper, which I assume would cause your difficulties. For what it's worth, I also have a Yamaha CP33 up and running at the moment and I find that slightly frustrating because notes don't sound until the key actually bottoms out. Keys don't have to hit the bottom on the Nord before notes sound.

Interesting. I only briefly played the CP33 and P155 in a store, I didn't try gliss on them. But a shallow gliss works fine on Yamaha's less heavy actions, i.e. P95 and MOX8. It also works on various Casios. Besides the Nord, the only other action that I had a gliss problem on was a Kurzweil PC1SE, which I believe uses the same action as the older Nord Stage (i.e. before the Stage 2)... though as I said, it also happens on a Stage 2.

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#1732392 - 08/13/11 05:10 PM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: KHen]
KHen Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 183
Loc: North America
So I just thought of this idea. The new Casio px135 will be out soon, and it has an improved action. It will probably retail for around the same amount as the 130, say $500. What if I used my $800 to buy the px135, a set of decent headphones (akg k240's) a virtual piano (pianoteq play, or something else for around $100) and a nice book to learn jazz from. This new casio has the onboard speakers I need and it's portable for the onstage use. Sounds like a pretty good option, what do you guys think?

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#1732842 - 08/14/11 02:30 PM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: KHen]
anotherscott Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 3142
Originally Posted By: KHen
So I just thought of this idea. The new Casio px135 will be out soon, and it has an improved action. It will probably retail for around the same amount as the 130, say $500. What if I used my $800 to buy the px135, a set of decent headphones (akg k240's) a virtual piano (pianoteq play, or something else for around $100) and a nice book to learn jazz from. This new casio has the onboard speakers I need and it's portable for the onstage use. Sounds like a pretty good option, what do you guys think?

Similar to the situation just discussed in another thread... If you're triggering a virtual piano anyway, you could save more and not have to wait for a new model just by buying a Casio CDP-100. I don't know how the action feels on the PX135 of course, but today, I would take a CDP-100 over a PX-130. I think the action is better, and for the live gigs where you're not triggering a virtual piano, although the CDP-100 piano sound may be less authentic in some respects, I think it actually "plays" more musically than the PX-130.

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#1732895 - 08/14/11 04:53 PM Re: Woohoo! LF stage type for $800. [Re: KHen]
KHen Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/18/09
Posts: 183
Loc: North America
Well for my situation I only have $800 to buy a dp. I want this dp to have onboard speakers for practicing with, be portable, and have a decent enough action with a sound that can be heard live without people cringing at it's sound. The FP4 is perfect for this, although finding it for $800 has been somewhat difficult. No one local has one and no craigslist adds around either.

I'm not sure how long I'd have to wait for the px135 before I can demo it, but I know that I still have a few weeks before I pull the trigger on a purchase.

As far as the cdp-100 goes I'll look into it and see if I can try it's action, thanks for the suggestion.

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