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#1871114 - 03/30/12 05:34 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: Qbert]
thomsurf Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/01/10
Posts: 151
Loc: Copenhagen, Denmark
Finally got mine back after a months wait. Man did I miss that piano sound. Didn't miss the action or anything else though. Well, the low weight is still nice. Anyway, they seemed to have fixed the shivering mod wheel. Hope I'll never need any Studiologic/Thomann assistance again wink
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Roland RD800, JBL PRX612M.

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#1871142 - 03/30/12 06:59 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: Qbert]
voxpops Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 2918
Loc: Oregon
Good to hear that, Thomsurf. Hope you have no further problems.

On a side note, how do you find the action on your RD-300NX? Months ago I decided not to upgrade my FP-4 to the FP-4F/RD-300NX, based on people's reports about the action being sluggish - but I've not had a chance to try one.

As for my continuing Numa saga, Studiologic reneged on their promise to send me the original software - but then I didn't expect them to keep their word.

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#1871324 - 03/31/12 05:26 AM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: Qbert]
thomsurf Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/01/10
Posts: 151
Loc: Copenhagen, Denmark
Well, I have played my RD a lot during the last month and I'm beginning to appreciate the action more and more. It is a tiny bit 'wobly' or 'sluggish' compared to top of the line DPs, but definetely still a good action and way better than the Numa depending on your style of playing. The Numa is fine for hammering pop/rock chords (like what I'm doing in my Coldplay tribute band). Actually it's perfect for that, but it really falls short for classical stuff or peices with fast precise sequences. I find the Roland to be the complete opposite. Tough and harsh for rock stuff, but nice for the gentle stuff.
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Roland RD800, JBL PRX612M.

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#1871432 - 03/31/12 12:13 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: Qbert]
voxpops Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 2918
Loc: Oregon
Thanks for the comparison, Thomsurf. I agree with you completely about the action in the Numa (Fatar TP100), which is very difficult to control when subtlety is required. The old FP4 is much better for dynamic control, even though it feels less realistic, and does not inspire confidence in the player due to its lightness. It's also a shame that Nord is so locked in to Fatar for their actions - as that, to me, is their Achilles heel.

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#1871444 - 03/31/12 12:55 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: voxpops]
anotherscott Online   content
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 02/20/10
Posts: 3076
Originally Posted By: voxpops
It's also a shame that Nord is so locked in to Fatar for their actions - as that, to me, is their Achilles heel.

There just isn't much to choose from. Roland, Kawai, Yamaha, Casio all make their own actions, but AFAIK, don't sell them to anyone else. I could see where it could be cost-prohibitive for a small company to manufacture their own design, so where else can they buy one? M-Audio uses some Chinese brand, but they don't feel as good as Fatars!

Some of this is also personal taste. I actually like the ones Nord uses in the Stage and Piano. The one in the E3HP, like the Numa Piano, has the advantage of allowing the model to be lightweight, but the action definitely does not feel as nice to me. There aren't a lot of actions available to put into something you want to bring out at 25 lbs, though.

I've actually liked a number of Fatar's unweighted boards too, though I don't like how tightly sprung the Nord variant is.

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#1871451 - 03/31/12 01:01 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: voxpops]
Manolios Offline
Full Member

Registered: 11/19/10
Posts: 125
Loc: Germany
Originally Posted By: voxpops
It's also a shame that Nord is so locked in to Fatar for their actions - as that, to me, is their Achilles heel.


+1

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#1871475 - 03/31/12 02:13 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: anotherscott]
voxpops Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 2918
Loc: Oregon
Originally Posted By: anotherscott
Originally Posted By: voxpops
It's also a shame that Nord is so locked in to Fatar for their actions - as that, to me, is their Achilles heel.

There just isn't much to choose from. Roland, Kawai, Yamaha, Casio all make their own actions, but AFAIK, don't sell them to anyone else. I could see where it could be cost-prohibitive for a small company to manufacture their own design, so where else can they buy one? M-Audio uses some Chinese brand, but they don't feel as good as Fatars!

Yes, I understand the reasons, but that doesn't stop it being something to regret. I wonder at what point it becomes cost-effective to develop one's own action. Nord is a leading brand in the professional arena (even though volume of sales must be way below the big four), and it would be a big plus if they were able to create actions that were specifically designed to complement their products. It's only very recently that they've made serious attempts at producing a dedicated piano, and the one thing it lacks is a great action, IMO.

Quote:
Some of this is also personal taste. I actually like the ones Nord uses in the Stage and Piano. The one in the E3HP, like the Numa Piano, has the advantage of allowing the model to be lightweight, but the action definitely does not feel as nice to me. There aren't a lot of actions available to put into something you want to bring out at 25 lbs, though.

The TP40(?) in the NP and Stage feels nice to play. However, it really struggles with repetition. How much of that is down to the mechanics/sensors, and how much to software, I can't say, but it undermines the instrument's value as a pro board to a certain extent. Roland and Kawai actions are simply way better.

