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#1734765 - 08/17/11 12:18 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: Norman Cotterell]
time flies Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 125
Nice going Norman. You've got a nice swing going there. And congrats on your first recording in JOI. I'm looking forward to many more. (And thank you for your comments).


Edited by time flies (08/17/11 12:21 AM)

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#1734831 - 08/17/11 03:27 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
ten left thumbs Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 3328
Loc: Scotland
Good going, time, that swings! You have good control of those keys. If you can dedicate time to this, then you will fly through some of these lessons. Thanks for sharing the singing with us too, it is a most valuable exercise. smile

Norm, the blues sounded good to me. smile You kept it slow, you didn't skip a beat, and it sounded accurate. Can you do that and sing while you're playing?

Thanks custard and knotty for the encouragement. I did see the masterclass on Parker, though perhaps I should watch it again. Trying to keep an open mind. I will spend some time on the head, and may try stabbing chords while I sing as knots suggested. On starting with the solo from Moose, my first thoughts are - maybe it's not so much Charlie I object to, as his backing. What was the drummer thinking?
_________________________
I am a competent teacher.


www.justfingers.co.uk
www.babysinging.co.uk

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#1734891 - 08/17/11 07:10 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: ten left thumbs]
Norman Cotterell Offline
Full Member

Registered: 06/08/06
Posts: 138
Loc: Elkins Park, PA
Originally Posted By: ten left thumbs
Norm, the blues sounded good to me. smile You kept it slow, you didn't skip a beat, and it sounded accurate. Can you do that and sing while you're playing?


You bet! Sometimes I can't keep from singing. It didn't come through, however, because I had the keyboard plugged into the computer. Next time, I'll experiment with a screen mic, a soft whine, and a steady rhythm.

Ten & Time, Thanks for your kind comments. This was a bit of a technological leap for me, but as time goes by, I'll get the hang of it.
_________________________
Every disease is a musical problem. Its cure, a musical solution. -- Novalis

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#1734899 - 08/17/11 07:37 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
custard apple Online   blank
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/09
Posts: 2263
Loc: Sydney
Hey Norm
Lesson 1 and you're already swingin' ! I'm pleased you love recording.
btw there will be a competition between you and 10 for best Satchmo !

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#1734901 - 08/17/11 07:44 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: time flies]
custard apple Online   blank
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/09
Posts: 2263
Loc: Sydney
Originally Posted By: time flies
I'm very fortunate - I've got lots of time to spend with JOI, and I'm having a great time!

Here's lesson #5.
(I'm pretty comfortable with the solo pattern transpositions with lesson #3 and am working on the solo pattern in lesson #4. Doing the other things too. Started lesson #6).

Sugar Blues (watch out for the metronome)
Sweet And Low
...and a special treat - vocals!
I was pretty Satchmoe'd out (probably due to the poor audio) so I jumped ahead a little to Lester Young.
Fooling Myself They don't write songs like this anymore frown Sigh - I miss the old days.



Oh yeh ! How KOOOOL was all that ! Go Time !
You're always very accurate in your JOI tunes, even "detaching" at the right place for the held notes. You've got a great feel and it's amazing that you're already on Lesson 6 having been on Lesson 4 last week, congrats.
I always thought Billie Holiday needed someone to fill in for her on her "off" nights. Foolin' myself was my favourite.

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#1735278 - 08/17/11 05:35 PM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
ten left thumbs Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 3328
Loc: Scotland
Originally Posted By: custard apple


btw there will be a competition between you and 10 for best Satchmo !


It's a deal! laugh

I recorded the tunes to lesson 17 today, though it's not my best.
http://www.box.net/shared/8j1spnhemu9sscbdlo9l

My voice was tired so I tried to whistle, but some of those runs are way out of range! It made me realise I don't know the tunes as well as I think I do.

The other thing I've done is starting to go back over the previous tunes. I forget them easier than I learned them. wink

I've done a bit more improvising and I'll have some time tomorrow to dedicate to it.
_________________________
I am a competent teacher.


www.justfingers.co.uk
www.babysinging.co.uk

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#1735535 - 08/18/11 01:20 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: ten left thumbs]
time flies Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 125
Custard and Ten, thank you for your comments.

Ten, that sounds really difficult to do, especially unaccompanied.

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#1735668 - 08/18/11 08:10 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: ten left thumbs]
custard apple Online   blank
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/09
Posts: 2263
Loc: Sydney
Originally Posted By: ten left thumbs


My voice was tired so I tried to whistle, but some of those runs are way out of range! It made me realise I don't know the tunes as well as I think I do.

The other thing I've done is starting to go back over the previous tunes. I forget them easier than I learned them. wink



I don't blame you for having a tired voice. 10 min of singing Bird/Navarro = one and a half hours of a tennis lesson.
I think that the tunes get harder to sing. I am fine singing with the melody. But when I sing with LH chords only or a capella, I tend to start off on the new phrase singing a funny note, when the preceding phrase ends on a note a lot further away from the beginning note of the new phrase.

How long was the C section line in Lesson 17 !

That's great and very important to revise old tunes. Tunes 2 lessons back from my current lesson are easy to forget.

