I'm thinking about upgrading my digital piano, and I'm particularly interested in the roland PHA III action with ivory feel keyboard because its found on the V-piano which i can only assume is the best they make.

I can't afford the V-piano but the same action can be found on the much cheaper FP7F, this got me thinking, is there a cheaper model with the same action? i dont care about anything else since I use pianoteq and only play classical.

I have tried the V-piano and it feels bloody amazing is all i can say.

thanks

The FP-7F is the cheapest keyboard/digital piano that has the PHA III action. Now, there's been much talk on why the V-Piano with its PHA III action feels so much different than every other Roland DP with PHA III, like the FP-7F, RD-700NX, HP-307, etc. The difference comes probably partly from the physical construction of the V-Piano's body and how the action sits inside it, but more likely because of the V-Piano's distinct modeling sound technology. Because modeling behaves more authentic and realistic than sample based sound generation, the overall connection of the action and sound creates a better overall experience, with seemingly more control.

A side note on the PHA III-I find it a bit strange that Roland puts their top of the line piano action, which is good, inside a $2,000 DP they also put inside their now super expensive top of the line V-Piano Grand that costs $20,000. The V-Piano Grand and V-Piano both deserve a real grand piano action for the price you pay for them.

As for how the PHA II action compares to the PHA III, I've had the pleasure of owning the RD-700GXF with PHA II action and the RD-700NX with PHA III action at the same time. I ended up sending the RD-700NX back since it was a very subtle upgrade to the RD-700GXF. The PHA II action feels and plays nearly identically to the PHA III. They feel the same and play the same. The PHA III possesses a 3rd sensor, hence the PHA III, and this is helpful for fast trills and repetitions. If you're wanting the PHA III action for controlling, you would be just as well getting your hands on either a second hand RD-700GX(F) or FP-7 which both have the PHA II action, which is very good.

Two things:
1. If you're playing classical, get PHA III over PHA II - 3 sensor pianos are better at responding to fast repetitions without sacrificing control of dynamics.

2. The V-piano is not limited to MIDI's 127 steps of dynamics. I'm not absolutely certain but I think it has double the resolution. This will make a big difference in expressivity and dynamic control.

Agree with vox. Supposedly the AvantGrand a resolution of 1028, however, as another member pointed out to me, even with 1028 layers of midi steps dynamically, the human ear can't hear the difference. The AG does have wonderful control over dynamics though, but so do the new Roland and Kawais.

thanks guys that was very informative. so am I correct in saying that most of the advantages of the V-piano will be lost if I use the FP7F with a modelling software, such as pianoteq?

You will lose the increased resolution, but not the wonderfully responsive action. I suspect (but don't know for sure) that software pianos are limited to the standard MIDI spec anyway when it comes to what they can respond to in terms of velocity information.