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To me the DMA program (at least the one I am in) seems to allow a pianist to grow not only in technical prowess, but also in breadth of exploring literature. There are three recitals which need to encompass the whole range of literature. For me, I would rather see well rounded and get the opportunity to explore a bunch of different styles/periods etc in order to see what the professors here have to say over playing say Islamey, Op. 57 - Beethoven, Rach 3, etc. Although these pieces are excellent, they aren't the entire repertoire. All music (well almost all music) has some kind of value, and I think that is what one needs to take away, no matter at what level we are playing.


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Originally Posted by Mark_C
Originally Posted by carey
....I love (and play) the Schumann Arabeske - but it really is undergrad material - not DMA. I'd suggest you tackle something more substantial by Schumann....

When someone is at the DMA level they should (IMHO) be tackling more substantial repertoire.

P.S. Maybe we ought to talk about what goes on in DMA programs. smile

I've never been in one, nor in any formal music program at all, so I don't know.

Are you saying that they wouldn't have a high regard for pieces with such interpretive and musical challenges? All the pieces need to have difficult finger-wiggling?

If so, I'd find it sad -- and problematic. If they don't feel like giving emphasis to such challenges, where do such challenges receive emphasis? And it would seem like a failure of recognition of some of the most sophisticated challenges of music-making, as well as of musical thinking.


In my limited experience I've seen DMA students perform works such as the Schumann Fantasy, Kreisleriana and Carnaval on their recitals. These works have technical challenges as well as interpretive/musical challenges that far exceed those of the Arabeske IMO. Interpretive/musical challenges should be emphasized at the undergrad and masters levels. By the time a student enters a DMA program it is assumed that the basic aspects of music making are already second nature - and that the individual is ready to tackle the most challenging works in the repertoire.

But then, I've been away from academia for decades, so perhaps I'm all wet....... grin


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Originally Posted by carey
....By the time a student enters a DMA program it is assumed that the basic aspects of music making are already second nature....

Maybe we just see the piece differently. I think this stuff about the Arabeske goes way, way beyond "basic aspects of music making."

Quote
But then, I've been away from academia for decades, so perhaps I'm all wet....... grin

But then I've never been in it, so maybe I'm not even dry. ha

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Originally Posted by carey
Originally Posted by Mark_C
Originally Posted by carey
....I love (and play) the Schumann Arabeske - but it really is undergrad material - not DMA. I'd suggest you tackle something more substantial by Schumann....

When someone is at the DMA level they should (IMHO) be tackling more substantial repertoire.

P.S. Maybe we ought to talk about what goes on in DMA programs. smile

I've never been in one, nor in any formal music program at all, so I don't know.

Are you saying that they wouldn't have a high regard for pieces with such interpretive and musical challenges? All the pieces need to have difficult finger-wiggling?

If so, I'd find it sad -- and problematic. If they don't feel like giving emphasis to such challenges, where do such challenges receive emphasis? And it would seem like a failure of recognition of some of the most sophisticated challenges of music-making, as well as of musical thinking.


In my limited experience I've seen DMA students perform works such as the Schumann Fantasy, Kreisleriana and Carnaval on their recitals. These works have technical challenges as well as interpretive/musical challenges that far exceed those of the Arabeske IMO.
(My bold face)

Exactly. No one is suggesting choosing pieces that are mostly technical challenges. The most appropriate choice seems pieces with both high technical and high musical challenges.

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Two thoughts:

1) Mark is correct. At the DMA level, musical and technical fundamentals should be second nature. The DMA is for refinement, continued artistic growth, and learning how to manage oneself as a professional musician.

2) That being said, that refinement and continued growth doesn't mean all of one's repertoire needs to be at a high level of technical and musical difficulty. If the Schumann Arabesque and Chopin Mazurkas were good enough for Horowitz to put on concerts later in life, then they're absolutely appropriate material for a DMA student.

Now...if you're doing the Arabesque as a DMA student, you should probably be able to learn it and present it in a lesson in about a week's time, and it should be memorized and ready to go the following week. (And you shouldn't have to rely on a teacher for basic fingering, pedaling, and phrasing advice, either.)

I've known some truly excellent DMA students to present things like Chopin preludes, Kinderszenen, and pre-Hoboken 50 Haydn sonatas on recital programs. But they sounded like they were played by DMA students, not just good undergrads, and they could also handle Chopin ballades and post-opus 27 Beethoven sonatas as well.

I think people occasionally misunderstand what the DMA is for. It's not necessarily for producing concert pianists and building a large concerto repertoire. Many DMA students go on to teach and accompany, which means gaining a lot of experience with a wide body of repertoire suitable for teaching and the ability to learn music quickly.

A person with the letters DMA after their name should be an excellent musician who does professional-quality work, but that doesn't always mean Rachmaninoff concerti. Sometimes it means learning a Hindemith sonata on 5 days notice. (And for most of us, guess which of those two you're more likely to get a phone call for...)


"If we continually try to force a child to do what he is afraid to do, he will become more timid, and will use his brains and energy, not to explore the unknown, but to find ways to avoid the pressures we put on him." (John Holt)

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