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#1735669 - 08/18/11 08:11 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
custard apple Online   blank
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/09
Posts: 2263
Loc: Sydney
Hello !
I've been improvising long lines for my 3 scales: C maj, F maj, F min.

http://www.box.net/shared/omb1s64l2808a8zee998

I would value your feedback. Thanks very much.

Cheers
cus

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#1735828 - 08/18/11 12:51 PM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
time flies Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 125
Custard - that's beautiful! Wonderful long lines - very melodic.

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#1735838 - 08/18/11 01:01 PM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
ten left thumbs Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 3328
Loc: Scotland
Thanks for the encouragement, folks. That particular line custard, is long, but also wonderful. I had set myself the task of whistling the correct notes. Possibly too hard. smile
Keeping track of the old tunes is easy at the beginning, but as you make progress, it's a lot to revise. I may spend a week just reading them through.

Custard, your improvisation sounds great! You are getting those key shifts and it sounds like jazz! thumb

Now, my improv. I hesitate to post. I exhausted my poor zoom's batteries after 9 minutes. Please don't feel obliged to listen. I'm doing ii-V-Is in:
C
F (1:20)
Bb (2:20)
Eb (3:40)
Ab (4:50 - after some LH confusion which I deleted)
G (6:30)
D (8:20 - this carried on a little longer, but the zoom gave out)

I recorded warts and all, as I feel I may as well mark as baseline for where I am. Today is the first time I did in all keys like this. I had in front of me the keys, chords and some written-out lines, but what you hear is all improvisation, not the composed lines.

My aim was to get to the quaver flow and stay there as long as possible. I did push myself with that. It felt fairly pointless while I was playing, but on listening to the recording, there are a few nice lines in among all the dross.

I'm not in any way singing a song in my head and replicating it with my fingers (or at least that happens only very very rarely). What I'm mostly thinking is this: play the scale. Play an interval larger than a tone. Ascend. Descend. Ascend and descend. Keep playing. Scale. Play some chord notes. What do you mean you don't know what chord you're on? OK, don't panic, look at the LH and do some of that. Can I take a break yet? Stick in a chromatic note, land on 5 and then take a break. Breathe.

So, obvious question: is this normal?
_________________________
I am a competent teacher.


www.justfingers.co.uk
www.babysinging.co.uk

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#1735891 - 08/18/11 02:11 PM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: ten left thumbs]
time flies Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 125
....


Edited by time flies (08/18/11 04:23 PM)

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#1735897 - 08/18/11 02:18 PM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
ten left thumbs Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 3328
Loc: Scotland
_________________________
I am a competent teacher.


www.justfingers.co.uk
www.babysinging.co.uk

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#1735918 - 08/18/11 02:52 PM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: ten left thumbs]
time flies Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 125
...


Edited by time flies (08/18/11 04:24 PM)

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#1735981 - 08/18/11 04:19 PM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
time flies Offline
Full Member

Registered: 10/01/10
Posts: 125
On reflection, I think that offering comments on improv is above my paygrade, so I'm retiring from that aspect. I think everyone sounds great and the progress shown is very encouraging.

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#1735991 - 08/18/11 04:43 PM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
ten left thumbs Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 3328
Loc: Scotland
Not at all time, you deserve a medal for listening to the whole thing! smile I have learned to trust the guidance I get here.
_________________________
I am a competent teacher.


www.justfingers.co.uk
www.babysinging.co.uk

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#1736058 - 08/18/11 06:22 PM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
knotty Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/01/07
Posts: 2940
Loc: Bethesda, MD (Washington D.C)
10,

I did not listen to the whole thing but here are my 2 cents.
You're totally on the right track. You're 8ths are nice and the swing is good. There's a million things you can improve, but one can only work on one thing at a time.
I would say to start by making your lines a little shorter. But when you stop them, actually stop and let that last note ring nicely.
For example, at 2:08, you start a phrase that you end at 2:13, which is nice, then you rush to start a new one within that same second. Then it stops and restart. That can work sometimes, but for now, I'd say to play a line, end it as if you're taking a break, then come up with a new one.

You heard Dave talk about the little guy in your head. He tells you when to end and start the lines. The flow is very important, and, imho, you generally don't want to break that flow. Don't over extend your line. When it's done it's done. Soon enough, they'll get long with a nice flow.

If you're not sure what I mean, I can try and record something for you.

Keep experimenting with all those concepts, you are on the right track.

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#1736060 - 08/18/11 06:26 PM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
knotty Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/01/07
Posts: 2940
Loc: Bethesda, MD (Washington D.C)
For a good example, check out Cus's post.
Very nice long un-interrupted line. You don't have to play lines that long, and Cus' is a bit more advanced because she has to switch key, but see how she has a line with a clear beginning and end. That sounds good to me.

Cus, congrats on connecting those lines.

Go ahead and do that in 6 keys for a while, maybe a couple weeks? Sounds really good.

If you feel very well in control, you can play with increasing the tempo a little bit.