As to the weight factor, I completely agree. It's great to be able to have boards that come in around 25lbs with a weighted action. That was one of the reasons I re-purchased the Numa. It's also one of the reasons for keeping the FP4. Neither of those actions is ideal - and that's completely understandable - but I'm happy enough with the compromise.

Quote:
I've actually liked a number of Fatar's unweighted boards too, though I don't like how tightly sprung the Nord variant is.

I don't have an issue with the unweighted boards - although I preferred the NE2 action to NE3 (I think they were trying to compensate for actually having usable piano sounds in the NE3!). I just think that the game has moved on in the weighted arena, and Fatar is now lagging behind a little.

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#1871581 - 03/31/12 06:04 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: voxpops]
ando Offline
3000 Post Club Member

Registered: 11/23/10
Posts: 3340
Loc: Melbourne, Australia
Originally Posted By: voxpops
I just think that the game has moved on in the weighted arena, and Fatar is now lagging behind a little.


Fatar has always lagged behind - a long way behind. They only exist because of price and weight. I don't think much of them as a company. Lazy product development, dubious quality/longevity, poor after-sales communication/parts availability. Typical Italian company in other words...

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#1928201 - 07/17/12 06:05 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: Qbert]
thomsurf Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/01/10
Posts: 151
Loc: Copenhagen, Denmark
The high B note on my Numa Piano plays a C (and so does the high C)! So that's two identical notes on two different keys.
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Roland RD800, JBL PRX612M.

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#1928228 - 07/17/12 06:56 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: thomsurf]
dewster Offline
4000 Post Club Member

Registered: 12/07/09
Posts: 4272
Loc: Northern NJ
Originally Posted By: thomsurf
The high B note on my Numa Piano plays a C (and so does the high C)! So that's two identical notes on two different keys.

Oh lord. The main reason I don't like this is because it dangerously lowers the bar for all other DP manufacturers ("Yeah, yeah, it's looped - but hey, at least it's not as bad as Fatar!").
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THE RD-700NX Thread!
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#1935898 - 08/01/12 03:32 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: thomsurf]
voxpops Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 2918
Loc: Oregon
Originally Posted By: thomsurf
The high B note on my Numa Piano plays a C (and so does the high C)! So that's two identical notes on two different keys.

Mine doesn't suffer this problem. I wonder if it's related to the soundpack upgrade (too buggy altogether, IMO) or if it's specific to your unit. I visit the Studiologic site from time to time to see if they've actually pulled their finger out and reworked the upgrade, but to no avail. I would not be surprised if they've quit on Numa Piano development, as too many people have found the software (and their support) lacking in various respects. If so it's a shame, as in different hands it could have been a real winner.

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#1935940 - 08/01/12 05:12 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: Qbert]
thomsurf Offline
Full Member

Registered: 09/01/10
Posts: 151
Loc: Copenhagen, Denmark
I guess it must be mine as I have upgraded... Anyway, I decided to let mine go. Believe it or not, but an Italian guy just picked it up. Hope he'll have more success in getting response from the company (in case he needs assistance:)
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#1993761 - 12/02/12 04:40 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: Qbert]
Grazzy Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/01/12
Posts: 11
Hi , guys, does anybody know, why some sites shows that Numa Piano weight is about 11,5 kilos and some shows that's about 13 kilos. What, is going on?? What weight real is? Or is it mean that some models are different?

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#1993915 - 12/02/12 10:46 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: Qbert]
voxpops Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 2918
Loc: Oregon
Grazzy, welcome to the forum.

The Numa Piano (without accessories) weighs in at around 25lbs or 11.5 kilos. The 13 kilos figure could refer to the total boxed weight, but that's just a guess.

(The only other related model is the Numa Compact which weighs around 14 lbs or 6.5 kilos.)

The Numa is a very easy digital piano to move around, similar in weight to the Casio PX range and the new Yamaha P-105. However, it's actually pretty sturdy, with a lot of metal in the construction.

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#1994162 - 12/03/12 01:59 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: Qbert]
Grazzy Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 12/01/12
Posts: 11
Thanks, Voxpops, I read about Numa piano at this forum,and some players talking about Numa's good ap and ep sounds there,but some complain about keys , action and other things. I have my Yamaha P 120 is very good , but is 10yrs old and I looking for some new piano who's weight less than 18 kilos.It is worth to change Yamaha P120 to Numa piano overall ?

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#2008399 - 01/03/13 07:53 AM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: Qbert]
keyboardologist Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 09/23/12
Posts: 8
Loc: Athens, Greece
Hello from Athens, Greece and happy new year with good health and wellbeing!
I've read this topic a few times in the past and another one today.
I have a Numa Nano (same action as Numa Piano) and although I know that the action isn't really great especially for those gentle passages, I'm pleased with the keyboard's physical weight. I'm using it more for practicing jazz piano the past year, I do 2-3 rehearsals per week (although in some studios I prefer to rent a midi controller), so carrying it isn't a pain, especially for me who I have some painful chronic diseases in one of my leg and in my waist and I don't have elevator at home (1st floor and a half floor steps), please Santa Claus, next year bring me an elevator!