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#1736191 - 08/18/11 10:08 PM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
custard apple Online   blank
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/09
Posts: 2263
Loc: Sydney
Knotty, Time and 10
Thank you for your kind comments. I kept on replaying Dave's g+ lesson to me. I really wanted to push myself and it was really hard to think long lines (I hadn't improvised long lines before) let alone in 3 scales.

Knotty
I will aim to do the F maj 3 scale one @ 80 bpm. I will create the LH chord progression tonight, and if you don't mind, I would love if you would check it. Thanks !

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#1736194 - 08/18/11 10:11 PM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: ten left thumbs]
custard apple Online   blank
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/09
Posts: 2263
Loc: Sydney
Originally Posted By: ten left thumbs

Keeping track of the old tunes is easy at the beginning, but as you make progress, it's a lot to revise. I may spend a week just reading them through.



As Knotty said, you can't be expected to know all the tunes in the book. Maybe revise just the last 3 lessons.

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#1736281 - 08/19/11 02:26 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
ten left thumbs Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 3328
Loc: Scotland
Thanks guys. With some shorter phrases it should be much easier. smile
_________________________
I am a competent teacher.


www.justfingers.co.uk
www.babysinging.co.uk

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#1736340 - 08/19/11 05:52 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
custard apple Online   blank
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/09
Posts: 2263
Loc: Sydney
Good morning Knotty

Would you mind checking my LH chords if you have time ?

http://www.box.net/shared/x1zp7m8ncjbtun7ehkiq

F maj 7 D G A C
F7 Eb G A D
C maj 7 E G A D
C min 6 Eb G A C
F maj 7 D G A C
F maj 7 E F A C

Thank you !

cus

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#1736377 - 08/19/11 07:50 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
knotty Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/01/07
Posts: 2940
Loc: Bethesda, MD (Washington D.C)
Cus,

These look fine to me.

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#1736378 - 08/19/11 07:54 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: ten left thumbs]
knotty Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/01/07
Posts: 2940
Loc: Bethesda, MD (Washington D.C)
Originally Posted By: ten left thumbs
Thanks guys. With some shorter phrases it should be much easier. smile


Ultimately, you want to stretch out and play long lines. But if the line stops, it stops. When you're comfortable with the short lines, push yourself and extend the flow of quavers.

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#1736380 - 08/19/11 07:57 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: custard apple]
knotty Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/01/07
Posts: 2940
Loc: Bethesda, MD (Washington D.C)
Originally Posted By: custard apple
Originally Posted By: ten left thumbs

Keeping track of the old tunes is easy at the beginning, but as you make progress, it's a lot to revise. I may spend a week just reading them through.



As Knotty said, you can't be expected to know all the tunes in the book. Maybe revise just the last 3 lessons.


This is hard to do. If you are organized, you can decide to review one of the past tunes each day. And instead of playing it, just sing it. Shouldn't take too long.

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#1736384 - 08/19/11 08:02 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: knotty]
custard apple Online   blank
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/09
Posts: 2263
Loc: Sydney
Originally Posted By: knotty
Cus,

These look fine to me.



Thanks Knots, you are da bomb.

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#1736735 - 08/19/11 07:08 PM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: knotty]
ten left thumbs Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 3328
Loc: Scotland
Originally Posted By: knotty
Originally Posted By: ten left thumbs
Thanks guys. With some shorter phrases it should be much easier. smile


Ultimately, you want to stretch out and play long lines. But if the line stops, it stops. When you're comfortable with the short lines, push yourself and extend the flow of quavers.


Did my 6 keys again today and it went better. I stopped talking to myself quite so manically and let some of the lines be shorter. A teensy bit more of intending to hit a note and then actually hitting it, happened. Amazingly, just playing up and down the scale gives fairly good results - with a few intervals and bits of repetition. I will do this a couple more times and then record again.
_________________________
I am a competent teacher.


www.justfingers.co.uk
www.babysinging.co.uk

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#1736738 - 08/19/11 07:13 PM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: ten left thumbs]
knotty Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/01/07
Posts: 2940
Loc: Bethesda, MD (Washington D.C)
Originally Posted By: ten left thumbs


Did my 6 keys again today and it went better. I stopped talking to myself quite so manically and let some of the lines be shorter. A teensy bit more of intending to hit a note and then actually hitting it, happened. Amazingly, just playing up and down the scale gives fairly good results - with a few intervals and bits of repetition. I will do this a couple more times and then record again.


Yeah I believe that. Do you remember what 3 concepts DF said were most important? I can't recall now...
He talked about that in the first "group lesson"

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#1736963 - 08/20/11 02:39 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: knotty]
custard apple Online   blank
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/11/09
Posts: 2263
Loc: Sydney
I know that lesson word for word smile

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#1736985 - 08/20/11 04:18 AM Re: Join the JOI jazz joint ! [Re: knotty]
ten left thumbs Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 05/22/09
Posts: 3328
Loc: Scotland
Originally Posted By: knotty



Yeah I believe that. Do you remember what 3 concepts DF said were most important? I can't recall now...
He talked about that in the first "group lesson"



I. Flow. 8th feel.
II. Rests. Let it breathe.
III. Where you land matters.
_________________________
I am a competent teacher.


www.justfingers.co.uk
www.babysinging.co.uk

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