I purchased my Numa Nano used from ebay Germany (480euro), and so I did with a Numa Piano (575euro) for a very close friend of mine (also started getting jazz piano lessons with the same teacher).
I'm trying to avoid using Nano's buttons/menu. I don't like it at all cause of the bulky touch keys. I configured one patch only, made some tweaks in the parameters, set the screen's touch sensitivity to zero so I can avoid pushing buttons easily with books/pencils/etc and I'm now focus on my rack gear knobs/buttons and params, along with the Behringer FCB1010 foot controller if needed for realtime editing in live situation.

The Numa Piano came with the old firmware, which was a disastrous. It crashed randomly, every about 1 to 2 hours. After a lot of pain, my friend managed to upgrade the firmware to the latest. We tried many times, all of them was unsuccessful. The last one, he did put out the audio out cable jack and finally the firmware upgrade done. We don't know if this was just lucky time or the audio jack did the problem, but I mention it in case I can help anyone.
Now he has a stable Numa Piano with the new patched, not much difference in sound.

Let's get down to the problems now:
The top B key at the is also sounding as top C only at one patch AP sound!
The common problem we both have with the Numas are some notes generating midi full (127) or zero velocity at random times, and some sustained notes which can be eliminated with a panic use.
If I can remenber well, I figured out that my Numa goes like this:
a. When holding down F#4, D5 and A5 keys, I get no midi from Bb5.
b. When holding down F4 and Bb5, I get no midi from A5.
c. When honding down F#4, B4, D5 and A5, for most of the times I get only full 127velocity midi note from Bb5, but not always!
I can test it again if someone want to confirm this in his Numa.

Overall I feel lucky I got the Numa in that price. Don't forget it also has aftertouch!
The touch is really good for pop/rock and hard attacks, but when you need some soft sounds with pp volume and emotional passages, there not going to sound good.
I may consider buying a good Yamaha or Kurzweil with 88 hammer action keys in the future, only for studying and recording at home, but I can't now, there's no money and no more space in my room. Santa forget the elevator... Get me a new ground floor house instead!

P.S. I'm sorry for my bad English.
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My Home Studio Gear: Young Chang E121, Korg SP250, Roland D70, Roland XP30, Roland XV5080, Kurzweil PC2R, Emu Xboard, Studiologic SL161, Behringer FCB1010, RME Fireface UC, Tascam VL-X5.

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#2008754 - 01/03/13 09:54 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: Qbert]
origen Offline
Full Member

Registered: 08/17/12
Posts: 84
Loc: New Hampshire
I got to play one tonight at Guitar Center, I was checking out acoustic guitars and poked around at the dp's before I left and saw one of these (used) and tinkered around with it, it took me all of 4 seconds to realize that this is truly an almost worthless instrument. As a piano/controller you really only need to do 2 things right and thats good action and good midi (forget the onboard sounds they're awful), well I dont know about the midi but the action on this is elementary at best, sure its made of aluminum but who cares when the action is the same as the williams brand $199 piano, the keys were light and bouncy, and had absolutely no quality or "feel" to them, this is the worst keyboard Ive put my hands on that costs above $500, I really would compare it to something that costs about $200-$400, but it was $899 used, what a heap! Sorry about being so negative, but I was debating ordering one a few months ago and was really caught off guard by how epically bad this was. Play before you buy!


Edited by origen (01/03/13 09:56 PM)
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#2019878 - 01/23/13 07:32 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: origen]
thomaswho Offline
Junior Member

Registered: 01/23/13
Posts: 1
Just to add my story: My Numa Piano got the dreaded "sys" in the display window, totally without reason. I did nothing but turn it of one day and on the next. Now it`s completely dead and the software from studiologic doesn`t work. Not really a piano for gigging, then. Can`t trust it.

The importer here in Norway has contacted studiologic for a fix, but I`m not holding my breath. They`ve been having this problem for over a year.

I also had a problem with a vmk-188 some years back... I`ll never buy a Studiologic product again...

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#2097021 - 06/06/13 01:55 PM Re: Studiologic Numa Piano [Re: Qbert]
voxpops Offline
2000 Post Club Member

Registered: 03/20/07
Posts: 2918
Loc: Oregon
Interestingly, Studiologic has removed the software and firmware for the Numa Piano from their support pages. This could possibly mean one of two things: either the standard Numa Piano is about to be discontinued, or they're preparing new software/firmware to allow the pianos from the Concert to be installed (as hinted at earlier in the year). I would think the latter is more likely, as there is little reason to remove the files if the piano is out of production.

I no longer have the Numa, due mainly to the problematic action, so it won't affect me, but I would certainly be curious to check out any revised offering.

At the moment, it's difficult to give the Numa away (see recent eBay sales), and I suspect that as the Casio PX-5S gains traction, there will be even less incentive for players needing lightweight gear to go the Studiologic route - unless any new pianos are really stunning.


Edited by voxpops (06/06/13 01:59 PM)

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